[BETA] Destruction Warlock Discussion

[Baconeggcheese]

Considering the staffs lore had it opening portals that let demons flood through my kneejerk would be that, but that sounds awfully like something they should give demo so iono.

I'm kinda curious why devourer of life is on there, just seems out of place since its not a spell destruction should be using much if at all.

Eh anyway destructions looking good to me so far. Keeping that jack of all trades and smoothing out the RNG on our mastery is nice.

[gez]

Considering the staffs lore had it opening portals that let demons flood through my kneejerk would be that, but that sounds awfully like something they should give demo so iono.

I'm kinda curious why devourer of life is on there, just seems out of place since its not a spell destruction should be using much if at all.

Eh anyway destructions looking good to me so far. Keeping that jack of all trades and smoothing out the RNG on our mastery is nice.

i dont want to cast drain life, we move from that long ago.. remplace those talents with the old souleach that make us heal fro mspells

[Gaidax]

Well to be honest, Drain Life is pretty powerful. I was a bit disturbed with all the nerfs to survivability, but with Drain Life back - we'd be okay. With 70% boost it will heal for around 30% over 6s, modified by Backdraft. In raids it means you are almost immortal, unless you get oneshot, if you use it well.

[Yorindesarin]

Well to be honest, Drain Life is pretty powerful. I was a bit disturbed with all the nerfs to survivability, but with Drain Life back - we'd be okay. With 70% boost it will heal for around 30% over 6s, modified by Backdraft. In raids it means you are almost immortal, unless you get oneshot, if you use it well.

See to me... This just seems somewhat... silly? I don't see mages requiring a spell that is a channel no less as a requirement to replace their survivability... Nor hunters or spriests... So why do warlocks now get stuck with this choice...? What was honestly wrong with our survivability to begin with... :/

[Slashkill]

I'd imagine the point of Shadowburn is to be exactly as it is now. Primarily a ember generator through sniping dying adds. I'd imagine that the damage on the ability will be less than half of Chaos Bolt so it's not used over Chaos Bolt, but is instead used solely for that purpose.

This, coupled with Lord of Fire artifact talent (also the mysterious portals we will rip in time and space) is what hypes me a lot in Destro spec. I'm mostly all about flavour when it comes to WoW, and I've been waiting for WCIII Rain of Fire for waaaay too long.

However, demo looks a lot smoother to me tbh.

[Gaidax]

See to me... This just seems somewhat... silly? I don't see mages requiring a spell that is a channel no less as a requirement to replace their survivability... Nor hunters or spriests... So why do warlocks now get stuck with this choice...? What was honestly wrong with our survivability to begin with... :/

Well, Destruction now does have way too much survivability in raids, I mean honestly - we're running around with almost 700k HP self-buffed that is even before the cooldown and shield passive. We can passively trivialize Mythic mechanics with how we are now, so it definitely had to go.

In Legion we are quite a bit more fragile, maybe too much even after the whole ranged tank thing we have now. It's about time we actually do something for our survivability instead of just having it for no reason.

[Deleted]

See to me... This just seems somewhat... silly? I don't see mages requiring a spell that is a channel no less as a requirement to replace their survivability... Nor hunters or spriests... So why do warlocks now get stuck with this choice...? What was honestly wrong with our survivability to begin with... :/

Arcane mages become invulnerable while channeling evocation dealing at the end massive damage aoe related to how much mana they were able to restore

[Yorindesarin]

Well, Destruction now does have way too much survivability in raids, I mean honestly - we're running around with almost 700k HP self-buffed that is even before the cooldown and shield passive. We can passively trivialize Mythic mechanics with how we are now, so it definitely had to go.

In Legion we are quite a bit more fragile, maybe too much even after the whole ranged tank thing we have now. It's about time we actually do something for our survivability instead of just having it for no reason.

Yeah but theres doing things like pressing one button. Then theres channeling a healing drain... for what I'd imagine could probably be a pretty big DPS loss? And the whole health thing is blizzards terrible attempt at the big number squish... If they had done it properly it would stay at a consistent level and not become this over and over again.... I'm at 600k odd health in my 635 ilvl gear... so its not like you get that much health just by being a warlock... What was wrong with ember tap... Just change it to be relevant to soul shards easy fix and undo the stupid nerf they gave it... Like fair enough glyph of unending resolve has made us tanky as... and the gear scaling basically only effecting our DPS and not our health has left us back at MoP standards again... (because blizzard like curves that equate to straight line gradients apparently?)

