Swap Doomhammer with Fist of Ra-den for Ele/Enh?

[nazrakin]

The Ra-Den fist was created and designed specifically for elemental. Its not a pre-established lore weapon so it could have been anything they wanted it to be and they chose a fist.

[Deleted]

Yes. But Doomhammer was the Enhancement part of Thrall... He didn't wield Doomhammer in Cataclysm. Why is that? Because there he was doing all that Elemental stuff. He wielded Doomhammer in WoD. Why is that? Because he was smacking it in enemies' faces.

Bullshit. In Cataclysm he gave away his Warchief rank in order to be a full time Shaman. You obviously have no idea of this class fantasy aspect, just dont comment on it.

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The Ra-Den fist was created and designed specifically for elemental. Its not a pre-established lore weapon so it could have been anything they wanted it to be and they chose a fist.

Exactly. It could've been anything, but they chosed fist weapon and they wont allow us to transmog it into a mace or axe. -_-

[thilicen]

Whats the point of me having a weapon that requires me to be in melee range as a caster?

My balance druid sure as hell isn't running around slapping people with it's staff or stabbing people when I use a dagger.

[Deleted]

Bullshit. In Cataclysm he gave away his Warchief rank in order to be a full time Shaman. You obviously have no idea of this class fantasy aspect, just dont comment on it.

Dude, look at the actions that happened in Cataclysm. He was clearly pushed into an Elemental role in that expansion. That doesn't mean that he is an Elemental Shaman, but that his Elemental side was dominant at that time. Like I said before, he is what Blizzard wants him to be. But fact is, he never used Doomhammer as a pure caster weapon. Whenever he was shown as the Elemental role, he did not have Doomhammer equipped. Whenever he was shown as the Enhancement role, he did have it. Those are the facts. There is no reason to make Doomhammer an Elemental weapon. Just because Thrall shoots some Lightning Bolts through Doomhammer once in a while in between crushing skulls with it, doesn't mean that it's an elemental weapon...

edit: Sure, Fist Weapons are a bad weapon for Elementals. Even if that Ra-Den artifact had a very good lore (I haven't read about it, don't know it), it would still be bad as long as it's not possible to transmog fist weapons into other weapons.

[gambit998]

Dude, look at the actions that happened in Cataclysm. He was clearly pushed into an Elemental role in that expansion. That doesn't mean that he is an Elemental Shaman, but that his Elemental side was dominant at that time. Like I said before, he is what Blizzard wants him to be. But fact is, he never used Doomhammer as a pure caster weapon. Whenever he wast shown as the Elemental role, he did not have Doomhammer equipped. Whenever he was shown as the Enhancement role, he did have it. Those are the facts. There is no reason to make Doomhammer an Elemental weapon. Just because Thrall shoots some Lightning Bolts through Doomhammer once in a while in between crushing skulls with it, doesn't mean that it's an elemental weapon...

Well by that definition i can hit things and cast spells too at the same time, does not make me enhancment, i can melee and cast flameshock it isnt effective but me as a elemental shaman can do this..... The point isnt the melee part the point is that FIST of Raiden is a STOOPID (I spelt it wrong on prupose) Artifact for a caster spec. they could have made it another mace or a axe even.

[Deleted]

Well by that definition i can hit things and cast spells too at the same time, does not make me enhancment, i can melee and cast flameshock it isnt effective but me as a elemental shaman can do this..... The point isnt the melee part the point is that FIST of Raiden is a STOOPID (I spelt it wrong on prupose) Artifact for a caster spec. they could have made it another mace or a axe even.

What YOU can do doesn't matter. What a lore character in a lore situation does, matters.

edit: and here we have the main problem: You guys don't want Doomhammer as elemental weapon. You want "not a fist weapon".

[gambit998]

Ye pretty much in my eyes at least, It could have been a sickle for all i would have cared as long as i could transmog it into a mace or a axe. the fact that they gave us something that CAN only be Transmogged into another fist weapon.

HELL Enhancement would be having a shit fit if Elemental shamans got Akama's Sickles.....'those are enhancment weapons.'

[Sencha]

I agree with you OP.

[Renedric]

Doomhammer is and has always been a weapon meant for physical combat. In its current state it is pretty much the mjolnir of wow; a hybrid of elements and physical combat. Perfect for enhance. Having an elemental shaman waving it around like a sailormoon wand and never having it connect with someone's face is just repulsive. Sorry but if you want to wield such a manly weapon you need to put on some muscle and switch enhance.

[Laringar]

I don't think Blizz would make the switch, as WW monks get to be the "dual wielding fists" class.

That said, I am a bit surprised that there isn't a dual-axe artifact for anyone. (Only looking at dual-wielding weapons for the moment) We have 3 dual swords, 3(ish) dual daggers, 1 dual mace, 1 dual fist. (Daggers being a special case, as the Feral Druid artifact seems to be dual daggers, even though the class currently can't dual wield.) I would have liked to see dual axes for fury warriors.

But yeah. Blizz isn't going to drop the only dual wielding mace artifact to have 2 fist wielders.

(Side note, I have semantic satiation on the word "dual" now.)

[Photek]

Bullshit. In Cataclysm he gave away his Warchief rank in order to be a full time Shaman. You obviously have no idea of this class fantasy aspect, just dont comment on it.

He gave up Doomhammer on the book prior to Cataclysm because it wasn't fit to commune with the elements.

