Why does Israel get such bad reputation for human right?

[Doctor Amadeus]

Don't confuse "Jew" for "Israel."

What do you mean don't confuse Jew for Israel. Isn't that the entire point of the discussion?

I think they have a bad reputation based on the premise for the state in the first place which is 1 to have a homeland for Jewish people, which I as a non Jew disagree with, but they are there, and have been hated and threatened with death since.


And when you have an entire state who's conviction is "NEVER AGAIN" and they are threatened, I think it is reasonable to conclude that human beings might respond the way they do towards others who have explicitly stated they want to KILL THEM and DRIVE them into the sea.

[Shadowferal]

What bullshit are you spewing? Do you really think the whole world will just go after Jews because you fantasize about it?

Why am I debating with with an antisemitic ignoramus? Shame on me.

Anti-Zionism..means anti-semitic...LOL...Try again, because that bullshit never worked.

The whole world won't go after anyone...as long as they play nice after the US cuts relations. If they go after a NATO nation...what do you imagine will happen then? Or do you want to sidestep the question and go for ad-hominem instead?

[Stelio Kontos]

Anti-Zionism..means anti-semitic...LOL...Try again, because that bullshit never worked.

The whole world won't go after anyone...as long as they play nice after the US cuts relations. If they go after a NATO nation...what do you imagine will happen then? Or do you want to sidestep the question and go for ad-hominem instead?

Israel won't attack a NATO nation unless said NATO nation (let's be honest, only Turkey would do that) attacks first, in which case they'd be on their own. As I said, Israel has military alliance with multiple nations, so your wet dream's not going to play out.

Sorry, little guy.

[Shadowferal]

What do you mean don't confuse Jew for Israel. Isn't that the entire point of the discussion?

Do you know many Jews that favor Zionism? Because as many as I know...very few do.

[Stelio Kontos]

Do you know many Jews that favor Zionism? Because as many as I know...very few do.

Neturei Karta protester? Seriously?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neturei_Karta

Neturei Karta states that no official count of the number of members exists.[4] The Jewish Virtual Library puts their numbers at 5,000,[5] while the Anti-Defamation League estimates that fewer than 100 members of the community take part in anti-Israel activism.[1] Members of Neturei Karta have a long history of extremist statements and support for notable anti-Semites and Islamic extremists.[1]

Good choice there, son.

[Shadowferal]

Israel won't attack a NATO nation unless said NATO nation (let's be honest, only Turkey would do that) attacks first, in which case they'd be on their own. As I said, Israel has military alliance with multiple nations, so your wet dream's not going to play out.

Sorry, little guy.

If you say so.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Do you know many Jews that favor Zionism? Because as many as I know...very few do.

Well you are conflating the issue. The question is why Israel has a bad reputation, not DO YOU THINK The state of Israel has a right to OCCUPY that region. Because unlike many issues this one isn't clearly black and white.

And regardless to some Jewish people that may or may not agree with Israel is kind of fucking irrelevant. The issue isn't one of race, the issue is one of the human condition.

If you threatening to KILL a group of people for a half a century or more who have already deal with a lot of shit because of who they are, then yeah, they probably are going to be a little cranky.

[Stelio Kontos]

If you say so.

Yeah, probably time for you to goosestep off to another topic.

Posting Naturei Karta as a valid point...lol

[Deleted]

Imagine when (not if) the US cuts ties with Israel. It will probably get a lot worse.

That is the whole mindboggling thing in my opinion.
I mean security for israel now is basically a foreign paid rocket defense system and a huge wall. This is what israeli call safety. It's a HUUUUGE bet and I wouldn't feel safe AT ALL (and i'd be right considering the recent attacks). Israel NEEDS to isolate their own extremists, AT ANY COST (and there will be a cost cause that will bring social unrest), and start working towards increasing relationship with countries. It's their only solution for long lasting peace. A concrete wall and a foreign paid rocket system isnt safety.

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I don't know maybe could it have something to do with the long fucking history Israel and Jews have had for being hated and targeted for death? I mean I don't agree with their BELIEFS either, but it is impossible to deny that, they have been attacked ad unwanted not only over the last 60 years in a small sliver of space in the middle east, they have also been pretty much targets EVERYWHERE ELSE too. Including the U.S.

You're talking about Jews.
Not the state of Israel.
State of israel =/= Jewish people.

Thank god I shall add.

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What do you mean don't confuse Jew for Israel. Isn't that the entire point of the discussion?

I think they have a bad reputation based on the premise for the state in the first place which is 1 to have a homeland for Jewish people, which I as a non Jew disagree with, but they are there, and have been hated and threatened with death since.


And when you have an entire state who's conviction is "NEVER AGAIN" and they are threatened, I think it is reasonable to conclude that human beings might respond the way they do towards others who have explicitly stated they want to KILL THEM and DRIVE them into the sea.

You're confusing antisemitism with anti-zionism. The two are totally separate.

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Neturei Karta protester? Seriously?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neturei_Karta

Neturei Karta states that no official count of the number of members exists.[4] The Jewish Virtual Library puts their numbers at 5,000,[5] while the Anti-Defamation League estimates that fewer than 100 members of the community take part in anti-Israel activism.[1] Members of Neturei Karta have a long history of extremist statements and support for notable anti-Semites and Islamic extremists.[1]

Good choice there, son.

