Prot paladins 7.0 not haste based anymore?

[Stenulf]

I really really love the seraphim / haste play style of Prot palas as of now, the tier 18 4set is great but maybe a bit overtuned, and it kinda removes the fun for me a bit.

BUT 7.0 from what i see is removing seraphim as a talent, and i havnt seen it as a baseline spell, also with ripostle are we going to be a crit based class, as they also remove holy power?

[Deleted]

I really really love the seraphim / haste play style of Prot palas as of now, the tier 18 4set is great but maybe a bit overtuned, and it kinda removes the fun for me a bit.

BUT 7.0 from what i see is removing seraphim as a talent, and i havnt seen it as a baseline spell, also with ripostle are we going to be a crit based class, as they also remove holy power?

The only sane answer to this is "we'll be able to speculate relevantly about this when Beta launches, and not a minute before."

[Deleted]

Given that we prioritize haste to accelerate holy power generation, removal of the latter may greatly deprieve haste's importance. Especially if we are to get some kind of interaction with critical strike. Not cool if you ask me - I really like the fast-paced ProtPal playstyle.

[Ashijin]

Haste reduces the recharge time on the SOTR charges while crit gives random free charges. Both will be good.

[yearlongjester]

Haste reduces the recharge time on the SOTR charges while crit gives random free charges. Both will be good.

Are you sure? Sanctity of Battle didn't mention SotR in the datamined info.

[Ashijin]

Are you sure? Sanctity of Battle didn't mention SotR in the datamined info.

Was confirmed in a twitter post from warcraftdevs

[Deleted]

Haste reduces the recharge time on the SOTR charges while crit gives random free charges. Both will be good.

Haste makes our Interactions between Spells and the Mitigation (our Job) better. Because there is more to generate if we have more of it in any given moment. This is going away. At least how it seems. So no, I don't think just removing this aspect is a good thing at all.
Making one of the most APM Specs into one that only pretty much needs Avengers Shield and SotR to keep up our Mitigation (because only Judgment/Avengers Shield will have any interaction with our Mitigation at all) is a stupid idea.
While I agree - Prot was a bit high maintenance atm but just removing it is not the way to go. At all. Giving people choice is the right way in my book. Not the other way around.

To be fair. We don't yet know 100% how it will feel. But I actually like Haste Prot. I even enjoyed myself even more with Seraphim. I love playing this way. Why not put in some kind of Talent so our abilities shave off CD off our SotR with maybe a malus on the (srsly stupid imho) Redoubt Procrate. Or give Grand Crusader back to our Abilities. Which is still not awesome because it is still a proc but hey, what are you going to do.

In terms of defensive this change wont be bad for us, yes. But being a tank atm is not that hard on many many fights. Many of them require more or less just 1 tank and 1 taunt-bot. So making it even easier is imo not the right way to go about it.

[Ashijin]

Haste makes our Interactions between Spells and the Mitigation (our Job) better. Because there is more to generate if we have more of it in any given moment. This is going away. At least how it seems. So no, I don't think just removing this aspect is a good thing at all.
Making one of the most APM Specs into one that only pretty much needs Avengers Shield and SotR to keep up our Mitigation (because only Judgment/Avengers Shield will have any interaction with our Mitigation at all) is a stupid idea.
While I agree - Prot was a bit high maintenance atm but just removing it is not the way to go. At all. Giving people choice is the right way in my book. Not the other way around.

To be fair. We don't yet know 100% how it will feel. But I actually like Haste Prot. I even enjoyed myself even more with Seraphim. I love playing this way. Why not put in some kind of Talent so our abilities shave off CD off our SotR with maybe a malus on the (srsly stupid imho) Redoubt Procrate. Or give Grand Crusader back to our Abilities. Which is still not awesome because it is still a proc but hey, what are you going to do.

In terms of defensive this change wont be bad for us, yes. But being a tank atm is not that hard on many many fights. Many of them require more or less just 1 tank and 1 taunt-bot. So making it even easier is imo not the right way to go about it.

I agree completely with you, and am not happy with the changes they are making. Personally I love how the spec plays right now. I was simply remarking that haste will still have some value.

[celinamuna]

We still have haste, but due to interaction between AA resetting sotr, haste is a lot weaker than crit (#s in sig)

[Milothedingo]

There's some people talking about how giving people choices is the right way to go, and saying they're not doing that. I'm absolutely not disagreeing with most peoples sentiments - but I just wanted to point out that whilst the talents etc are not final, there are some options in there that give protection paladins decisions to make.

As an example, 'Day of Reckoning' - level 15 talent

'Hand of Reckoning now has 3 charges. Additionally, targets affected by Hand of Reckoning deal 10% less physical damage to you.'


'Light of the Protector' - baseline ability

'Calls down the Light to heal yourself for 50% of your missing health.'


'Blessing of Negation' - level 45 talent

'Places a blessing on a party or raid member, protecting them from all magical attacks for 10 sec. Cannot be used on a target with Forbearance. Causes Forbearance for 30 sec.'

Shield of the Righteous also now works on a charge system, so you need to not manage it poorly and leave yourself exposed.

I won't go on, there are plenty of others like Divine Steed etc, but all I'm saying is, there are still decisions that prot paladins can give themselves to make; and if they make them well they will set themselves apart as better and higher performance tanks. (From what we have seen so far which is subject to change).

[Serenais]

We still have haste, but due to interaction between AA resetting sotr, haste is a lot weaker than crit (#s in sig)

Well, haste and crit will be pretty pointless without one another - we are unlikely to get crit to 50% (I think that's what it was), or haste to 170%. We can get crit to 25% and haste to 33% at the same time, even if not in the starting tier (probably bar mythic).

[Jellospally]

Well, haste and crit will be pretty pointless without one another - we are unlikely to get crit to 50% (I think that's what it was), or haste to 170%. We can get crit to 25% and haste to 33% at the same time, even if not in the starting tier (probably bar mythic).

I mean 0% haste and 33% crit is easier to get than 25% and 33%. and 33% on average = 100% uptime.

Crit is greatly stronger than haste. Sure they benefit from one another, but crit, in the current state of what we know about legion pally is, is almost or is more than 3x better than haste point for point looking at celin and the graph made in the prot forum.