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    [Legion] Discipline Priest Discussion

    A thread here to discuss anything related to Discipline Priests in Legion, this includes anything regarding blizzcon, the recent blogs, upcoming beta and any new info that comes out.
    Below you can find all of the information released specifically related to Discipline Priests. If you find new info please post it here too!

    Blizzcon info-
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    • Disc Priest - were a different flavor of Holy, but not good enough. Atonement is now core healing mechanic, now heal by dealing damage to enemies.
    • The new Atonement mechanic is very different than the older ones. It is a mix of using damage and healing abilities to mark allies with a buff as you heal them and then heal those people as you damage enemies with Atonement spells, so you have to weave both together at all times.
    • Discipline may be one of the more complex healers.
    • Disc priest's endless PW:S spam had to go! It was bad for them and bad for everyone.
    • Both Shadow and Discipline will have Shadowmend.

    Priest blog - http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/blog/199...est-09-11-2015
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Priests have a strong identity as spiritual practitioners who harness divine power to inspire and protect allies, heal the injured, and cure the ailed. But while this clearly holds true for Holy Priests, these ideas are less fundamental to Discipline Priests—and the ideals and beliefs of Shadow Priests are antithetical to those of Holy Priests.

    Despite these differences, Priests of any spec share one key thing in common: unwavering faith in something from which they draw great power. What delineates specializations is the source of that power. In Legion, we’re going to explore that dichotomy in greater depth than ever through the gameplay for each specialization.



    Discipline
    Some priests pride themselves on pragmatism. They understand that light casts a shadow, that darkness is defined by light, and that true discipline stems from one’s ability to balance these opposing powers in services of a greater cause. While these priests possess many holy virtues to aid their allies, they also dabble in the dark arts to debilitate their enemies—always exercising immense discipline to keep themselves away from the brink of insanity. Many would say the ends justify the means; scriptures both virtuous and vile should be studied and understood to protect the congregation.

    "True discipline stems from one’s ability to balance opposing powers in services of a greater cause"

    Gameplay
    The power of absorption mechanics has created a gameplay issue for healers that we’re looking to address in Legion. Discipline Priests have been so effective in their role of preventing damage that it has sometimes left other healers yearning for an opportune time to throw out a clutch heal. To alleviate that issue, we’re tempering Discipline’s emphasis on shields in lieu of a reimaged Atonement mechanic.

    Discipline Priests are now more clearly defined by their use of both Holy and Shadow magic, and that extends to how they function in combat. Sacrificing a portion of healing ability and having a reduced focus on absorption spells, they gain a significant contribution in damage. Still filling a healer role in group content, they aim to strike a balance between healing allies and damaging enemies in a unique gameplay style. Discipline Priests have strong cooldowns with Power Word: Barrier and Pain Suppression, along with Rapture, a new cooldown that temporarily removes the cooldown of Power Word: Shield.

    Here’s a basic look at the core defensive and offensive combat abilities for Discipline Priests:

    • Atonement
    • Passive
    • Plea, Power Word: Shield, and Shadow Mend also apply Atonement to your target for 15 sec.
    • When you deal spell damage, you instantly heal all targets affected by Atonement for 50% of the damage done.
    • Developer comment: Healing is not split between Atonements—the more allies you have Atonement on, the more total healing that a damage spell will cause.
    • Mastery: Absolution
    • Increases the healing transferred through Atonement by 28% (with Mastery from typical gear).
    • Defensive
    • Plea
    • 1.2% Mana, 40 yd range, Instant
    • A quick, efficient plea to heal an ally for a minor amount.
    • Shadow Mend
    • 3.0% Mana, 40 yd range, 1.5 sec cast
    • Wrap an ally in shadows which heal them for a large amount, but at a price.
    • The ally will take minor damage every 1 sec, until they have taken half that amount of total damage from all sources, or leave combat.
    • Power Word: Shield
    • 3.5% Mana, 40 yd range, Instant, 6 sec cooldown
    • Shield an ally, absorbing a large amount of damage. Lasts 15 sec.
    • While the shield holds, spellcasting will not be delayed by damage.
    • Power Word: Radiance
    • 7.0% Mana, 40 yd range, 2.5 sec cast
    • A burst of light heals a friendly target and their 5 nearest allies for a moderate amount, and applies Atonement for 50% of its normal duration.
    • Offensive
    • Smite
    • 0.75% Mana, 40 yd range, 1.5 sec cast
    • Smite an enemy for moderate Holy damage.
    • Mind Blast
    • 3.0% Mana, 40 yd range, 1.5 sec cast
    • Blast the target’s mind for strong Shadow damage.
    • Penance
    • 2.5% Mana, 40 yd range, Channeled, 9 sec cooldown
    • Launches a volley of holy light at the target, causing huge Holy damage over 2 sec.
    • Channelable while moving.
    • Revelation
    • Passive
    • Your Smite and Mind Blast casts have a 30% chance to reset the cooldown on Penance.
    • Shadow Word: Pain
    • 2.0% Mana, 40 yd range, Instant
    • A word of darkness that causes minor Shadow damage instantly, and an additional huge amount of Shadow damage over 18 sec.

    Additionally, to give you an idea of how some talents may build upon this, here’s an example of one of their Discipline-specific talents:
    • Grace
    • Passive
    • Increases your non-Atonement healing and absorption by 30% on targets with Atonement.

    Here we have further updates from twitter-
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    The current plan is to remove Weakened Soul. (WarcraftDevs)

    Disc's 70/30 - how will healing be competitive without damage being significant. Guaranteed Disc raid spot still exists?
    Those were just off-the-cuff examples. Goal is that they provide respectable damage and healing, and we'll iterate as necessary. (WarcraftDevs)

    is atonement a buff that gets renewed or extended? for example, casting plea 2x in a row on same target = 15 sec or 30?
    It gets renewed. We're considering having it behave similar to DoT effects, which have some leeway on when you refresh. (WarcraftDevs)

    In Legion, will Shadow Mend overhealing still trigger the DoT? Basically, is it possible for it to be a net loss?
    Nope! Only the effective healing will turn into a DoT. (WarcraftDevs)

    will solo healing 5-mans be inherently more difficult for discipline due to the changes in legion?
    We'll be making sure that Discipline is still able to heal dungeons comfortably. (WarcraftDevs)

    how long is the atonement buff supposed to be?
    Currently 15 seconds, with a talent available to extend that to 20 seconds. (WarcraftDevs)

    Bit of conflicting info. Darkmoon Faire Q&A made it sound like Disc. was losing PW:S, blog shows it as a spell. Is it staying?
    Discipline still has Power Word: Shield, but it will have a 6-second cooldown, to reduce spamminess. (WarcraftDevs)

    there is no mention of Divine Aegis in the priest blog, is it going to be gone?
    Yes. The number of absorbs (especially passive ones, such as Divine Aegis and Illuminated Healing) is being heavily reduced. (WarcraftDevs)