[nazrakin]

Ye pretty much in my eyes at least, It could have been a sickle for all i would have cared as long as i could transmog it into a mace or a axe. the fact that they gave us something that CAN only be Transmogged into another fist weapon.

HELL Enhancement would be having a shit fit if Elemental shamans got Akama's Sickles.....'those are enhancment weapons.'

Yeah but thats not much of an analogy since Doomhammer isnt an elemental weapon, its just a Shaman weapon. Akamas sickles are literally just farming tools theres no power in them and thats the reason he uses them. Meanwhile, the fist weapon was made by the WoW version of Odin and gifted to a guy who was the jailor of the elemental planes.

[Rend Blackhand]

Yeah but thats not much of an analogy since Doomhammer isnt an elemental weapon, its just a Shaman weapon. Akamas sickles are literally just farming tools theres no power in them and thats the reason he uses them. Meanwhile, the fist weapon was made by the WoW version of Odin and gifted to a guy who was the jailor of the elemental planes.

I feel like I need to point out that Akama is not a shaman.

[nazrakin]

I feel like I need to point out that Akama is not a shaman.

Eh, I dont think he is officially recognized as a Shaman but he definitely practices shamanism since being abandoned by the light. Thats reflected in both WoW and WC3 by him using Shaman spells like CL and Feral Spirits.

[Yopparai]

I feel like I need to point out that Akama is not a shaman.

No apparently he's an 'elder sage' which sounds like shaman to me. He is a vindicator in WoD, but remember that before BC when the Draenei got stranded in Outland and got turned into the broken, they lost contact with the Light, and some turned to shamanism. Nobundo was originally a vindicator too I believe.

But seriously can we just drop this arguement about doomhammer being elemental already. You just sound butthurt. I'm not blown away by the summoning of a duplicate weapon as an enhance, but doomhammer is definitely a face smashing weapon, it was originally handed down through generations of warriors.

The reason they chose the fist for elemental is because rehgar uses a fist, and he's one of the most notable shamans aside from thrall. The elemental artifact even has skins that look like rehgars fist. I think the elemental artifact is on of the better looking artifacts I've seen too, so I don't know why anyone is complaining.

[Deleted]

Wether or not they keep or switch it, blizz REALLY needs to be more generous with transmog restrictions (if only for artefacts). Wether ele or enh is limited to one weapon type (fist weapons), it is retarded beyond meassure. Transmog is only for optics anyways, why be so stingy about it?

And I am fine either way, though they could, instead of going the elemental route with our offhand, take the spectral one. Our offhand could have our mainhand's look, but slightly transparent (like ghost wolf), ghostly blue (like feral spirits) or other. Like having an echo of our doomhammer in our other hand. Add doomhammer from AU, timewalking within our own universe and other shenanigans, blizz should have more than enough options to not go full retard on this lava-offhand madness come legion.
So really, it wouldn't be required to switch those artifacts (they are set in stone already anyways) and it wouldn't solve downsides like transmog either.


Also, if we're to be nitpicky about thrall's fighting style: I think he's a hybrid of elemental shaman/arms warrior. Loosely, that describes enhancement (melee combat and elemental forces), but enhancement's focus is on amplifying melee attacks by empowering them with the elements. Thrall doesn't ever do that. He either throws the elements in the enemies' face (elemental), or smacks them with doomhammer in melee combat (warrior).
His duel with garrosh was a nice demonstration of that. First, they thought against each other as warriors, no elements involved AT ALL. Then thrall throws him up/down with an air spell, locks him with an earth spell, and fries him with lightning (no weapon involved in any of those, elemental shaman).

[eternityshard]

I would totally agree with the OP, because as enhancement, I really dislike getting Doomhammer, except it doesn't fit for elemental, either.

There are several reasons I dislike the Doomhammer for enhancement:

1) Enhancement has been a dual-wielding spec since TBC. Thrall has never dual-wielded anything. He's always had just the Doomhammer in one hand. Original depictions of of the Doomhammer in the Warcraft instruction manuals was definitely a big two-handed maul, so if enhancement had stayed (or returned to) using two-handers, then I wouldn't feel so unhappy about it. However, as it stands, Doomhammer has no dual-wielding fantasy. Tacking on a magical lava offhand is just reaching. Hell, I'd have liked better to be using a single one-handed doomhammer and make our offhand spells like Lava Lash be a short-range spellcast with our free offhand.

2) Thrall has always been more Elemental than Enhancement. Again, he has never dual-wielded. He has cast spells more than he has fought in melee. When he does melee, he fights more like a warrior than an Enhancement Shaman.

3) This is more personal, but I main a Troll as my Enhancement shaman. Maces don't look right. Give me an axe.

[jimmyolsen]

The correct weapon choice for Enhancement would have been Akama's kamas from Black Temple, but they totally missed it.

Also, if we're to be nitpicky about thrall's fighting style: I think he's a hybrid of elemental shaman/arms warrior. Loosely, that describes enhancement (melee combat and elemental forces), but enhancement's focus is on amplifying melee attacks by empowering them with the elements. Thrall doesn't ever do that. He either throws the elements in the enemies' face (elemental), or smacks them with doomhammer in melee combat (warrior).

Go watch the Mannoroth confrontation from WC3 again.

[Ornerybear]

personally i think if the weapon is out during casting, like they've said, the fist weapon will look really cool as elemental.

[Florena]

If I were to swap any artifacts would be to give the ala'kir thing windwalkers get to elemental and the ra den one to monks, not swapping ele/enh.