Kormrok Mythic with no Rogues...suggestions?

[Halbrium]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/cWygqYXJ4VNKnbaP

There are our logs so you can see our comp. We have no rogues thus the runes are bit trickier. We tried alternating hunters but they are so slow even with a roar that it felt like we were really pushing it making them do it. Anyone have any better suggestions? Another idea we explored on our last few attempts was just doing it like we do in heroic and pushing them all to the middle (using all the ranged DPS), which seemed to work ok.

Also we were using healing CDs on pound...bad idea since the final phase is supposedly where they are all needed?

[ThePants999]

Yeah, I reckon that without rogues, pushing them to the middle is going to be easier than substituting another class.

Re: healing CDs - the goal is really to kill him before the 5-minute mark, which is when things get crazy. If you're not getting there, I'd focus on trying to change something so that you do - perhaps even dropping a healer - rather than trying to figure out how to save CDs to heal through it. It really is CRAZY at that point.

[Gardiff]

With 4 hunters and that comp, the 4 hunters can take the far runes and any other 2 people can grab the close runes (healers, tank not on boss, melee, other ranged) since the hunters are not really going to lose anything and the boss will end up being tanked close to two runes anyway. Just have your hunters run them in at the spots where they soak their specific spot. They shouldn't really be sitting in the void zone if they soak properly except for maybe 1 second but the disc shield or deterrence can easily cover this. Your disc can shield them each for the first 6 if you really need something or they can deterrence and pop 2 in a row towards the middle. There are lots of ways to handle it. The only thing you DONT DO is panic and run immediately into the next one at 10% health because you have ~12 seconds before they grow big enough to explode.

Honestly we never had a rogue (or one specific person rather) do it even week 1 mythic when we killed it and have always used the push into middle strategy so its completely practical. This should not be the point of any wipes if done right. At maximum you would have to push them in ~13 times. Less if you are smart and push the outer ones into each other before pushing into the middle but some people can't think on the fly and so you can always be safe with pushing them into the middle.

As for healer cooldowns, the big cluster of abilities comes at about ~4:25-5:10. He does empowered waves (assuming you activated waves last) with one early pound and one late pound because of the frenzy sub 30% (but our group has never seen the late pound even on our first kill), empowered hands, and then empowered runes. With the ring and gear now though you shouldn't have to deal with this cluster of abilities but ymmv. You can use cooldowns early on as a result with no real consequence. Even for a first kill with just a rally/devo/htt/slt you probably have more than enough to survive those last abilities letting you use other stuff earlier if you need to (but then again nothing really lines up that is super dangerous early except maybe the 3rd set of hands since it occurs within ~10-15 seconds of pound 3).

But definitely try to address the DPS issues and optimize your ring usage so that you don't have to worry about the late abilities.

Just an fyi - empowered runes #3 happens at ~4:40 if you are doing yellow second. This means you will only ever get two empowered runes and so all your hunters can deterrence once for each with no problems (if needed). The boss is absolutely killable before 4:40. Try to optimize things, perhaps drop a healer, and don't lose anyone before it and you won't have to deal with the cluster of abilities at the end. Some of your pulls indicate you are on track for this. But there is a lot of inconsistency. You have to address the rune soakers to not panic so that they can do their jobs since it isn't hard to do at all.

[Mcbenchpress]

Just don't do the orange pool. Kill him before (or right after) his 3rd leap. Go green first. During the 2nd set of empowered waves after he leaps into purple the room will clear up, giving you much more room to work with.

[Deleted]

You can do the same method with your hunters, we use 1rogue + 2 hunters primarily. But last farm we used Ret + 2 hunters, you just need designated people healing them, ie. Disc Priest + Ret can prolly do both emp runes, while the hunters take the rest with deterrance with 'some' healing.

[Deleted]

If you got no rogues, use Mages and Hunters.

[Halbrium]

Just don't do the orange pool. Kill him before (or right after) his 3rd leap. Go green first. During the 2nd set of empowered waves after he leaps into purple the room will clear up, giving you much more room to work with.

