Demonology: Whats the point of shadow bolt and soul fire being separate abilities?

[SuperomegaDN]

Why? shadow bolt and soul fire are too similar in my opinion. soul fire with a molten core proc is just a faster shadow bolt. currently my unbuffed soul fire's cast time is 3.63 and shadow bolt is 2.27. with molten core soul fire's cast time goes down to about 1.81. now if molten core affected shadow bolt, and reduced cast time by 20% instead of 50% the cast time would go down to 1.81! if molten core made shadowbolt always crit and allow crit to increase damage while it was activate then the only difference between live and my suggestion is that you save on a keybind.

[Elise the Seeker]

Won't matter in legion anyways.

[Sesshomaru]

Because Soul Fire deals more damage despite of Shadow Bolt (well, the crit, that is). Luckily, it gets removed. Never really liked SF, but liked it a lot more when it actually cost a Shard. Felt like it actually did pack a punch, while also punching my Shards for getting reduced one by one.

You need some abilities to differ from the norm. All Locks (mainly Destruction & Demo) did back in TBC was spamming SB, with an occasional Immolate/Corruption here and there. But yes, Molten Core (obviously not keeping the name) could have been modified to give SB crit and reduce cast time so that it would function just like how the current Molten Core + SF works.

[robgoblin]

pretty much its just for flavour purposes, soul fire used to cost a shard and hit like a truck, as they tried to reduce demos reliance on shards in mop it got moved over to a regular rotational ability, you could argue why it wasn't just rolled into shadowbolt, but you could say the same of a lot of abilities, like why doesn't pyroblast replace fireball when you get a proc, why doesn't mutilate turn into dispatch when the target is below 35% or you get a proc

the simple answer is blizzard WANTS you to have a few keybinds, if the game was reduced to one or two buttons that just flicked through your spells to automatically cast the "optimal" spell whenever you got a proc or reached a hp threshold, it would sap what little learning curve there is left in the game, alont with any historical "flavour" abilities that have changed in their role, but not in their graphic, or lore or whatever, burning a targets soul away with a concentrated burst of hellfire is rather "warlocky" after all

and like someone else said, it wont matter in a few months time anyway, since demo is being rebuilt from scratch

[Jessicka]

Why? shadow bolt and soul fire are too similar in my opinion. soul fire with a molten core proc is just a faster shadow bolt. currently my unbuffed soul fire's cast time is 3.63 and shadow bolt is 2.27. with molten core soul fire's cast time goes down to about 1.81. now if molten core affected shadow bolt, and reduced cast time by 20% instead of 50% the cast time would go down to 1.81! if molten core made shadowbolt always crit and allow crit to increase damage while it was activate then the only difference between live and my suggestion is that you save on a keybind.

If Molten Core changed Shadow Bolt differently to how it changes Soul Fire, then it'd be the same? Okay. The reason for the difference is because managing Soul Fire stacks - you don't just lump off your Soul Fires the moment MC procs (unless you're playing Demonbolt I guess, but that's niche for one talent's playstyle that deliberately removes the need for that management).

[Deleted]

should just give Shadow Bolt to Affliction, you know the 'master of Shadow Magic'

but of course that would make too much sense for the peon warlock designers

[Gaidax]

It's just a part of the design issue with current Demonology where it was lacking actual definition and was turned into a salad spec that tried to do everything at once and ended up being a mess.

Back in the day Soul Fire was basically a huge ass hardcore nuke that cost a soul shard and had 6 seconds cast time, but if it crit it would create a frikkin crater the size of Un'goro where the target was standing. Of course this was not some sort of rotational ability, it was a fun little thing to gang with and such or troll the raid and tanks by opening pull with it.

Over years Blizz incorporated it into rotation starting WoTLK where it was turned into badass execute and moving on... Every expansion more shit was tacked on to Demo and Soul Fire power was reduced to give space to other stuff in total damage done table. In the end we ended up with this pathetic thing now and it is going to get a bullet in it's head in Legion and be put out of its misery.

