Gaza farmers, shepherds forced to leave land after Israeli forces open fire

[Goldeneagle]

So much discrimination and hate towards Arabs/Muslims on these forums, you make fun of someone who points out an injustice, but since it's about Palestinians your reaction is "Meh!" and you make fun of it, so disappointing you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Well compared to what is going on in Syria the Balestinian's turned themselfs into a bad joke..

[Deleted]

dude, i gotta tell you..
you got things backwards

you're anti-israel, so i don't think it's worth talking with you..

I'm not.

but seriously, you know nothing about the politics of Israel and the Palestinians if you think what you said is remotely true.

What bit?
The nit about making the Palestinians accept Israels right to exist or the bit about the Likud party charter?

edit: but i'll sure love to see that likud charter you're talking about

The 'Peace & Security' chapter of the 1999 Likud Party platform rejects a Palestinian state.

"The Government of Israel flatly rejects the establishment of a Palestinian Arab state west of the Jordan river. The Palestinians can run their lives freely in the framework of self-rule, but not as an independent and sovereign state. Thus, for example, in matters of foreign affairs, security, immigration and ecology, their activity shall be limited in accordance with imperatives of Israel's existence, security and national needs."

on 16 March 2015, Netanyahu stated in the affirmative, that if he were elected, a Palestinian state would not be created.

Its amazing really If one were to alter Israel to Palestine and reverse, Im like 100% certain they would call that 'antisemitic' - But you know Hypocrisy, its a Virtue.
So yes i say again, please elect someone to the right of Bibbi.

[Notter]

I'm not.


What bit?
The nit about making the Palestinians accept Israels right to exist or the bit about the Likud party charter?



Its amazing really If one were to alter Israel to Palestine and reverse, Im like 100% certain they would call that 'antisemitic' - But you know Hypocrisy, its a Virtue.
So yes i say again, please elect someone to the right of Bibbi.

you're showing a charter from 17 years ago
what the hell man? XDDDDD
that's desperate.

and as someone who lives in israel, nethanyahu is saying for years that he's pro 2 states solution
so i'd like the exact source you're referring to.
and keep in mind, i really hate the guy, so no reason for me to defend him.

i didn't call you anti-semitic, i said you are anti-israel, which you clearly are.

edit: i bet what you're thinking about what he said, refers to the Palestinians declaring a one-side declaration that they will be a state through the UN.
which everyone was against.

[Deleted]

you're showing a charter from 17 years ago
what the hell man? XDDDDD

The quote is from 2015.
as for the new party charter:

The Likud Constitution[36] of May 2014 is more vague and ambiguous. Though it contains commitments to the commitments to the strengthening of Jewish settlement in the West Bank, it does not explicitly rule out the establishment of a Palestinian state.

yeah i mean i Feel the love.
Its almost as if those positions are mutually consistent.

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edit: i bet what you're thinking about what he said, refers to the Palestinians declaring a one-side declaration that they will be a state through the UN.
which everyone was against.

Why was that again?
I mean if he is for a Palestinian state, Oh wait, that's the fucking issue isn't it.

[Notter]

Why was that again?
I mean if he is for a Palestinian state, Oh wait, that's the fucking issue isn't it.

so you admit you know nothing about the politics here, yet you like talking big.
alright.

the reason was that israel's terms for allowing a 2 state solution, is that the palastinian state will recognize the legitimacy of israel as a country.
and that they will guarantee the safety of israel, and not attack us.
seems reasonable.
they refuse.
and that does not contradict the fact israel goal is a two state solution.

[zmp]

Israel is always right. To say otherwise is anti semetism.

[Deleted]

so you admit you know nothing about the politics here, yet you like talking big.
alright.

I Know a bit about Israeli politics.

the reason was that israel's terms for allowing a 2 state solution, is that the palastinian state will recognize the legitimacy of israel as a country.

Which they have - Then you wanted to be recognized as a Jewish state, never mind that the Vatican isn't recognized as a catholic state.

and that does not contradict the fact israel goal is a two state solution.

there will never be peace until the settlements are gone, the settlements will never be gone until someone makes the settlers leave, If you have a realistic way that is nonviolent, please say so - but until then, I'm going with sanctions til kingdom come.

[Notter]

there will never be peace until the settlements are gone, the settlements will never be gone until someone makes the settlers leave, If you have a realistic way that is nonviolent, please say so - but until then, I'm going with sanctions til kingdom come.

i'm also against settlements.
but you're really naive if you think that's the reason why there's no peace.

they just want us dead or out, they don't want peace.
the settlements are just an excuse.

http://www.timesofisrael.com/poll-pa...come-minority/

[Deleted]

i'm also against settlements.
but you're really naive if you think that's the reason why there's no peace.