Arcane mages become invulnerable while channeling evocation dealing at the end massive damage aoe related to how much mana they were able to restore

manas a bit more different to health... though?

[Gaidax]

Yeah but theres doing things like pressing one button. Then theres channeling a healing drain... for what I'd imagine could probably be a pretty big DPS loss? And the whole health thing is blizzards terrible attempt at the big number squish... If they had done it properly it would stay at a consistent level and not become this over and over again.... I'm at 600k odd health in my 635 ilvl gear... so its not like you get that much health just by being a warlock... What was wrong with ember tap... Just change it to be relevant to soul shards easy fix and undo the stupid nerf they gave it... Like fair enough glyph of unending resolve has made us tanky as... and the gear scaling basically only effecting our DPS and not our health has left us back at MoP standards again... (because blizzard like curves that equate to straight line gradients apparently?)

Firstly of course we get tons of health now just because we are warlocks 30% more to be exact from 20% Soul Link Sac and 10% well for being Warlock. I am at 663k HP selfbuffed with ilvl 736. Other classes mostly scratch 500k, that's a big difference.

In any case, the point with Drain Life that you are missing is that it is a no-CD, on-demand survivability boost. So it is unique, but not only in a bad way. Mages, Hunters and Spriests can't spam their defenses, we will be able to. It is a DPS loss, yes, but so is Ice Block, Dispersion and Deterrence.

It is damn powerful 30% heal over 6 seconds modified by haste, in our case it will often be as short as 30% heal over 3.x seconds and that is pretty psychotic survivability boost there and it has no cooldown. Don't underestimate it.

[gez]

i hate drainlife im pretty sure sargeras doesnt heal from drainlife, im pretty sure he probably wipe some one from the universe and take his life essence

[Yorindesarin]

It is damn powerful 30% heal over 6 seconds modified by haste, in our case it will often be as short as 30% heal over 3.x seconds and that is pretty psychotic survivability boost there and it has no cooldown. Don't underestimate it.

I'm not exactly under estimating it. My concerns lie mostly with the fact unless its castable on the move it's possible you may begin channeling and not get a tick due to having to move there for having wasted not only a GCD but also not gained any survivability from it? I mean yeah its great it has no CD... But... Neither did ember tap... They wanted specs to feel "unique" so all 3 warlock specs now have drain soul, soul shards...? Man this is sooooo unique. (Obviously soul shards work differently for each spec... but... you get the idea I guess)

[Deleted]

Well, Destruction now does have way too much survivability in raids, I mean honestly - we're running around with almost 700k HP self-buffed that is even before the cooldown and shield passive. We can passively trivialize Mythic mechanics with how we are now, so it definitely had to go.

In Legion we are quite a bit more fragile, maybe too much even after the whole ranged tank thing we have now. It's about time we actually do something for our survivability instead of just having it for no reason.

lso remember gaidax, the destro artifact also have a talent that lets you get fully healed when using your demonic gateway which will give you a full heal about every 90 secs which is quite insane.

[Gaidax]

lso remember gaidax, the destro artifact also have a talent that lets you get fully healed when using your demonic gateway which will give you a full heal about every 90 secs which is quite insane.

It's highly situational, really. It will be a waste most of the time, because we use gateway to reposition before shit hits the fan, not after, especially more important now that Demonic Circle is an optional talent.

[Soulzar]

i hate drainlife im pretty sure sargeras doesnt heal from drainlife, im pretty sure he probably wipe some one from the universe and take his life essence

Soul Shard Tap didn't have the same ring to it, so plan B

I'm not exactly under estimating it. My concerns lie mostly with the fact unless its castable on the move it's possible you may begin channeling and not get a tick due to having to move there for having wasted not only a GCD but also not gained any survivability from it? I mean yeah its great it has no CD... But... Neither did ember tap... They wanted specs to feel "unique" so all 3 warlock specs now have drain soul, soul shards...? Man this is sooooo unique. (Obviously soul shards work differently for each spec... but... you get the idea I guess)

I don't like this mindset. if You are at 10% HP, do you give a shit about your sustained DPS? I hope not. A lot of locks don't even have Ember Tap bound because it's a dps loss... Its a solid Defensive with no cooldown that still does dmg.

lso remember gaidax, the destro artifact also have a talent that lets you get fully healed when using your demonic gateway which will give you a full heal about every 90 secs which is quite insane.