[Sylar Hao]

Soul Fire is a very cool spell animation wise, but they just don't know what to do with it. I wish it was part of the Destro toolkit as some sort of proc or something.

[Fuqup]

you can pool mc procs for your fury dump w/ cds, as opposed to being forced to use procs as they come up (and why even make it a proc at that point)

[Nadiru]

In the beginning, Affliction did Shadow damage, and Destruction did Fire damage, and Demonology did a mixture of Shadow and Fire damage. Above all of the other radically warped design elements Warlocks have endured over the years, this (along with "Demonology uses a Felguard") has remained remarkably constant, to the point where I'd be surprised if it wasn't in some list of Core Warlock Class Fantasies or whatever design document Blizz uses to make Warlocks these days.

[kenthazar]

yes! back molten core, if proc, turn shadow bolt into soul fire (blazing skull visual pls) and if you have greenfire, you blazing skull will be green to, and FREE! (yep, i hate green fire only do destruction )

[Jessicka]

yes! back molten core, if proc, turn shadow bolt into soul fire (blazing skull visual pls) and if you have greenfire, you blazing skull will be green to, and FREE! (yep, i hate green fire only do destruction )

Can someone explain how 'turns X spell into Y spell' sounds like an exciting mechanic, when ostensibly, it's just asking you to continue to press the same button?

[Gaidax]

Pressing extra buttons does not equal more fun. Your normal spell doing some freaky bullshit with a proc is however.

[Duckz0rs]

Pressing extra buttons does not equal more fun. Your normal spell doing some freaky bullshit with a proc is however.

Fun is entirely subjective. Some people find pressing more buttons fun, some people like "freaky bullshit with a proc" and some people find both fun. Whodathunk.

[Jessicka]

Pressing extra buttons does not equal more fun. Your normal spell doing some freaky bullshit with a proc is however.

Your spell doing "freaky bullshit" is literally no different from it Critting. There's nothing to react to, nothing changes. It's exactly why multi strike is being cut, because crit already exists. And why people take issue with Destruction's new mastery. There's no gameplay.

[Super Kami Dende]

Your spell doing "freaky bullshit" is literally no different from it Critting. There's nothing to react to, nothing changes. It's exactly why multi strike is being cut, because crit already exists. And why people take issue with Destruction's new mastery. There's no gameplay.

What is the difference if Spell A procs Spell B or Spell A becomes stronger by proc.

Literally pressing 2 instead of 1, makes it no more fun than just pressing 1 again.

[Jessicka]

What is the difference if Spell A procs Spell B or Spell A becomes stronger by proc.

Literally pressing 2 instead of 1, makes it no more fun than just pressing 1 again.

You can save the proc for adds or to stack with other procs. You know, how we do currently.

[Duckz0rs]

Is there honestly going to be a discussion about why someone finds something fun and why the opinion of someone else on what they find fun is wrong? Some people care more about mechanics, some care more about visual flair.

[Jessicka]

Is there honestly going to be a discussion about why someone finds something fun and why the opinion of someone else on what they find fun is wrong? Some people care more about mechanics, some care more about visual flair.

Well yeah, I guess some people want to play the game, others want the game to play itself for them.

[infernoclyde]

Well yeah, I guess some people want to play the game, others want the game to play itself for them.

Jessicka, shut the hell up.

The fact that the moderators have never done anything to you is truly baffling to me. You've pissed and moaned about the new direction of Demonology for long enough. You don't like it. We get it. But stop attacking people that do like the new direction of Demonology with your snarky and condescending comments. Warlock was always intended to be a "pet class" and summoning demons is probably the most signature and iconic ability of the Warlock. Warlocks should have a specialization that revolves around pets. Demonology is returning to its roots and becoming what it was always meant to be.

Sorry that you disagree with that, but I have a suggestion for you. Go play Affliction or Destruction and stop bitching. Or better yet, go play a different class and rid the Warlock forums of your embarrassing and puerile behavior.