    So @WarcraftDevs how viable will leveling as Discipline be in Legion? I love Disc and don't want to go away from it to even level.
    The goal is for healing specs to be fully viable for solo questing outdoors. (WarcraftDevs)

    Talents will offer some potential alterations to Penance.(WarcraftDevs)

    It just seems weird that DIsc, which was never really about DPS healing, has pivoted to it, while MW, which was, is cutting it.
    That's definitely fair. There are many reasons, but a big one is that Priests have another spec if you don't like DPS->Heal.(WarcraftDevs)

    Discipline - Light's Wrath- A link to official Priest artifacts page - http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/blog/19942704/

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Discipline - Light's Wrath
    Obsessed with cleansing undead from the world of Azeroth, the fanatical Scarlet Crusade tried to create a second Ashbringer in the form of a staff. However, a dreadlord who had infiltrated the order intervened, interrupting their efforts and triggering a violent magical explosion. The damaged staff’s power proved nearly uncontrollable. After several wielders tried and failed to use the staff safely, the elite magi of the Kirin Tor hid it away lest it unleash further deadly calamities.


    More images shared from Blizzcon-


    Artifact Calculator - http://beta.wowdb.com/artifact-calculator#VAAAAAAAA

    - - - Updated - - -
    Datamined Info

    Build 20773
    Originally Posted by MMO-Champion
    Priest (Forums, Talent Calculator)
    • Dominate Mind Controls a mind up to level 4 41 for 30 sec. Does not work versus Mechanical beings. or players. This spell shares diminishing returns with other incapacitating disorienting effects. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 45 Talent. 0.5% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. 30 sec cast (Channeled).

    Talents
    • Dominant Mind (New) You may also control your own character while Dominate Mind is active. Priest - LvL 45 Talent.
    • Mind Bomb (New) Unleashes a psychic explosion, stunning all enemies within 0 yds of the target for 3 sec. Replaces Psychic Scream. Priest - LvL 45 Talent. 30 yd range. 1.5 sec cast. 30 sec cooldown.
    • Mind Spike Blasts the target for 1 Shadowfrost damage and increases the damage done by your next Mind Blast within 15 sec by 50%, stacking up to 5 times. Generates 5 Insanity. Replaces Mind Flay. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Mindbender (Shadow) Caster receives 2 5 Insanity when the Mindbender attacks.
    • Purge the Wicked Cleanse the target with fire, causing [*150% of Spell Power*] Fire damage and an additional [*65% of Spell Power*] Fire damage over until cancelled 20 sec. Spreads to an additional nearby enemy when you cast Penance on the target. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. 2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 10 sec cooldown.
    • Shadow Crash (New) Hurl a bolt of slow-moving Shadow energy at the destination, dealing [*200% of Spell Power*] damage to all targets within 8 yards. Generates 15 Insanity. Priest - LvL 90 Talent. 40 yd range. Instant. 30 sec cooldown.
    • Surrender to Madness Surrender to the Old Gods, sacrificing your soul for ultimate power. All your Insanity-generating abilities generate 300% more Insanity, until you exit Voidform, and then you die. Requires Voidform. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. Instant. 10 min cooldown.
    • Void Ray (New) Each time your Mind Flay deals damage, you gain 10% increased Mind Flay damage for 3 sec, stacking up to 6 times. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.




    Build 20740
    Originally Posted by MMO-Champion
    Priest (Forums, Talent Calculator)
    • Fade Fade out, temporarily removing all your threat for 10 sec. Can be cast in Shadowform. 3.5% of Base Mana. Instant. 30 sec cooldown. and reducing all damage taken by 10% for 10 sec. Instant. 30 sec cooldown.
    • Halo Creates a ring of Holy energy around you that quickly expands and grows in power, up to 30 yds away. Heals allies for up to to a 30 yd radius, healing allies for [*1 + 287.4% of Spell Power*], with the greatest effect at 25 yds. 100 yd range. Instant. 100 yd range. Instant.
    • Mysticism Increases your Intellect by 5%. Requires Cloth. Passive. Passive.
    • Naaru Lightshift (New) Saa'ra teleports the caster to the Netherlight Temple. Casting Lightshift while in Netherlight Temple will return the Priest back to near their departure point. 0.1% of Base Mana. 10 sec cast. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Penance Launches a volley of holy light at the target, causing [*3 + 360% 600% of Spell Power*] Holy damage to an enemy or [*792% of Spell Power*] healing to an ally over 2 sec. 40 yd range. Instant. over 2 sec. Channelable while moving. 40 yd range. Instant.
    • Penance Launches a volley of holy light at the target, causing [*3 + 360% 600% of Spell Power*] Holy damage to an enemy or [*792% of Spell Power*] healing to an ally over 2 sec. 40 yd range. Instant. over 2 sec. Channelable while moving. 40 yd range. Instant.
    • Prayer of Mending Discipline, Holy: Places a spell on a party or raid member that heals them for [*2 * Percent Health + 104% of Spell Power * Percent Health*] the next time they take damage. When the heal occurs, Prayer of Mending jumps to a party or raid member within 20 yards. Jumps up to 5 times and lasts 30 sec after each jump. Shadow: Places a spell on a party or raid member that heals them for [*Percent Health + 67% of Spell Power * Percent Health*] the next time they take damage. When the heal occurs, Prayer of Mending jumps to a another party or raid member within 20 yards yds. Jumps up to 5 times and lasts 30 sec after each jump. Unlimited range. Instant.
    • Smite Smite an enemy for [*92.45% [*160% of Spell Power*] Holy damage. Can't be cast in Shadowform. 1.5% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. 1.5 sec cast. 1% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2 sec cast.