That really sounds useless for PVE, more pvp friendly. Gateways are used for mechanics that involve movement, not ones that involve incoming dmg.

[Deleted]

either way, its like getting lay on hands with a 90 sec cd which is always useful in a pinch but yeah drain life is prolly going to be the prefered "oh-shit" button when you need to heal shit but its really too early to tell whether the full heal from gateway usage is good or not, but it certainly have the potential to be very very good.

[Yorindesarin]

I don't like this mindset. if You are at 10% HP, do you give a shit about your sustained DPS? I hope not. A lot of locks don't even have Ember Tap bound because it's a dps loss... Its a solid Defensive with no cooldown that still does dmg.

Well the mindset is "Oh shit heres some AoE thing I'm at 10% health just started channeling drain life... do I move or do I risk dying". The answer is to move. And what happens if you get tapped by some splash damage from elsewhere/etc? I don't care for DPS. But what I do care for is bad gameplay ideas. This being one of them for destro. ESPECIALLY after drain life "fits affliction so well" meaning... It shouldnt really fit destro/demo now should it..? Maybe it's just me. But if I'm at 10% health I'd happily sacrifice a shard/ember for health (infact Ive done so a few times when my healers are struggling with ember tap) regardless of DPS loss.

If its either dodge shit and die. Or channel shit and die (more likely) Or use an instant slightly less strong heal (say 15%~ or whatever) and move. I know which I'd choose any day of the week.

[Gaidax]

Well the mindset is "Oh shit heres some AoE thing I'm at 10% health just started channeling drain life... do I move or do I risk dying". The answer is to move. And what happens if you get tapped by some splash damage from elsewhere/etc? I don't care for DPS. But what I do care for is bad gameplay ideas. This being one of them for destro. ESPECIALLY after drain life "fits affliction so well" meaning... It shouldnt really fit destro/demo now should it..? Maybe it's just me. But if I'm at 10% health I'd happily sacrifice a shard/ember for health (infact Ive done so a few times when my healers are struggling with ember tap) regardless of DPS loss.

If its either dodge shit and die. Or channel shit and die (more likely) Or use an instant slightly less strong heal (say 15%~ or whatever) and move. I know which I'd choose any day of the week.

This is not true, actually. Need to use brain to take a correct decision, when I was doing Highmaul as Demo, I used to have Harvest Life and Drain Life glyph which made it heal exactly for the same amount as Destro will have in Legion.

Case in point is that healing you got from Drain Life actually completely nullified P1 and P3 Force Nova, so instead of running through and still taking damage - you could just Drain Life and actually completely outheal it while still doing damage.

That is just one case and that is why I know full well what Drain Life can do and with Artifact we will be getting the very same boosted Drain Life I was using to cheese mechanics in Highmaul. As a matter of fact - it will be even better due to Backdraft.

This spell will give you another powerful (and often better) alternative to running away in many cases and it's good to have. Of course you won't be channeling it when you are at 10%, but you know what? Maybe don't get to 10% to begin with?

[Netherspark]

I for one am glad we're getting Drain Life back, as well as Soul Shards. Destruction had drifted too far from what a Warlock is supposed to be.

[Deleted]

This is not true, actually. Need to use brain to take a correct decision, when I was doing Highmaul as Demo, I used to have Harvest Life and Drain Life glyph which made it heal exactly for the same amount as Destro will have in Legion.

Case in point is that healing you got from Drain Life actually completely nullified P1 and P3 Force Nova, so instead of running through and still taking damage - you could just Drain Life and actually completely outheal it while still doing damage.

That is just one case and that is why I know full well what Drain Life can do and with Artifact we will be getting the very same boosted Drain Life I was using to cheese mechanics in Highmaul. As a matter of fact - it will be even better due to Backdraft.

This spell will give you another powerful (and often better) alternative to running away in many cases and it's good to have. Of course you won't be channeling it when you are at 10%, but you know what? Maybe don't get to 10% to begin with?

unless ive missed something, backdraft doesnt affect drain life, it only affects incinerate and chaos bolt atleast that is what it says backdraft does in the conflag description.

[Gaidax]

unless ive missed something, backdraft doesnt affect drain life, it only affects incinerate and chaos bolt atleast that is what it says backdraft does in the conflag description.

You are right, this sucks... oh well guess back to just powerful Drain Life and not ridiculously powerful one I hoped for.