So are you going to stand here actually saying that Jewish people criticizing the state of israel isnt a thing? Are you serious dude?
What the fuck is wrong with you. Open google and learn a thing or two.

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Well you are conflating the issue. The question is why Israel has a bad reputation, not DO YOU THINK The state of Israel has a right to OCCUPY that region. Because unlike many issues this one isn't clearly black and white.

And regardless to some Jewish people that may or may not agree with Israel is kind of fucking irrelevant. The issue isn't one of race, the issue is one of the human condition.

If you threatening to KILL a group of people for a half a century or more who have already deal with a lot of shit because of who they are, then yeah, they probably are going to be a little cranky.

Someone else's actions do not justify your own. Otherwise you just justified terrorism.

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Yeah, probably time for you to goosestep off to another topic.

Posting Naturei Karta as a valid point...lol

Dude... this is embarrassing really.

Hope for return to the land of Israel is embodied in the content of the Jewish religion (see Kibbutz Galuyot.) Aliyah, the Hebrew word meaning "ascending" or "going up", is the word used to describe religious Jewish return to Israel, and has been used since ancient times.
Following Jewish Enlightenment however, Reform Judaism dropped many traditional beliefs, including aliyah, as incompatible with modern life within the Diaspora. Later, Zionism re-kindled the concept of aliyah in an ideological and political sense, parallel with traditional religious belief; it was used to increase Jewish population in the Holy Land by immigration and it remains a basic tenet of Zionist ideology.
Support for aliyah does not always equal immigration however, as a majority of the world Jewish population remains within the Diaspora. Support for the modern Zionist movement is not universal and as a result, some religious Jews as well as some secular Jews, do not support Zionism. Non-Zionist Jews are not necessarily anti-Zionists, although some are. Generally however, Zionism does have the support of the majority of the Jewish religious organizations, with support from segments of the Orthodox movement, and most of the Conservative, and more recently, the Reform movement.
Many Hasidic rabbis oppose the creation of a Jewish state. The leader of the Satmar Hasidic group, Rabbi Joel Teitelbaum's book, VaYoel Moshe, published in 1958, expounds one Orthodox position on Zionism, based on a literal form of midrash (biblical interpretation). Citing to Tractate Kesubos 111a of the Talmud Teitelbaum states that God and the Jewish people exchanged three oaths at the time of the Jews' exile from ancient Israel, forbidding the Jewish people from massively immigrating to the Land of Israel, and from rebelling against the nations of the world.

[Notter]

could be the way they mutilate the woman there... just saying

Care to elaborate on that remark?

cause you're lying... just saying

[Mehrunes]

From what I've read, the agreement appears to lack much in the way of "teeth," and offers a lot of ways for Iran to hide what they're doing, or otherwise obfuscate their activities.

But it does. The moment they breech the deal, the moment US can take action, including putting the sanctions back (and the deal only lifted nuclear-related snactions, there's tons of them that remain). Just recently Iran was caught testing ballistic missiles and they got new sanctions for that. And IAEA can constantly monitor everything they even suspect of being linked to Iran's nuclear program. The only reason one would complain about the deal itself and not Iran trying to try to skirt around it somehow, is because their vision of "teeth" is "let's bomb Iran hurr". Which is a fair deal of GOP and Israeli government.

I read it as him suggesting somehow that Israel was objecting to Iran's oil flooding the market or some such. It sounded, to me, like he was trying to make the case that Israel has a problem with Iran because of oil. That's not the case afaik

Well, it somehow reminded me of Garian's writing style so I read it as totally disjointed from the rest in some chaotic mess. Although technically Israel has a fair amount of oil, primarily in Negev. It's just it's not really mineable.

[Mehrunes]

Many people in Israel criticize the government so we don't need people from outside to tell us to wake up.

And then there are the people in Israel like the OP who go "War crimes? What war crimes?", because ignoring ICJ rulings makes for a productive argument.

[Deianeira]

We did it when we were at war in Gaza, we didn't do that for fun but to defend Israel citizens that for years were bombed by rockets coming from Gaza! but then again I'm sure that thinking that way helps you and your friends promote this idea where we intentionally did that for entertainment.

Many people that were killed in Gaza were used as human shields and that was the intention behind it so people like you will come at us and say these things, the Palestinians ride on this idea since then.

People that are killing for fun in Israel are judged and imprisoned! unlike some places in the Middle East or in the world.

When we provide facts it's conspiracy and lies when the Palestinians provides these facts it's all of a sudden the actual reality! and there's no questioning done.

It's unfortunate that civilians are killed on both sides, it's more unfortunate that children are killed but stop saying these things as if we walk on the streets and murdering Arabs or Palestinians for this matter because it's far, far from reality, in fact, there's some Arabs that live in Israel or coming from Gaza that are killing innocent citizens in Israel on weekly basis so when both sides will stop and when both sides will be judged equally then progress will be made.

It's definitely circular and someone on either side needs to make it stop and I'd really want to see Israel doing the first move but I know that neither side is willing to do something to get things done.

They aren't willing to recognize Israel as Jewish state and the government isn't willing to support 2 states solution or consider a practical alternative to make a change but it's definitely something that both sides need to work out.

So you think that it is appropriate that if terrorist take hostages regardless of where one should just kill them all with a bomb? Terrorists and hostages alike?