    Talents
    • Angelic Feather Place a feather at the target location, granting the first ally to walk through it 60% increased movement speed for 6 sec. Max 3 charges. Only 3 feathers can be placed at one time. 3 Max Charges. Priest - LvL 30 Talent. 40 yd range. Instant. 10 sec recharge. 3 Max Charges.
    • Apotheosis (New) Enter a pure Holy form for 30 sec, increasing the effects of Serendipity by 200%. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. Instant. 3 min cooldown.
    • Auspicious Spirits Your Shadowy Apparitions now deal 100% increased damage and grant you 1 Shadow Orb. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. Priest - LvL 75 Talent.
    • Benediction (New) Your Prayer of Mending has a 30% chance to leave a Renew on each target it heals. Priest - LvL 100 Talent.
    • Binding Heal Heals a friendly target and the caster for [*133% of Spell Power* the caster, and a third friendly target within 20 yards for [*1 + 200% of Spell Power*]. Triggers Serendipity, reducing the cooldown of both Holy Word: Serenity and Holy Word: Sanctify by a reduced amount;]. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Holy Spec. 2.15% LvL 75 Talent. 3% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Castigation (New) Penance fires one additional bolt of holy light over its duration. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Censure (New) Holy Word: Chastise stuns the target instead of incapacitating them. Priest - LvL 45 Talent.
    • Circle of Healing (New) Heals up to 5 injured allies within 30 yards of the target for [*300% of Spell Power*]. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. 5% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast. 12 sec cooldown.
    • Clarity of Will Discipline: Shields the target with a protective ward, absorbing [*967.8% of Spell Power or 858% of Spell Power*] damage within 20 sec. Holy, Shadow: Shields the target with a protective ward, absorbing [*660% [*800% of Spell Power*] damage within 20 sec. Priest - LvL 100 90 Talent. 3.15% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast.
    • Contrition (New) Your Atonement duration is increased by 5 sec. Priest - LvL 75 Talent.
    • Dark Visions (New) Shadow Word: Pain and Vampiric Touch deal 20% more damage if cast while you have more than 50% Insanity. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.
    • Desperate Prayer Heals the caster for [*22% of Total Health*]. Can be cast in Shadowform. Can't be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Priest - LvL 15 30 Talent. Instant. 2 min cooldown.
    • Divinity (New) When you heal with a Holy Word spell, your healing is increased by 20% for 8 sec. Priest - LvL 90 Talent.
    • Dominate Mind Controls a mind up to level 4 for 30 sec. Does not work versus Mechanical beings. This spell shares diminishing returns with other incapacitating effects. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 60 45 Talent. 0.5% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. 30 sec cast (Channeled).
    • Enduring Renewal (New) Your single-target healing spells refresh the duration of your Renew on the target. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Enlightenment (New) Your regenerate mana 20% faster. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Fortress of the Mind (New) Mind Flay and Mind Blast deal 10% more damage and generate 20% more Insanity. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Grace (New) Increases your non-Atonement healing and absorption by 30% on targets with Atonement. Priest - LvL 100 Talent.
    • Guardian Angel (New) When Guardian Spirit expires without saving the target from death, reset its cooldown to 60 seconds. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.
    • Halo Creates a ring of Holy energy around you that quickly expands and grows in power, up to 30 yds away. Heals allies for up to [*1 + 287.4% of Spell Power*], with the greatest effect at 25 yds to a 30 yd radius, healing allies for [*1 + 287.4% of Spell Power*. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Priest - LvL 90 Talent. 3.6% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. 1.5 sec cast. 40 sec cooldown.
    • Hymn of Hope (New) Recite a hymn allowing all healers in your party or raid within 40 yards to cast spells for no mana. Lasts 12 sec. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 60 Talent. 40 yd range. 12 sec cast (Channeled). 5 min cooldown.
    • Legacy of the Void (New) Casting Mind Blast increases the effect of your next Shadow Word by 50% for 30 sec, stacking up to 2 times. Priest - LvL 100 Talent.
    • Light of the Naaru (New) Serendipity reduces the cooldown of the appropriate Holy Word by an additional 2 sec. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.
    • Mania (New) You move 1% faster for every 5 Insanity you have. Priest - LvL 30 Talent.
    • Masochism (New) When you cast Shadow Mend on yourself, it deals no damage. Priest - LvL 30 Talent.
    • Mind Spike Blasts the target for 1 Shadowfrost damage, but extinguishes your damage over time effects on the target. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Shadow Spec. 0.125% of Base Mana and increases the damage done by your next Mind Blast within 15 sec by 50%, stacking up to 5 times. Replaces Mind Flay. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Mindbender Creates a Mindbender to attack the target. Caster receives 0.75% mana when the Mindbender attacks. Lasts 20 sec. Replaces Shadowfiend. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 45 60 Talent. 40 yd range. Instant. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Mindbender (New) Discipline, Holy: Creates a Mindbender to attack the target. Caster receives 0.75% mana when the Mindbender attacks. Lasts 20 sec. Replaces Shadowfiend. Shadow: Creates a Mindbender to attack the target. Caster receives 2 Insanity when the Mindbender attacks. Lasts 20 sec. Replaces Shadowfiend. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 90 Talent. 40 yd range. Instant. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Oblivion (New) Let the power of the void flow through you, instantly generating 100 Insanity. Priest - LvL 90 Talent. Instant. 2 min cooldown.
    • Path of Light (New) Your Levitate is no longer canceled by damage, and causes the target to move 15% faster, but the duration is reduced to 30 sec. Priest - LvL 30 Talent.
    • Piety (New) Prayer of Mending triggers Serenipity, reducing the cooldown of Holy Word: Sanctify by 6 seconds. Priest - LvL 75 Talent.
    • Power Infusion Discipline, Holy: Infuses the Priest with power for 20 sec, increasing haste by 25% and reducing the mana cost of all spells by 20%. Priest - LvL 75 Shadow: Infuses the Priest with power for 20 sec, increasing haste by 25% and increasing Insanity generation by 25%. Priest - LvL 90 Talent. Instant. 2 min cooldown.
    • Power Word: Solace Strike an enemy with heavenly power, dealing [ 1 + 300% of Spell Power ] Holy damage and restoring 0.75% of maximum mana. Priest - Level 60 Talent. 30 40 yd range. Instant. 10 sec cooldown.
    • Psychic Voice (New) Reduces the cooldown of your Psychic Scream ability by 30 sec. Priest - LvL 45 Talent.
    • Purge the Wicked (New) Cleanse the target with fire, causing [*150% of Spell Power*] Fire damage and an additional [*65% of Spell Power*] Fire damage over until cancelled. Spreads to an additional nearby enemy when you cast Penance on the target. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. 2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 10 sec cooldown.
    • Reaper of Souls (New) Your Shadow Word: Death is now castable on targets below 35% health, and always generates Insanity, even if it did not kill the target. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.
    • San'layn (New) Increases the damage of your Vampiric Touch by 20%, and the healing of your Vampiric Embrace by 20%. Priest - LvL 75 Talent.
    • Schism (New) The final bolt of Penance creates an explosion of shadow energy around the target, dealing 1 damage to all enemies within 10 yards. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Shadow Covenant Draw on the power of shadow to heal up to 5 injured allies within 30 yds of the target for [ 450% of Spell Power ], but leaving a shell on them that absorbs the next [ 225% of Spell Power ] healing they receive within 10 6 sec. Replaces Power Word: Radiance. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Discipline Priest - Level 100 Talent. 6% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast.
    • Shadow Word: Void (New) Blasts the target's mind for [*1 + 220% of Spell Power*] Shadow damage. Generates 30 Insanity. Priest - LvL 15 Talent. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Shadowy Insight Your Shadow Word: Pain damage over time and Mind Spike damage has a 5% has a 10% chance to reset the cooldown on Mind Blast and make your next Mind Blast instant. Priest - LvL 75 Talent. Priest - LvL 75 Talent.
    • Shield Discipline (New) When your Power Word: Shield is completely absorbed you are instantly refunded 1% of your maximum mana. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.
    • Shining Force (New) Create a burst of light around a friendly target, knocking away nearby enemies and slowing their movement by 70% for 3 sec seconds. Priest - LvL 45 Talent. 2.5% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Surge of Light Your healing spells and Smite have a 8% chance to make your next Flash Heal instant and cost no mana. Can accumulate up to 2 charges. Priest - LvL 45 Talent. 75 Talent.
    • Surrender to Madness (New) Surrender to the Old Gods, sacrificing your soul for ultimate power. All your Insanity-generating abilities generate 300% more Insanity, until you exit Voidform, then you die. Requires Voidform. Priest - LvL 100 Talent. Instant. 10 min cooldown.
    • The Penitent (New) Penance may be cast on a friendly target, healing them for [*600% of Spell Power*] over 2 sec. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Trail of Light (New) When you cast Flash Heal, s1% of the healing is replicated on the previous target you healed with Flash Heal. Priest - LvL 15 Talent.
    • Twist of Fate (Discipline, Holy) After healing a target below 35% health, you deal 15% increased damage and healing for 10 sec. 20% increased damage and 20% increased healing for 10 sec.
    • Twist of Fate (Shadow) After damaging a target below 35% health, you deal 15% increased damage and healing for 10 sec. 20% increased damage and 20% increased healing for 10 sec.
    • Void Lord (New) While in Voidform, your Shadow damage bonus is now 40%, and that bonus also applies to all your absorbs and healing. Priest - LvL 60 Talent.