Didn't say that.
I said, there will never be peace until the settlements are gone - not that there will be peace if they are gone.

[Holas]

Didn't say that.
I said, there will never be peace until the settlements are gone - not that there will be peace if they are gone.

The settlements have ~400k+ people (maybe even more than half million). If you think that Israel can (even if wanted) to move this amount of people from their home then you are mistaken. If you think that the settlements are the obstacle to peace then you are even more mistaken.

If you are interested in Israel politics and especially in some recent history aspects, you might find this video interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRa9_PEMHVw
This vid also explains the false notion that the settlements is the obstacle to peace.

[Deleted]

The settlements have ~400k+ people (maybe even more than half million). If you think that Israel can (even if wanted) to move this amount of people from their home then you are mistaken.

Doesn't matter.
Maybe you shouldn't have stolen the land to begin with? - Oh that is what literally every other country thinks they are.

If you think that the settlements are the obstacle to peace then you are even more mistaken.

If you are interested in Israel politics and especially in some recent history aspects, you might find this video interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRa9_PEMHVw
This vid also explains the false notion that the settlements is the obstacle to peace.

Are you fucking delusional? - Israeli politics is 100% not relevant here because:
The Palestinians are never ever going to agree to any peace unless the settlements are theirs

[Notter]

Are you fucking delusional? - Israeli politics is 100% not relevant here because:
The Palestinians are never ever going to agree to any peace unless the settlements are theirs

They will never agree to any peace. period.
you know what their most famous chant is?
"From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free".

They want the whole of Israel, they really don't give a fuck about the settlements, it's just an excuse to pressure Israel.
The palastinians, in general, are just pawns in the hands of the major arab countries in the world.
and their goal is to end israel. not to make peace with israel.

[Holas]

Doesn't matter.
Maybe you shouldn't have stolen the land to begin with? - Oh that is what literally every other country thinks they are.

I don't see paying money and buying my own land to begin with (that got occupied by arabs) as "stealing", I see it more as being a sucker but sure, whatever makes you happy.

I can guess you didn't see the vid I linked yet. Not all the "truth" to be learn on the Israeli-balestine conflict appears in BBC and al-jazeara.

The only bright point is that soon you will have the exact same shit in europe (arabs will claim for the lands there) so I just can't wait to see your response then. Maybe you can share it? why DID the europeans steal the land from the arabs? and what will it take for you to return it to them and evacuate the non-muslims from these regions?

[Deleted]

I don't see paying money and buying my own land to begin with (that got occupied by arabs) as "stealing", I see it more as being a sucker but sure, whatever makes you happy.

I can guess you didn't see the vid I linked yet. Not all the "truth" to be learn on the Israeli-balestine conflict appears in BBC and al-jazeara.

The only bright point is that soon you will have the exact same shit in europe (arabs will claim for the lands there) so I just can't wait to see your response then. Maybe you can share it? why DID the europeans steal the land from the arabs? and what will it take for you to return it to them and evacuate the non-muslims from these regions?

See there is this minor distinction - the people we stole it from? They are dead.
Yours, Not so much.

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They will never agree to any peace. period.

Okay - The entire rest of the world still thinks those parcels of lands are Palestinian.

"From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free".

They want the whole of Israel, they really don't give a fuck about the settlements, it's just an excuse to pressure Israel.
The palastinians, in general, are just pawns in the hands of the major arab countries in the world.
and their goal is to end israel. not to make peace with israel.

And there are no Israelis who want all Palestinians gone - Oh wait, there are.

[unbound]

Can you believe this. They're just trying to farm and raise their animals and they're fired upon. Can you imagine what it's like to not even be able to make a living for yourself.

http://www.maannews.com/Content.aspx?id=770858

So...the site is clearly pro-Palestinian, so it would be useful if you found a neutral news source on the subject. While the Israeli are certainly guilty of many atrocities, it is hard to know if this was a legitimate event or not.

Keep in mind, that many in the US (including on this site) are pro-Israel (we have a lot of Israeli propaganda in the US...heck, they even sent Israelis to my high school in the mid-West just to push the PR)...so this is an even more important reason to provide a neutral source.

For those not familiar with the conflict, here is a great 10 minute video that is about as neutral as you can get - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRYZjOuUnlU

[May90]

Okay - The entire rest of the world still thinks those parcels of lands are Palestinian.

