View Poll Results: Do you want Shadowstep back?

Voters
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  • Yes, I want Shadowstep in it's current form.

    387 49.24%
  • No, I would like Shadowstep baked into Shadowstrike.

    132 16.79%
  • I don't really have strong feelings either way.

    267 33.97%
  1. #6281
    Quote Originally Posted by Shenjin View Post
    And shuriken was added next to bs and ss to trigger gestures.
    really?
    was it just updated on the PTR, or is there a post of it somewhere?

    btw if it works on shurriken storm, then it most definitely is a dps upgrade in aoe :P

  2. #6282
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    really?
    was it just updated on the PTR, or is there a post of it somewhere?

    btw if it works on shurriken storm, then it most definitely is a dps upgrade in aoe :P
    Sry I ment that as a part of the "IF" statement.
    That it would help on AOE, as its already skewed towards funneling more damage into a primary target.

    "If the proccing eviscerate doesnt consume buff from shuriken it would help a bit i guess?
    And IF shuriken was added next to bs and ss to trigger gestures."

  3. #6283
    Quote Originally Posted by Shenjin View Post
    Sry I ment that as a part of the "IF" statement.
    That it would help on AOE, as its already skewed towards funneling more damage into a primary target.

    "If the proccing eviscerate doesnt consume buff from shuriken it would help a bit i guess?
    And IF shuriken was added next to bs and ss to trigger gestures."
    How dare you wake our hope to then crush it under your boot.

  4. #6284
    Just got back to playing sub after spending the last few months as sin, so hopefully this isnt a stupid question. I noticed that both icy veins and ravenholdt both recommend nightstalker over subterfuge. But i also noticed the tool tips they linked say that NS gives a 50% buff from stealth. My tooltip says its only a 12% buff. So it seems to me that while NS would indeed be better if it gave that 50% buff (like it does for sin), but with only a 12% buff then it's pretty weak, and subterfuge would be the better choice.

    Any clarification on this would be appreciated.

  5. #6285
    I don't understand the whining about the T21 4p bonus.
    I kind of like it better this way than before, the previous 10% flat proc was aweful for 2 reasons:
    - first 10% is VERY low (lower than the poison bomb proc chance in sin)
    - second the possibility of back to back to back procs at the right moment (during dance) would have been absolutely broken
    Why would anyone be glad of even more rng?

    The new 4p is much better, given you need 4-5 backstabs to go up to 6 cp you now have a 20-25% chance to proc which is much better than 10%.
    And don't forget that those procs snowball into more shadow dances.

    I do agree that the 4p is garbage for multi targets fights though.

  6. #6286
    Winq u correct in that ist good with BS etc. What you totaly missing is that there is fights where you basicly dont use BS and al your combopoints come from suriken storm. In most myt+ aswell we ont have any real value from the t21 4 set unless some bosses. In any fight with more than 2 targets t21 is basicly 0 dmg.

    A setbonus who benefit both the st fights and multitargets are alot more usefull. Atm its untill ilvl beats it, alot better to use t20 2 set + 21 2 set.

    Its a horrible horrible setbonus who only affect a few fights and give nothing or close to nothing in others.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Blayke. have a look at

    Guides:
    Riff's Guide: : http://www.ravenholdt.net/subtlety-guide/
    Fuu's Guide: https://leovdw.github.io/SubtleGuide/

    answer most questions you have as new subi rugieeee
    Last edited by osicat; 2017-10-04 at 07:21 AM.

  7. #6287
    Quote Originally Posted by osicat View Post
    Blayke. have a look at

    Guides:
    Riff's Guide: : http://www.ravenholdt.net/subtlety-guide/
    Fuu's Guide: https://leovdw.github.io/SubtleGuide/

    answer most questions you have as new subi rugieeee
    Thank you for those. I was already familiar with ravenholdt, though the other one was new to me. But I'm still having the same problem: they both recommend Nighstalker, while linking a tooltip which states that it causes abilities to do 50% more damage (which I'm assuming is coming from Wowhead). But in game my tooltip is saying 12% damage.

    So which is correct? I'm more inclined to believe my in game ui, but I also know that sometimes tooltips in game can be wrong for various reasons.

    A 50% damage bonus (which is what it is with sin, btw) makes the talent worth taking. A 12% bonus makes it kinda meh. So again, some clarification would be very helpful here. Thank again and cheers!

    PS: got off my lazy ass and tried this out on the dummy. Oddly, the increase from nightstalker worked out to be around 17-18% consistently. More than 12, but certainly not 50.
    Last edited by Blayke; 2017-10-05 at 06:01 PM.

  8. #6288
    Quote Originally Posted by Blayke View Post
    Thank you for those. I was already familiar with ravenholdt, though the other one was new to me. But I'm still having the same problem: they both recommend Nighstalker, while linking a tooltip which states that it causes abilities to do 50% more damage (which I'm assuming is coming from Wowhead). But in game my tooltip is saying 12% damage.

    So which is correct? I'm more inclined to believe my in game ui, but I also know that sometimes tooltips in game can be wrong for various reasons.

    A 50% damage bonus (which is what it is with sin, btw) makes the talent worth taking. A 12% bonus makes it kinda meh. So again, some clarification would be very helpful here. Thank again and cheers!

    PS: got off my lazy ass and tried this out on the dummy. Oddly, the increase from nightstalker worked out to be around 17-18% consistently. More than 12, but certainly not 50.
    Pretty sure it's been 12% for Sub for ages now. Think it happened when they actually added Shadow Dance to be modified as well. It's absolutely not meh when you add in Master of Subtlety, Dark Shadows and a big DfA. Also noting that because it mods ShD the frequency of use is way higher than Assassination (where it's only used after a vanish).

  9. #6289
    ^

    As Jaro say, Its the stacking of % buffs who give sub some kind of scaling and big pew when we can surikenstorm for another % buff on evis. HAving 18m crits with DFA on normal fights with adds atm when Alc trinket proc in start

  10. #6290
    High Overlord riphie's Avatar
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    Nightstalker bonus is different per spec, the tooltips are just the normal tooltips without the spec difference.

    Nightstalker _is_ the go to talent if playing DfA.

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