Which melee class is good to have multiple in mythic group?

[Sonrisa]

Absolutely not true. If you are a good melee-Team, you have a 99%+ Boss uptime and nearly no movement. Just Stack behind the Boss, wait for 2 zones, move out, wait for 2 zones, move to Boss again and go DPS.

You just have to do it as a Team. If you don't move, you get fucked up by 5 eruptions. If you move to early, you fuck up your melee Team. But you only have to do it right twice in the fight. Not to hard.

If you stack all the melee for inferno, at least on mythic, they will all die from the circles spawning.

[Deleted]

If you stack all the melee for inferno, at least on mythic, they will all die from the circles spawning.

Why? 5 Melees spawn 2 circles each = 10 in Total. You move out, spawn 10 new ones and move out again. You don't take any damage from a spawning circle, you take damage when they explode. Or do you take Damage when they spawn? We don't have Problems with it and we are 5-7 Melees.

[Adramelch]

Why? 5 Melees spawn 2 circles each = 10 in Total. You move out, spawn 10 new ones and move out again. You don't take any damage from a spawning circle, you take damage when they explode. Or do you take Damage when they spawn? We don't have Problems with it and we are 5-7 Melees.

You get hit for about 40k-ish per circle that spawns on top of you.

[Mercane]

- Rogues - good for doing boxes on HFA.

ROFL. Have your healers run that shit.

If you stack all the melee for inferno, at least on mythic, they will all die from the circles spawning.

Nah, you just have bad melee. Stand until 2 pools, move slightly for 2 pools, move back, resume boss damage.

I've died exactly 0 times to Infernal Tempest. Honestly, the damage is barely noticeable, and we 3 heal that fight.

[Deleted]

You get hit for about 40k-ish per circle that spawns on top of you.

Just looked it up, ist 35k. With some avoidance and versatility it goes down to 30k, def CD and it is 25k each. Not very heavy on mythic .
Heavy running damage would be much higher.

[Adramelch]

Just looked it up, ist 35k. With some avoidance and versatility it goes down to 30k, def CD and it is 25k each. Not very heavy on mythic .
Heavy running damage would be much higher.

Yeah but if you stack say 6-7 ppl then the damage gets out of hand. Also it's quite possible your raid might be using cooldowns there (either damage mitigation or healing ones).

[Mercane]

Yeah but if you stack say 6-7 ppl then the damage gets out of hand. Also it's quite possible your raid might be using cooldowns there (either damage mitigation or healing ones).

AMS for breath, but again- it's pretty trivial damage and unless you're spending a huge amount of time in P1/P2 it's not that big of a deal.

Melee can loosely spread for IT if stacking them is too difficult; I'd argue that the only fight super punishing for having too many melee is Gorefiend, unless people that go into his stomach are super good at killing the shit out of constructs.

[Adramelch]

AMS for breath, but again- it's pretty trivial damage and unless you're spending a huge amount of time in P1/P2 it's not that big of a deal.

Melee can loosely spread for IT if stacking them is too difficult; I'd argue that the only fight super punishing for having too many melee is Gorefiend, unless people that go into his stomach are super good at killing the shit out of constructs.

The discussion started from ArcadeBit saying you can have a full melee raid and have them stack on top of each other and move after 2 have spawned, and back after the other 2 have spawned. Assuming 14 dpsers being melee that's 14x30k every second on most of your raid.

[Deleted]

Manno and maybe xhul are practically broken in their requirement to have dks. It's mythic and it can't be totally random. But at least require the melee to do something, not a specific class entirely, TIMES 2.

[Zelendria]

First kill on Xhul had no DK's in it.... Loads of fights are easier with X class in it, but it's not impossible without them.

Whether that was the old Kormrok rune strat with Rogues
Zakuun strat with Mages
Etc

[Mercane]

The discussion started from ArcadeBit saying you can have a full melee raid and have them stack on top of each other and move after 2 have spawned, and back after the other 2 have spawned. Assuming 14 dpsers being melee that's 14x30k every second on most of your raid.

It's possible if they're all geared, if it's progression probably not.

[Bigbazz]

ROFL. Have your healers run that shit.



Nah, you just have bad melee. Stand until 2 pools, move slightly for 2 pools, move back, resume boss damage.

I've died exactly 0 times to Infernal Tempest. Honestly, the damage is barely noticeable, and we 3 heal that fight.

Maybe you misunderstand how it works. The infernal tempest is not just the circles on the ground, each player does an AOE splash around them damaging other players in addition to the ground circles, meaning if you stack the melee they will instagib each other in a melee heavy group, I speak from experience.. That means you have to split into separate stack groups of 2-3 and pre co-ordinate different directions (like melee 1 = left, melee 2 = right), you can't just stack on the same spot, move left and then move back.