    Discipline
    Those bonus sets...
    • Item - Priest T19 Discipline 2P Bonus (New) Your healing on targets affected by your Power Word: Shield is increased by 20%.
    • Item - Priest T19 Discipline 4P Bonus (New) During Rapture, Atonement applied by Power Word: Shield lasts 6 additional sec.

    Spells
    • Atonement Plea, Power Word: Shield, and Shadow Mend Shadow Mend, and Power Word: Radiance also apply Atonement to your target for 15 sec. When you deal spell damage, you instantly heal all targets affected by Atonement for 50% 40% of the damage done. Priest - Discipline Spec.
    • Plea A quick, efficient plea to heal an ally for [ 1 + 225% of Spell Power ;]. Mana cost increased 30% for each Atonement you have active;]. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline Spec. 1.5% 1% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant.
    • Power Word: Radiance A burst of light heals a friendly target and their 2 nearest allies for [ 300% of Spell Power ], and applies Atonement for 50% 100% of its normal duration. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline Spec. 5.5% 7% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast.

    Discipline & Holy
    • Mass Resurrection (New) Brings all dead party members back to life with 35% health and mana. Cannot be cast when in combat. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline & Holy Spec. 0.8% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 10 sec cast.


    Discipline & Shadow
    • Power Word: Shield Shield an ally, absorbing [ 600% of Spell Power ] damage. Lasts 15 sec. While the shield holds, spellcasting will not be delayed by damage. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline & Shadow Spec. 2.5% 2.2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 6 sec cooldown.
    • Atonement When you deal damage with Smite, Holy Fire, Penance, Power Word: Solace, or their multistrikes, you instantly heal a nearby injured friendly target for 100% of the damage dealt. If the Priest is healed through Atonement, the effect is reduced by 50%. Priest - Discipline Spec. Plea, Power Word: Shield, and Shadow Mend also apply Atonement to your target for 15 sec. When you deal spell damage, you instantly heal all targets affected by Atonement for 50% of the damage done. Priest - Discipline Spec.
    • Mastery: Absolution Name Changed from Mastery: Shield Discipline to Mastery: Absolution. Increases the potency of all your damage absorption spells by 12.8%, and all of your healing by 6.4%. Priest - Discipline Spec. healing transferred through Atonement by 11.2%. Priest - Discipline Spec.
    • Mind Blast (New) Blasts the target's mind for [*1 + 250% of Spell Power*] Shadow damage. Priest - Discipline Spec. 4% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Penance Launches a volley of holy light at the target, causing [*3 + 360% 600% of Spell Power*] Holy damage to an enemy or [*792% of Spell Power*] healing to an ally over 2 sec. Priest - Discipline Spec. 1.2% over 2 sec. Channelable while moving. Priest - Discipline Spec. 2.5% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant (Channeled). 9 sec cooldown. 9 sec cooldown.
    • Plea (New) A quick, efficient plea to heal an ally for [*1 + 225% of Spell Power*]. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline Spec. 1.2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant.
    • Power Word: Radiance (New) A burst of light heals a friendly target and their 5 nearest allies for [*150% of Spell Power*], and applies Atonement for 50% of its normal duration. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline Spec. 7% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast.
    • Rapture Removes the cooldown on Power Word: Shield. Priest - Discipline Spec. For the next 8 sec, your Power Word: Shield has no cooldown. Priest - Discipline Spec. Instant. 1.5 min cooldown.
    • Revelation (New) Your Smite and Mind Blast casts have a 30% chance to reset the cooldown on Penance. Priest - Discipline Spec.

    Discipline & Holy
    • Leap of Faith You pull the spirit of the friendly party or raid target, instantly moving them directly in front of you. Priest - Discipline & Holy Spec. 2.6% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 1.5 min cooldown.
    • Levitate Allows the friendly party or raid target to levitate, floating a few feet above the ground. While levitating, the target will fall at a reduced speed and travel over water. Any damage will cancel the effect. Lasts 10 min. Can be cast in Shadowform. Can't be cast in Flight Form. Priest - Discipline & Holy Spec. 0.9% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. Instant.
    • Purify Dispels harmful effects on the target, removing all Magic and Disease effects. 1 Max Charges. Can be cast in Spirit of Redemption. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline & Holy Spec. 2.6% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 8 sec recharge. 1 Max Charges. cooldown.

    Discipline & Shadow
    • Mind Vision Allows the caster to see through the target's eyes for 60 sec. Will not work if the target is in another instance or on another continent. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline & Shadow Spec. 1% of Base Mana. Unlimited range. 60 sec cast (Channeled).
    • Power Word: Shield Shield an ally, absorbing [ 600% of Spell Power ] damage. Lasts 15 sec. While the shield holds, spellcasting will not be delayed by damage. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Discipline & Shadow Spec. 2.5% 2.2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant. 6 sec cooldown.
    • Psychic Scream The caster lets out a psychic scream, causing 5 enemies within 8 yards to flee, disorienting them for 8 sec. Damage caused may interrupt the effect. Can be cast in Shadowform. Limited to 5 targets. Priest - LvL 60 Talent Discipline & Shadow Spec. 3% of Base Mana. Instant. 30 sec cooldown. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Shadow Word: Pain A word of darkness that causes [*1 + 47.5% of Spell Power*] Shadow damage instantly and an additional [*6 + 47.5% of Spell Power*] Shadow damage over 18 sec. Can be cast in Shadowform. 0.25% Priest - Discipline & Shadow Spec. 2% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant.