Can you meet the dps req for no orange pool with four healers?

[Deja Thoris]

We just do purple second.

I think people are overly scared of empowered fel outpouring. The only place that gets all 3 overlapping is close to the centre. If you position your raid close to one edge you only have one set of waves at a time. If you don't lose many people killing it before the first set of empowered runes even with 4 healers is very possible.

[Notdev]

We've always had one or zero rogues.. Send Mages/Hunters/Rets. Rogues aren't nearly as important as you'd think for this.

4 mages, 2 hunters, 2 rets. Seems like no problem to me.

[JIMM-]

with high ilvl gear and ring getting upgraded everyweek, u can just skip the explosive rune pool and only do the other 2

[Drish]

We did it in my late night guild as a balance druid and a hunter. Just use 4 healers, the gear now should still beat it before you hit the chaos at the end.

Alternatively do purple second, i've seen a bunch of guilds do it that way. If someone messes up that empowerment they die, instead of the whole raid dying. Doing purple second the pound doesn't start until the waves are pretty much past instead of while they're still flanking you, so its much easier to survive as well. You'll have to survive triple waves twice, but it doesn't intersect with any other ability.



TLDR use 4 healers and anyone with a sprint can do it, or do purple second instead of orange.

[Sxq]

Paladins can actually do it pretty easily with speed of light and damage immunity.

[apples]

glad wars, pop SW and demo and get 3-5 runes all in a row

[shaunika123]

on our first kill i was the only rogue around, and i didnt go out of my way to get rid of the runes
hunters and mages are the best at it

but what we did was just basically everyone got one and pushed them to the middle (with hunters and mages getting the leftovers/ones in the puddle stuff) so we dealt with it efficiently.
rogues are far from a necessity

wait till you get to mythic xhul'horac you'll need rogues for that shit way more than for kormrok.

[Summer]

wait till you get to mythic xhul'horac you'll need rogues for that shit way more than for kormrok.

What for? We killed it without any rogues and didn't really miss them, BH soaking is no issue, lots of classes can do it and if not then you just put 2-3 people in one? What you really want there is DK's :P

As for Kormrok runes I've done it as a mage, it's fine even without any speed boosts. Looks a bit scary but works just fine. Either way the dps check is pretty nonexistent with the ring so do them any which way you want and you'll be fine.

[Skagasm]

I'd definitely argue for doing the pools: Green, Purple, Orange. You should have plenty of DPS to beat the first set of Empowered Explosive Runes.

Dealing with purple's Empowered Fel Outpouring is generally more of an inconvenience than a real threat as long as DPS doesn't tunnel too hard, and the Swat tank mechanic is trivialized with tank CDs that don't have much use throughout the rest of the fight.

We do 3-heal it, but it looks like your healers are fighting for scraps anyways. Also, it wasn't uncommon for us to be converting a Resto Shaman/Druid, who barely knew what they were doing, into a DPS on our initial kills.

Aside: Your druids seem to have some allergy to Lifebloom with only 30-50% uptime; it should be 90%+ on nearly every fight. Also, one of those Druids has only 60% uptime on Harmony which should also be as close to 100% as possible.

[Locknrollen]

Since when do you even want rogues to do it?
We used 2 hunters and if you stood Close to a rune with full hp, you triggered it, which ever class you played

[Deleted]

Since people discovered feint? So... always?

[Locknrollen]

well back when i did the fight, damage was all that mattered. healing and mechanics wasnt a problem.
And how do you gain the most damage? by not sending your rogues out to do that.

[Zelendria]

We stopped doing Orange when we lost our 2 Rogues. TBH I think we only did Green/Orange twice, and ever since then we do Green/Purple.

If your raid dodges fel outpouring properly it's actually a lot easier to deal with the purple pool than orange.
If your raid doesn't dodge purple it is going to be a nightmare. It's easy to check just see how much damage people are taking from Shadow Globules. If that is high you probably won't want to go with all 3 waves.