Thus the point he made about more melee making it more difficult. It's still doable and hardly rocket surgery but lets not base all advice on being cutting edge 13/13m raiders when you're talking to someone whose guild has yet to set foot into Mythic. It's silly to talk the big talk about being mr pro raider like this and then fob him off by calling his players bad, helps nobody.

[Mercane]

Maybe you misunderstand how it works. The infernal tempest is not just the circles on the ground, each player does an AOE splash around them damaging other players in addition to the ground circles, meaning if you stack the melee they will instagib each other in a melee heavy group, I speak from experience.. That means you have to split into separate stack groups of 2-3 and pre co-ordinate different directions (like melee 1 = left, melee 2 = right), you can't just stack on the same spot, move left and then move back.

Nope. I understand how it works, the damage is pretty meaningless to a loosely stacked melee group (considering that 10,251 damage x4 only splashes people in 2 yards).

Thus the point he made about more melee making it more difficult. It's still doable and hardly rocket surgery but lets not base all advice on being cutting edge 13/13m raiders when you're talking to someone whose guild has yet to set foot into Mythic. It's silly to talk the big talk about being mr pro raider like this and then fob him off by calling his players bad, helps nobody.

It's a pretty trivial mechanic, doesn't require any real coordination to handle, and is more than likely a waste of a personal- especially on Heroic.

If you're melee, whoever they are, are dying to Infernal Tempest, you should probably replace them (because they are bad).

[Adramelch]

First of all, we're talking about Mythic. Secondly you intervened in a thread where someone mentioned that melees (and a great number of them in fact) can stack on top of each other and nothing happens if you don't get hit by the puddles, someone called him up on it (since it's simply not true) and you appeared calling his melee bad. Now you either need to fully read threads, fully understand mechanics, or both.

[Mercane]

First of all, we're talking about Mythic. Secondly you intervened in a thread where someone mentioned that melees (and a great number of them in fact) can stack on top of each other and nothing happens if you don't get hit by the puddles, someone called him up on it (since it's simply not true) and you appeared calling his melee bad. Now you either need to fully read threads, fully understand mechanics, or both.

The damage from the splash is normalized across all difficulties.

You can still be 'stacked' while being 'spread' 2 yards.


Like I said, it's entirely possible for a geared group to run melee heavy or even all melee; it's probably unlikely that a group on progression will be very successful. Then again, it all comes down to how long P1 lasts.

[Adramelch]

The damage from the splash is normalized across all difficulties.

You can still be 'stacked' while being 'spread' 2 yards.


Like I said, it's entirely possible for a geared group to run melee heavy or even all melee; it's probably unlikely that a group on progression will be very successful. Then again, it all comes down to how long P1 lasts.

Well, looking at logs, the damage on Mythic is 30-40k per person x4 which is all but negligible. On that matter, solo-healing mythic Archimonde is also entirely possible (and achieved) but unlikely that a group on progression will be very successful. So, are we here, in a thread about a guild now stepping into mythic and asking setup questions, to ask about what's possible or what's actually recommended and the norm (for a reason)?

[Mercane]

Well, looking at logs, the damage on Mythic is 30-40k per person x4 which is all but negligible. On that matter, solo-healing mythic Archimonde is also entirely possible (and achieved) but unlikely that a group on progression will be very successful. So, are we here, in a thread about a guild now stepping into mythic and asking setup questions, to ask about what's possible or what's actually recommended and the norm (for a reason)?

Obviously, the answer is to be loosely stacked, with a handful of melee.

People that get hit by annihilating strike also drop pools in horrible places, and most of the splash damage you see on logs is coming from that.


Also- a new guild stepping into Mythic probably isn't overly concerned about the 10th boss, when they have plenty of other problems ahead of them.

[Adramelch]

Obviously, the answer is to be loosely stacked, with a handful of melee.

People that get hit by annihilating strike also drop pools in horrible places, and most of the splash damage you see on logs is coming from that.


Also- a new guild stepping into Mythic probably isn't overly concerned about the 10th boss, when they have plenty of other problems ahead of them.

Well yeah, but no guild should enter mythic with a "yeah, whatever, comp doesn't matter for the first 7-8 bosses" if they plan to clear as much of the raid as possible (if not all).

[Mercane]

Well yeah, but no guild should enter mythic with a "yeah, whatever, comp doesn't matter for the first 7-8 bosses" if they plan to clear as much of the raid as possible (if not all).

Comp, arguably, does in fact not matter, until Xhul/Mannoroth/Archimonde. Will it make things easier? Undoubtedly. Is it absolutely necessary to have a god comp for every fight? No.

Mythic teams should be constantly recruiting anyway, so they don't lose 1 or 2 members and get stuck doing heroic until they can replace lost talent.

[Deleted]

DK and rogue.