    Holy & Discipline
    • Resurrection Brings a dead ally Brings all dead party members back to life with 35% health and mana. Cannot be cast when in combat. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Holy & Discipline Spec. 0.8% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 10 sec cast.


    Shadow & Discipline
    • Shadow Mend (New) Discipline, Holy: Wrap an ally in shadows which heal them for [*700% of Spell Power*], but at a price. The ally will take [*70% of Spell Power*] damage every 1 sec, until they have taken [*350% of Spell Power*] total damage from all sources, or leave combat. Shadow: Wrap an ally in shadows which heal them for [*700% of Spell Power*], but at a price. The ally will take [*70% of Spell Power*] damage every 1 sec, until they have taken [*350% of Spell Power*] total damage from all sources, or leave combat. Drains up to 10 Insanity, if you have any. Priest - Shadow & Discipline Spec. 3% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 1.5 sec cast.
    • Shadowfiend Creates a shadowy fiend to attack the target. Lasts for 12 sec. Can be cast in Shadowform. Priest - Shadow & Discipline Spec. 40 yd range. Instant. 3 min cooldown.


    2/18/2016 - Build 21108
    Originally Posted by MMO-Champion

    Priest (Forums, Talent Calculator, PvP Talent Calculator, Artifact Calculator)
    • Mass Dispel Dispels magic in a 15 yard radius, removing all harmful spells from each friendly target and 1 beneficial spells from each enemy target. Affects a maximum of 10 friendly targets and 10 enemy targets. This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable. Can be cast in Shadowform. 13% of Base Mana / 13% of Base Mana / All Shadow Orbs. 30 yd range. 1.5 sec cast. 15 sec cooldown.
    • Prayer of Mending Places a spell on a party or raid member that heals them for [ Percent Health + 67% of Spell Power * Percent Health [ 1 + 150% of Spell Power ;] the next time they take damage. When the heal occurs, Prayer of Mending jumps to another party or raid member within 20 yds. Jumps up to 5 times and lasts 30 sec after each jump. Unlimited range. Instant.
    • Smite (Holy, Shadow) Smite an enemy for [ 250% of Spell Power ] Holy damageand has a 15% damage and has a 20% chance to reset the cooldown of Holy Fire.

    Talents
    • Afterlife Increases the duration of Spirit of Redemption by 200%.Holy Priest - Level 45 Talent.
    • Dominant Mind You may also control your own character while Dominate Mind is active. Priest - Level 45 Talent. and Dominate Mind now lasts 60 sec. Priest - Level 45 Talent.
    • Legacy of the Void Casting Mind Blast increases the effect damage of your next Shadow Word by 50% for 30 sec, stacking up to 2 times. Shadow Priest - Level 100 Talent.
    • Mind Bomb Unleashes a psychic explosion, stunning all enemies within 8 yds of the target for 3 4 sec. Replaces Psychic Scream. Shadow Priest - Level 45 Talent. 30 yd range. 1.5 sec cast. 30 sec cooldown.
    • Surrender to Madness Surrender to the Old Gods, sacrificing your soul for ultimate power. All your Insanity-generating abilities generate 200% more Insanity until you exit Voidform, and then you die. Requires Voidform. After surrendering your soul, you cannot be revived by in-combat resurrection abilities for 3 min Then you die. Horribly. Shadow Priest - Level 100 Talent. Instant. 10 min cooldown.
    • Symbol of Hope Bolster the morale of all healers in your party or raid within 40 yards, allowing them to cast spells for no mana for 12 10 sec. Can't be cast in Shadowform. Holy Priest - Level 60 Talent. 40 yd range. 12 sec cast (Channeled). 5 min cooldown. 10 sec cast (Channeled). 6 min cooldown.
    • Twist of Fate Priest - Level 75 Talent. Shadow Priest - Level 15 Talent.

    PvP Talents
    • Archangel Refreshes the duration of your Atonement on all allies when cast. Increases your healing and absorption effects by 30% for 15 sec. Discipline Priest - Tier 5 PvP Talent. Instant. 60 sec cooldown.
    • Driven to Madness Being attacked will grant you 5 Insanity. This effect has a 3 sec cooldown. Shadow Priest - Tier 3 PvP Talent.
    • Edge of Insanity While at 100 Insanity and not in Voidform, your damage is increased by 20%. You no longer enter Voidform instantly when reaching 100 Insanity, and instead you learn Voidform as an active ability: Voidform Enter Voidform, reducing the cooldown on Mind Blast by 3 sec, and increasing your Shadow damage by 30%. While in Voidform, you gain 1% Haste, every 1 sec. This Haste will also persist for 60 sec after Voidform ends. Voidform causes your Insanity to constantly drain, faster and faster, until completely drained, and Voidform ends. Shadow Priest - Tier 3 PvP Talent.
    • Initiation (NYI) (New) Critical chance increased by 30% on targets at or above 80% health. Shadow Priest - Tier 1 PvP Talent.
    • Mind Quickness (New) Increases haste by 6%. Shadow Priest - Tier 1 PvP Talent.
    • Power Word: Fortitude Infuses the target with vitality, increasing Total maximum Health by 15% for 60 min. Maximum of 2 targets. Limited to 2 targets. Discipline Priest - Tier 5 PvP Talent. 5% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. Instant.
    • Shadow Mania Having Vampiric Touch on 2 or more targets grants you 3 Insanity every 2 sec. Increases the healing of Vampiric Touch by 100%. Shadow Priest - Tier 4 PvP Talent.
    • Train of Thought (New) Damage increased by 15%. Being attacked will cancel this effect for 8 sec. Shadow Priest - Tier 1 PvP Talent.

    Discipline
    • Rapture For the next 8 sec, your Power Word: Shield has no cooldown. Priest - Discipline Spec. Instant. 1.5 min cooldown. 2 min cooldown.

    Discipline, Holy, Shadow
    • Levitate Allows the friendly party or raid target to levitate, floating a few feet above the ground. While levitating, the target will fall at a reduced speed and travel over water. Any damage will cancel the effect. Lasts 10 min. Can be cast in Shadowform. Can't be cast in Flight Form. Priest - Discipline, Holy, Shadow Spec. 0.9% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. Instant. 0.9% of Base Mana. 30 yd range. Instant.


    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    The intention of the Schism change was actually to make sure you _could_ use it every other Penance. Because it has a cast time, it's cooldown is effectively slightly longer, so it always didn't sync up at 18 seconds.

    Nothing is inherently wrong with taking every available non-Atonement-improving talent and varying the playstyle away from the default, modulo correct tuning on the talents. Shadow Covenant is a new mechanic that thus far hadn't gotten much attention in testing, and if the most recent buff turns out to be too strong, that will greatly help narrow down the correct tuning.

