Justin Trudeau to receive award for gender balanced cabinet

[Ryme]

The only reason that could be true is if you're claiming that women and minorities can't keep up with the white men who'd be the alternative choice.

Devil's advocate: forcing a balance has the potential of reducing ability, it also has the potential to boost it, but it's pure chance rather than a true meritocracy which, if it working properly, by definition must be the best way. So I guess, why take the risk?

[jellmoo]

Here's the thing. These women (and pretty much the entirety of the Trudeau cabinet) are immensely qualified for their positions. They include physicians, former cabinet postings, a nobel prize winner, a former party whip, former editor of Canada's largest news paper, etc... And that's just the women.

Among the men that are not white, we have a former university professor, a man who has been involved in improving Inuit and Native issues for years, and a defense minister that has done multiple tours in war zones, worked in special ops, and is a certified fucking bad ass.

Calling this move nothing more than pandering and keeping more qualified people from the positions in insulting. Sure, politics is always involved in these decisions. Absolutely. But these men and women are immensely qualified for their roles, and while they'll all stumble and grow throughout their time as cabinet ministers, they have all the ability in the world to succeed.

[LiiLoSNK]

LOL good job, Canada.

They need to gender balance strip clubs next. Those places refused to hire me for being a man and I'm getting pretty sick of the oppression.

[Endus]

Devil's advocate: forcing a balance has the potential of reducing ability, it also has the potential to boost it, but it's pure chance rather than a true meritocracy which, if it working properly, by definition must be the best way. So I guess, why take the risk?

The general point is that, in a meritocracy, people will be chosen based on merit, and nothing else. And given equal capacity, you'll see a fairly even mix, with trends on way answered by countervailing trends in the other, waffling back and forth.

That hasn't been the case, with ministerial positions, which have been predominantly held by men.

So there are two possible conclusions;

1> Women are just inferior creatures, which is why men get chosen more (misogynist argument), or
2> The selection process itself allows for misogynist pressures to affect candidate choices.

And in the case of #2, acting to counteract those pressures, as Trudeau is doing, is reasonable.

[sarahtasher]

Also, for the record for Americans, our PMs have way more power than your POTUS : since 1867, they have, and they do, choose whatever ministers they want, providing they have parlemantary support : no support, élections. Trudeau won the élections handily.

[Tijuana]

Definitely not how it works in Canada. Ministers give broad direction to their departments, but the departments run themselves; we have an extensive public service that is apolitical and serves whoever is in power. The only positions that change with an election are the ministers in charge. Unlike the USA, a Parliament "shutdown" won't stop any government services.

Uh, so it works exactly the same as in the US? Isn't that what I said? I said the cabinet members are the heads of their departments. Of course the departments still have other workers. I feel like I'm missing something here in your point...

[roent]

Calling this move nothing more than pandering and keeping more qualified people from the positions in insulting.

Shouldn't putting the most qualified people in positions of power its own reward?

The existence of such an award is insulting.

[purebalance]

And thanks for this very helfpul comment. I presume that you mean that white male are chose for their competence, and totally, totally not I tell you, because
-they speak French
-because their very white community back the party (Ukrainians, Italians
-because they fought against the separatists (M. Charisma, aka Stéphane Dion)
-because they are MP from X-town or Y-province, that is more in the Cabinet to represent his region than for managerial abilities.

You are not going to get much traction with the agitprop line ''hey, discrmination against white males,'' in Canada, since the mode is not to hate migrants (who speak English usually speaking) but the French-speaking Québécois....

Canada has a 0.99 male to 1 female ratio so if males are being overwhelmingly elected females only have themselves to blame so don't try to turn this into some patriarchy crap. Forcing women into positions based on gender not on merit is exactly what happening like the person you quoted and should not be applauded.

- - - Updated - - -

LOL good job, Canada.

They need to gender balance strip clubs next. Those places refused to hire me for being a man and I'm getting pretty sick of the oppression.

And male porn stars make less than women even in gay porn. SEXISM! GENDER WAGE GAP!

[muto]

I'm glad the award giver is more considered about gender equality than merit. /snicker

[Tennis]

I'm not doing your googling for you; nice try.

My point is, here in America, the backward hicks that we are, there are always women on the cabinet, and have been for some time. But then again, we aren't the ones who post endless threads about how great we are, now are we?

So you have no evidence to back your argument up?

[roent]

...That hasn't been the case, with ministerial positions, which have been predominantly held by men.

So there are two possible conclusions;

1> Women are just inferior creatures, which is why men get chosen more (misogynist argument), or
2> The selection process itself allows for misogynist pressures to affect candidate choices.