That's because most people are uninformed. If they spent some time studying what Palestinian regime actually is like, they would know that those lands as a part of Palestine would be essentially breeding ground for terrorists. And if Palestine succeeds at destroying Israel as a state... Well, ISIS will look like an innocent child in comparison to what will grow out of that.

There is a large confusion in the minds of most people. They think that Israel and Palestine both want peace but just suck at achieving it. Nope. Israel does want peace, but Palestine doesn't. Palestinian government is essentially a bunch of Islamist extremists. Vowing to end Israel is how they get their support from the population. If there is no conflict with Israel, there is no reason for that government to exist, and it will be replaced soon by a more peaceful group in case Palestine is at peace with Israel.

So no, Israel is hardly doing a perfect job, but it is not the source of the problem. When a government having succeeded at providing its people with high quality of life is at a dispute with essentially a terrorist government, there is little room for interpretation on who is to blame for that dispute.

[Notter]

Okay - The entire rest of the world still thinks those parcels of lands are Palestinian.

And there are no Israelis who want all Palestinians gone - Oh wait, there are.

1.the rest of the world also accept terrorists in masses into their countries, that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.
and it already came to bite them in the ass.
soon they'll change their mind.

2. do you know what's the difference between "there are people who think X" and "Most people think X"?
the vast majority of Palestinians want israel destroyed. completely.
the vast majority of israelis, want peace.
there's a big distinction there.

[Mayhem]

1.the rest of the world also accept terrorists in masses into their countries, that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.
and it already came to bite them in the ass.
soon they'll change their mind.

2. do you know what's the difference between "there are people who think X" and "Most people think X"?
the vast majority of Palestinians want israel destroyed. completely.
the vast majority of israelis, want peace.
there's a big distinction there.

You are the most qualified person to tell people the difference between many, some, a few and none.

[Deleted]

1.the rest of the world also accept terrorists in masses into their countries, that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.
and it already came to bite them in the ass.
soon they'll change their mind.

About letting them in? sure - That all Israeli settlements on the Palestinian side are illegal land grabs? - Don't think so.

2. do you know what's the difference between "there are people who think X" and "Most people think X"?
the vast majority of Palestinians want israel destroyed. completely.
the vast majority of israelis, want peace.
there's a big distinction there.

Did you know that the polling for peace in Palestine has gone down? - That's because your settlements keep stealing more and more land, your politicians keep adding in nonsense in negotiations like, 'being recognised as a Jewish state' - The stumbling block to peace, is more Israelis actions than Palestinians at this point.

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That's because most people are uninformed. If they spent some time studying what Palestinian regime actually is like, they would know that those lands as a part of Palestine would be essentially breeding ground for terrorists.

We are talking about the settlements, what the Palestinians do on their soil is not in question.

There is a large confusion in the minds of most people. They think that Israel and Palestine both want peace but just suck at achieving it. Nope. Israel does want peace, but Palestine doesn't. Palestinian government is essentially a bunch of Islamist extremists. Vowing to end Israel is how they get their support from the population. If there is no conflict with Israel, there is no reason for that government to exist, and it will be replaced soon by a more peaceful group in case Palestine is at peace with Israel.

The entire religious right want the entire country piece by piece - They want a one state solution.

So no, Israel is hardly doing a perfect job, but it is not the source of the problem. When a government having succeeded at providing its people with high quality of life is at a dispute with essentially a terrorist government, there is little room for interpretation on who is to blame for that dispute.

You mean the people who invaded the land in the first place?
going back to history is not terribly helpful, but if we are arguing blame, Israel coming into existing is the cause for the conflict.
Lets talk the 'Lehi' Know what they did?
They massacred arabs just to get them to move out so there could be an Israel - Fun fact, The Lehi ribbon is an IDF award.
That's as if the Germans still handed out the Totenkopf - Somehow i think Israel would have a problem with that one.

[Guy4123]

See there is this minor distinction - the people we stole it from? They are dead.
Yours, Not so much.

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Okay - The entire rest of the world still thinks those parcels of lands are Palestinian.


And there are no Israelis who want all Palestinians gone - Oh wait, there are.

Unless the rest of the world is gonna do something about it besides flailing their arms about at the UN then it doesn't really matter what they think. Israel is going to do what it wants and theirs nothing you can do about it without using force which no one is willing to use against Israel, not even the surrounding Muslim countries after losing wars constantly against them.


Still a better country than whatever Palestine would turn into if they made their own state. It would just turn into a bigger version of Gaza, probably with a Hamas style government taking it over and making a home base for shits like ISIS.