    Perhaps minor, but when looking at Shadow Covenant note that there's a tooltip bug--the absorb was increased in this build along with the heal (the absorb is still 50% of the heal). We're considering making the absorb based on the effective healing done, to be consistent with Shadow Mend.

    The goal is not to have rotations where you don't use Atonement at all (and this seems unlikely since Penance, Smite, and low-count Plea are still very efficient). If Shadow Covenant feels like it can be spammed heavily in place of a normal rotation, then its cost is too low--but in any case it's good if that spell starts getting explored more on alpha.

    The change to Shadow Word: Pain was primarily directed at Shadow; separating the durations for Shadow and Disc is an option if it causes problems.

    Capping the cost of Plea is an option we'll look into. The goal is to have it be an easy and flexible way to apply Atonements when you don't have a lot of them, but not allow it to be an overly efficient way to spread an unlimited number throughout the raid. Once it becomes less efficient than the other options, the cost might not have to increase further--we understand you shouldn't lose a chunk of mana from one accidental cast.

    On that note, it's possible PW:Radiance is a little too prominent right now compared to Plea. Plea should be the natural way to apply your typical average number of Atonements (along with PW:Shield), with PWR being a more expensive investment to get more than usual. We'll look at the costing if their roles are seeming somewhat reversed. PW:Radiance feeling like the main rotational way to maintain "standard" Atonement count will definitely contribute to the problem of Shadow Covenant feeling like it breaks apart your rotation. Shadow Covenant should be replacing one high-cost AoE heal variant with another, without interrupting the ordinary gameplay.

    PW:Radiance should already be favoring targets that don't have Atonement on them. Let us know if you're sure you can observe different behavior on alpha, when all targets are players. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    Many thanks for the contributions and discussions so far from other threads, the number of Legion threads being created was getting out of hand however so these spec specific threads have been created to allow continued discussions without cluttering the forums.
    Previous threads on disc legion topics;

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ling-gone-!-!-!

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ting-in-Legion

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...line-in-Legion

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-terrible-idea
    Last edited by Djriff; 2016-04-04 at 03:33 PM.

  2. #2
    With the removal of Prayer of Healing from Discipline, it seems likely that Spirit Shell and Empowered Archangel will be significantly reworked, if not removed entirely. This raises the question of what role Archangel will play in the new Atonement healing style, if it still exists at all; will Evangelism be stacked via Holy spells (Smite, Penance) only, encouraging the use of Smite over Mind Blast and Shadow Word: Pain during low damage periods, or will it perhaps go another route entirely?

    Clarity of Will also seems a likely target for removal, with the toning down of absorbs overall.

    With the atonement play style in general, we'll probably have two main ways of approaching it; sustained and cyclical. The main difference between them, as described below, is that the sustained approach aims to indefinitely (neglecting mana concerns) provide healing to a given number of targets, while the cyclical approach aims to provide healing to a larger number of targets, albeit with (potentially) less healing being delivered to each target.
    In a sustained approach, we'd be aiming to keep up a steady stream of healing on a number of targets, with the aim of maximising the healing delivered within the duration of a single Atonement buff (i.e. maximising the healing delivered to each Atonement target). This would likely require continual alternation between Atonement-placing spells and damaging spells to generate the Atonement healing.
    In a cyclical approach, the aim would be to maximise the healing delivered within the time spanned by the placement of the first Atonement buff and the expiry of the last-placed Atonement buff. In contrast to the sustained approach, this would sacrifice healing on individual targets to maximise the overall healing delivered to the raid. These cycles would likely require a sequence of a series of Atonement-placing spells followed by a series of damaging spells to generate the Atonement healing.
    Of course, a combination between the two seems to be the most likely approach in practice, with a small number of targets (most notably tanks, but perhaps also debuff targets or the like) receiving Atonement healing consistently and periods in which wider raid damage exists are dealt with by spreading Atonement to a greater number of targets.

    There will be a lot of interesting things to analyse once Beta is released and we have access to all of the talents, spells, Spell Power coefficients and so on.

    One final thought for now is that the complexity of the Atonement play style seems akin to that of Holy's 10 man Serenity play style, from before Cascade's ability to refresh Renew was removed, with obvious parallels between the idea of sustaining a number of Renews on targets, which could temporarily be increased via Cascade, and the idea of sustaining a number of Atonement buffs, which can temporarily be increased either via Power Word: Radiance or by reducing the number of buffs that you wish to sustain indefinitely.
    Oh yeah, look at it go! Roll out the barrel; feel it in your bones!
    6.2 Healing Priest Spreadsheets; Legion Holy Priest Rotation Calculator (WiP)

  3. #3
    I'm worried about what addons/weak auras we might have to use to play this efficiently.

    The general playstyle looks to be PWS on tanks (alternating between the two to keep atonement up on both) on cooldown, Penance on cooldown, maintain SWP on as many targets as possible (the first time many of us will be actively target-switching during a raid), otherwise either add atonement targets with Plea, Shadow Mend or Power Word: Radiance or heal existing targets with Smite or Mind Blast. Early in the expansion while we're mana-starved we'll rely on Smite and Plea with only occasional use of Power Word: Radiance and Mind Blast, while we work in more and more Mind Blast and PWR as our mana regen improves.

    Position is important for PWR casts - before a heavy damage phase where we cast two PWRs in a row to set 12 atonement targets we want to make sure not to cast it on two melee players or one melee and a ranged who happens to be standing in melee. Since both tanks will be atoned anyway from PWS, it may be best to cast it on two different ranged who are far apart. Once we get enough mana to work PWR into our standard rotation, we can focus our Plea and Shadow Mend casts on melee and let PWR take care of ranged.
    Last edited by Yunzi; 2015-11-11 at 09:10 AM.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Yunzi View Post
    I'm worried about what addons/weak auras we might have to use to play this efficiently.
    You should be able to get away with just using some standard heal/harm mouseover macros (e.g. Plea/Smite). Unless there's something I'm missing, anything else would be related to how you want information to be displayed.
    Oh yeah, look at it go! Roll out the barrel; feel it in your bones!
    6.2 Healing Priest Spreadsheets; Legion Holy Priest Rotation Calculator (WiP)

  5. #5
    Well, you need to track atonement. And sw:P for starters. You can argue pw:S

    Not like anything unusual though

  6. #6
    I'd argue that Discipline really becomes a 'HoT' spec.

    Start by consuming about 25% of your casting time with Penance, Holy Fire (presuming Discipline still has it), Mind Blast and Shadow Word: Pain. This creates a constant pool of damage redirected via Atonement. So every time you lay in Atonement, you're really just laying in a variant on Renew (although likely less healing). Smite will likely remain anemic and rarely used.

    Shadowmend is essentially a heal/absorb hybrid, but the 'absorb' part of it vanishes extremely quickly. So you're probably only using it on tanks and other targets you absolutely know are taking ongoing damage.

    PW:S will be used much like it is now, but it will have a follow-on HoT in Atonement.