And in the case of #2, acting to counteract those pressures, as Trudeau is doing, is reasonable.

or

3> no female candidate was available / willing
4> no female candidate was superior to her male counterparts
5> those doing the selection were biased (#2 as you said... but also paying back favors, ignorant of superior female candidates)

- - - Updated - - -

So you have no evidence to back your argument up?

let me google that for you...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_female_United_States_Cabinet_Secretaries

[Frogguh]

Ideally the only identifying information for any candidate would be "Candidate A" and then their qualifications would be the sole criteria for selection.

In a not ideal world, the best we can do is have a "diverse" panel to make the decision together so no bias, conscious or not, is included. And if the black selector always picks black candidates, and the white guy always picks white guys, boot them off the selection team and find another.

Using race, sex, or any other arbitrary criteria for selection is discrimination, period.

[Tijuana]

So you have no evidence to back your argument up?

No, I don't need evidence to state an opinion. It is my opinion that this isn't really a big deal, as nearly all cabinets in the modern world have females. I am not such a forum rookie that I will fall for your "source please" games. You never even stated what you want a source for.

Your leader decided to pander to SJWs and is being given a SJW award for it. Nobody cares. Nobody thinks any differently about Canada because of this.

Skada Totals for Fucks Given: 0

[Hawgwash]

A sobbing woman is dragged out towards the podium at a congressional hearing. A gun is held to her head while she reads the carefully scripted words to an apathetic congress. As she drones on and on about the environmental bill, her mind cannot help but wander to that fateful day when the PC Police seized her from her cherished, uh, daycare job or some shit, and cruelly forced her to begin the life of a politician.

[Arewn]

Still don't agree with this.
His intentions may be good, but his methodology is misled and flawed.
This isn't "advancing diversity and gender equality", it's actively discriminating. And if you're going to go for the "equal representation" thing, at least do it right. His hiring pool was not 50/50 male/female. He had to heavily discriminate against men to reach a 50/50 split in his cabinet members.

[Bushtuckrman]

At least his supporters can smile while their country goes down the crapper. What's their dollar worth against America now? 70 cents? Not good for businesses and retailers in Canada if they buy goods from America to sell in Canada which I imagine is quite a lot. Prices will have to rise to compensate on just this alone.

I'd rather a leader who creates a strong economy, increases the workforce, improves education and improves the health system but hey I guess diversity is better cos its 2016. Hopefully the people Justin has chosen based on their gender, race and religion also happen to be the best people to steer Canada away from an inevitable disaster.

[sarahtasher]

At least his supporters can smile while their country goes down the crapper. What's their dollar worth against America now? 70 cents? Not good for businesses and retailers in Canada if they buy goods from America to sell in Canada which I imagine is quite a lot. Prices will have to rise to compensate on just this alone.

I'd rather a leader who creates a strong economy, increases the workforce, improves education and improves the health system but hey I guess diversity is better cos its 2016. Hopefully the people Justin has chosen based on their gender, race and religion also happen to be the best people to steer Canada away from an inevitable disaster.

It does not occur to you that Justin have been in power since two months and that the dollar slide might have something to do with oïl prices ?

[GrinningMan]

Oh boy an AWARD. Stop the presses, tell those assholes to stop killing people for a second because someone got an AWARD. Worldwide problems but let's all halt because someone got an award!

'You hear that Johnny Gunbo? That guy got an award!'

'No really? Well jeez I guess we should all pay attention to his award. Sorry about stabbing you before, that guy got an award so now I suddenly feel REALLY REALLY BAD about being a crook!'

[sarahtasher]

Also, arguing about competency in political nomination is pretty hilarious considering that in every country in the world, including the US the first and foremost condition to be a minister is ''be of the party in power''. Which at least excludes 50% the population, and in countries with more than two parties, up to 60%

[Arewn]

At least his supporters can smile while their country goes down the crapper. What's their dollar worth against America now? 70 cents? Not good for businesses and retailers in Canada if they buy goods from America to sell in Canada which I imagine is quite a lot. Prices will have to rise to compensate on just this alone.

I'd rather a leader who creates a strong economy, increases the workforce, improves education and improves the health system but hey I guess diversity is better cos its 2016. Hopefully the people Justin has chosen based on their gender, race and religion also happen to be the best people to steer Canada away from an inevitable disaster.

From what I understand, we mostly export to America (which is our main export), and it is as such beneficial to our businesses for our dollar to be weaker then theirs. To that end, we purposefully try to low ball it. In the past few years when our dollar caught up, and even surpassed for a short time, the American dollar, it was only because the American economy was so terrible that it wasn't worth tanking our own dollar that hard.

Maybe what I heard is mistaken though, I'm not that into economics so I wouldn't know.