    Plea is probably the last choice spell. If everything else is on cooldown, you might as well toss it since it's instant and costs minimal mana. Effectively, it's a Legion-era Renew.

    I don't see much use for Power Word: Radiance. It's slow-casting and expensive. The Atonement it places doesn't stack effectively with existing Atonement and you can't easily control where it goes. So even when the raid is stacked, you're probably better off rolling Atonement via conventional methods.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by VigilantRose View Post
    rolling Atonement via conventional methods
    What are conventional methods ?
    Cause regular Atonement is applied by Plea,PW:S,Shadow Mend and you just basically have said that only PW:S will be used on CD to apply Atonement.
    I'm just trying to figure out how to spread atonement on most ppl.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by bumr View Post
    What are conventional methods ?
    Cause regular Atonement is applied by Plea,PW:S,Shadow Mend and you just basically have said that only PW:S will be used on CD to apply Atonement.
    I'm just trying to figure out how to spread atonement on most ppl.
    Power Word: Radiance
    7.0% Mana, 40 yd range, 2.5 sec cast
    A burst of light heals a friendly target and their 5 nearest allies for a moderate amount, and applies Atonement for 50% of its normal duration.
    Though atonement in it's current form last too short.
    Pokemon FC: 4425-2708-3610

    I received a day one ORAS demo code. I am a chosen one.

  9. #9
    Shadowmend applies atonment, so even if that target is not taking damage afterwards, they will from Shadowmend, so then if you start DPS-healing they will also be healed, which covers the delay in healing you would get from having to put atonement on first. Throw a couple of shadowmends out, then go back to DPS-healing and cover the DoT damage on them. I think at least that part works well.

    I still hope for a talent to place one permanent Atonement on one target, so you never end up healing no one, and eases up some of the UI and management of atonement issues.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    Though atonement in it's current form last too short.
    There's a talent that allows you to extend atonement duration to 20 seconds.
    The duration is low on purpose because there's no cap on how many marks you can have up so it's either keep the duration low and have no cap or increase the duration and hard cap marks to say 5 maximum. Personally i prefer the low duration and no cap because it's more rewarding for a good player but an average player might get frustrated easily cause skill cap will be substantially higher.

  11. #11
    Suppose a typical DPS does 100k DPS and a typical healer does 100k HPS. (The exact numbers don't matter, just that they are around the same).

    Assume they tune Disc DPS to be x% of a typical DPS.

    Atonement, with Mastery from typical gear transfers 50% + 28% = 78% of the damage to healing.

    Assuming you can maintain Atonement on T targets simultaneously, the Atonement-only healing is then T*78%*x%*100k.

    Given the current duration of Atonement (15sec without talents), and Plea, it seems like T will be at least 2 (e.g., the tanks), if not higher. If they chose to make Disc half a DPS, so x = 50%, we then get Atonement-only healing is 2*78%*50%*100k = 78k. Adding in non-Atonement healing and taking into account typical overhealing, it seems like effective healing could easily get to the 100k HPS of a "typical healer". So Disc equals 1 Healer + 0.5 DPS, which seems OP.

    I think they will either have to tune Disc DPS to be < 50% of a typical DPS, reduce the amount of damage converted to healing through Atonement, or make it harder to maintain Atonement on multiple targets.
    Last edited by Klyde; 2015-11-11 at 03:24 PM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by VigilantRose View Post
    I'd argue that Discipline really becomes a 'HoT' spec.

    Start by consuming about 25% of your casting time with Penance, Holy Fire (presuming Discipline still has it), Mind Blast and Shadow Word: Pain. This creates a constant pool of damage redirected via Atonement. So every time you lay in Atonement, you're really just laying in a variant on Renew (although likely less healing). Smite will likely remain anemic and rarely used.
    That's a really good point with disc becoming a HoT spec, especially when multiple targets are viable for SWP usage. Unlike normal HoTs, we could have 5 or 6 "HoTs" rolling at any one time, fight encounter design allowing, which would do tremendous healing. I disagree about Smite, though. Depending, again, on the encounter design, there may be periods of low damage and lulls after a high damage phase after people have been topped off where all atonement healing would be overhealing, and if for whatever reason we don't want to apply additional atonement targets and instead want to use a damage spell, Smite costs four times less mana than Mind Blast so it's less damaging to our mana pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by VigilantRose View Post
    Shadowmend is essentially a heal/absorb hybrid, but the 'absorb' part of it vanishes extremely quickly. So you're probably only using it on tanks and other targets you absolutely know are taking ongoing damage.

    PW:S will be used much like it is now, but it will have a follow-on HoT in Atonement.
    Yep.

    Quote Originally Posted by VigilantRose View Post
    Plea is probably the last choice spell. If everything else is on cooldown, you might as well toss it since it's instant and costs minimal mana. Effectively, it's a Legion-era Renew.
    It costs 2.5 times less mana than Shadowmend, avoids nearly as much overhealing, and doesn't apply a DoT. It seems to me that Shadowmend will be the last choice atonement applicator, with Plea, PWS (on cooldown), and Power Word: Radiance being the usual ones. Also, since Plea is instant it can be used on the move, so it's our only atonement applicator usable while moving that doesn't have a cooldown.

    Quote Originally Posted by VigilantRose View Post
    I don't see much use for Power Word: Radiance. It's slow-casting and expensive. The Atonement it places doesn't stack effectively with existing Atonement and you can't easily control where it goes. So even when the raid is stacked, you're probably better off rolling Atonement via conventional methods.
    *Especially* when a raid is stacked, it has problems - consider a common situation where the raid is entirely stacked for purposes of druid, shaman, holy priest, and holy paladin healing and there are currently 5 of 20 players with atonement with an incoming high damage phase or mechanic to the entire raid. As a responsible disc priest, you think you should add more atonement targets ASAP so you cast PWR. Instead of PWR being applied to 6 targets as is ideal it's actually applied to one target, with each additional target having only a 14 in 19 chance of application, so on average you'll miss out on one application. And if you cast PWR twice in a row on a stacked group, there's even less efficiency and a lot of RNG to determine the number of applications.

    This makes disc again the "black sheep" of the healing community, since we're going to want the raid to be spread out and people staying in their assigned positions (at least the people designated as PWR targets), while most of the other healing specs prefer the raid to stack for their aoe healing spells. However, it makes disc very powerful when the group isn't stacked and takes raid-wide damage, relative to the toolkit of most other specs. PWR's efficiency is amazing - while PWS, Plea, and Shadow Mend apply 15 seconds of atonement per 1.5 seconds, so 10 atonement/sec, PWR assuming maximum applications applies 7.5 seconds of atonement times 6 players per 2.5 seconds, so 18 atonement/sec, and that's just the overall efficiency - if the damage mechanic is burst, a one-off, then what's important is healing players over 7.5 seconds, not 15 seconds, making PWR practically mandatory as a healing tactic.
    Last edited by Yunzi; 2015-11-11 at 04:37 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klyde View Post
    I think they will either have to tune Disc DPS to be < 50% of a typical DPS
    They've already given a ballpark figure of 30% of a DPS (assuming their "70/30" number meant 70% the effectiveness of a regular healer and 30% the effectiveness of a regular DPS).
    That is not dead which can eternal lie.
    And with strange aeons even death may die.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Yunzi View Post
    That's a really good point with disc becoming a HoT spec, especially when multiple targets are viable for SWP usage. Unlike normal HoTs, we could have 5 or 6 "HoTs" rolling at any one time, fight encounter design allowing, which would do tremendous healing. I disagree about Smite, though. Depending, again, on the encounter design, there may be periods of low damage and lulls after a high damage phase after people have been topped off where all atonement healing would be overhealing, and if for whatever reason we don't want to apply additional atonement targets and instead want to use a damage spell, Smite costs four times less mana than Mind Blast so it's less damaging to our mana pool.
    I'm making a lot of assumptions based on what's live. Currently, Mind Blast does double the damage of Smite at 1/6th the mana cost (I'm more concerned about the former than the latter).

    Now, assuming Atonement is a functional mechanic, there's a 'balancing point' somewhere. As you do more damage, you end up with less Atonement healing (not enough buffs in play). As you do less damage, you end up with less Atonement healing (more buffs, but less damage to transfer). If we just assume everything is the same, then that point is around 5 Atonement buffs.

    At 5 Atonement buffs, a 200% Spellpower Mind Blast will heal 500% - which is a bit more than PW:S (given the Mastery change) and (probably) Shadowmend. A 100% Spellpower Smite would only heal 250% - quite a bit less than the other options. Indeed, I can easily see even Mind Blast getting pushed off the damage rotation in multi-enemy fights. If you're just running through dungeon/raid trash, it's unlikely you'd use anything but SW:P (assuming infinite health trash) - you'd run out of casting time for damage before you ran out of SW:P targets and the rest of your time would be spent placing the Atonement needed to capitalize on the SW:P.

    Obviously if all you're doing is dealing damage, you'll run up against the obstacle of having nothing but Smite available to cast.

    It costs 2.5 times less mana than Shadowmend, avoids nearly as much overhealing, and doesn't apply a DoT. It seems to me that Shadowmend will be the last choice atonement applicator, with Plea, PWS (on cooldown), and Power Word: Radiance being the usual ones. Also, since Plea is instant it can be used on the move, so it's our only atonement applicator usable while moving that doesn't have a cooldown.
    Think of Shadow Mend as a Flash Heal. It also applies an absorption shield that cannot exceed the target's current damage. This absorption shield loses the top 10% of its value (it doesn't lose anything if that part of the absorption shield is already gone) every sec until the absorption shield is entirely gone.

    So if you throw it on your wounded tank, it's essentially a double Flash Heal - the 'absorb' portion will get blown through long before it ever gets a chance to tick away. If you throw it a random raid member, it's merely a Flash Heal (because the 'absorb' portion will just wither away to uselessness before being used).

    I'm imagining a single target rotation for Discipline of SW:P (refresh as needed), Penance (on cooldown), Mind Blast (immediately after Penance, on cooldown), PW:S. At this point you've used up 75% of your casting time and can cast a 1.5/instant spell every 6 sec or a 2.5 sec spell every 10 sec.

    Out of that rotation, over half of your time is spent casting spells that don't impede movement. If you increase the number of hostile targets, this percentage goes up.

    This makes disc again the "black sheep" of the healing community, since we're going to want to the raid to be spread out and people staying in their assigned positions (at least the people designated as PWR targets), while most of the other healing specs prefer the raid to stack for their aoe healing spells. However, it makes disc very powerful when the group isn't stacked and takes raid-wide damage, relative to the toolkit of most other specs.
    I'm not sure because Radiance is awfully vague. It hits the 'nearest' targets, which makes it seem more like a stacked heal with a limited range than something that can blanket a spread raid.

  15. #15
    No point saying disc doing 30% of a dps and 70% of a healer or whatever the exact numbers is relevant at all, when currently there are healers that don't even do 100% of the healing of another healer and there are dps who don't do 100% of another dps. Some healers are already 150% of a "typical" healer and some dps are 140% of a "typical" dps. So disc being 1 healer + 0.5 dps is more op than present day disc which is 1.5 healer?

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by worcester View Post
    No point saying disc doing 30% of a dps and 70% of a healer or whatever the exact numbers is relevant at all, when currently there are healers that don't even do 100% of the healing of another healer and there are dps who don't do 100% of another dps. Some healers are already 150% of a "typical" healer and some dps are 140% of a "typical" dps. So disc being 1 healer + 0.5 dps is more op than present day disc which is 1.5 healer?
    Present day disc is not even close to being 1.5 healers. Someone must be overhealing the content he does.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by worcester View Post
    No point saying disc doing 30% of a dps and 70% of a healer or whatever the exact numbers is relevant at all, when currently there are healers that don't even do 100% of the healing of another healer and there are dps who don't do 100% of another dps. Some healers are already 150% of a "typical" healer and some dps are 140% of a "typical" dps. So disc being 1 healer + 0.5 dps is more op than present day disc which is 1.5 healer?
    Yes there is variation across classes/specs, but averaged across different encounters this difference is only around +/-10% for both DPS and HPS (looking at the median by spec across all Mythic parses):

    warcraftlogs.com/statistics/8#dataset=50&aggregate=amount&metric=dps
    warcraftlogs.com/statistics/8#dataset=50&aggregate=amount&metric=hps

    The fact this variation exists doesn't invalidate the discussion of how Blizz will balance Disc DPS and HPS vs other "pure" damage and healing specs.

  18. #18
    Attack-healing is awkward and long ramp up is unacceptable for monks but is Disc's newest toy!

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by PosPosPos View Post
    Present day disc is not even close to being 1.5 healers. Someone must be overhealing the content he does.
    And disc will be 1 healer + 0.5 dps according some poster above. Point is, no matter where disc actually lands there will always be the argument of variance and past experience of atonement leads me to believe it is far to difficult to hit any objective reliably with the metrics we have.

    They either have to peg disc to a benchmark to guarantee that they only do 70% healing 30% damage (which they won't do) or have mechanics in place to diminish the returns of stacking them (which is already in effect via pw:s restrictions). In reality I suspect they will still contribute more than the supposed "70%+30%=100%", again based on past experience with no evidence to suggest it will be different in the future.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by dextersmith View Post
    Attack-healing is awkward and long ramp up is unacceptable for monks but is Disc's newest toy!
    It's almost like we attack-healed before and our ramp up is similar to playing proactively like pwsing people now!! Wow so hard xD We'll play mostly proactively with some reactiveness, which isn't too much different than MoP/now disc.

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