Are we the average raider? better? worse?

[Caliph]

raiders have gotten better, and addons have gotten better, and classes are easier now so yes you're average. but that's ok because raiding is easy until mythic. If everyone was as interested as before you'd be further down. Now no one cares and just goes into normal or gold runs and does whatever they want.

i stopped raiding in WoD before even killing blackhand i got so bored. So i think a lot of good or better than average raiders don't even care anymore.

at least that's what i've seen.

[Deleted]

raiders have gotten better, and addons have gotten better, and classes are easier now so yes you're average. but that's ok because raiding is easy until mythic. If everyone was as interested as before you'd be further down. Now no one cares and just goes into normal or gold runs and does whatever they want.

i stopped raiding in WoD before even killing blackhand i got so bored. So i think a lot of good or better than average raiders don't even care anymore.

at least that's what i've seen.

You're right about that one.

A lot of the actual good players are simply gone because of how damn dumb the game is with it's raid setting. By which I mean, hurr durr... normal(1st tier) - heroic(already bored to bones once done) - mythic..(yawn, wiping again).

[Bigbazz]

Top 4000 at this point means you're below average for a good raiding guild, I remember quite some time back top 1500 guilds dieing in their masses at Gorefiend before Blizzard added + ilvl. You probably have some really good players, some fairly ok players and a few substandard. You probably have time or commitment issues that hold your guild back, you probably lack in preparation and leader skills to some degree and you're probably struggling with recruitment and general motivation.

Generally I'd imagine your raid is not well versed in reading logs in order to find mistakes/problems and addressing them directly to learn from them, you might have some players who would be defensive towards criticism, though it's likely you don't put too much effort into this side of raiding analysis. Your best players are probably doing it from a personal standpoint.

That said you've come this far so you have promise, determination will probably take you all the way to 13/13 before Legion is out. That is my educated guess assesment of your guild without knowing you, coming from my experience of being in a top 250 guild and a top 900-1500 guild.

[Kreeshak]

Top 4000 at this point means you're below average for a good raiding guild, I remember quite some time back top 1500 guilds dieing in their masses at Gorefiend before Blizzard added + ilvl. You probably have some really good players, some fairly ok players and a few substandard. You probably have time or commitment issues that hold your guild back, you probably lack in preparation and leader skills to some degree and you're probably struggling with recruitment and general motivation.

Generally I'd imagine your raid is not well versed in reading logs in order to find mistakes/problems and addressing them directly to learn from them, you might have some players who would be defensive towards criticism, though it's likely you don't put too much effort into this side of raiding analysis. Your best players are probably doing it from a personal standpoint.

That said you've come this far so you have promise, determination will probably take you all the way to 13/13 before Legion is out. That is my educated guess assesment of your guild without knowing you, coming from my experience of being in a top 250 guild and a top 900-1500 guild.

What you guess is correct for the most part, if not all.

[Spotnick]

I agree to a point. But take Fel Lord for example. On normal, the waves don't matter. Heroic, whole different story

That was a gigantic tuning problem.

[Sylvaeres]

That was a gigantic tuning problem.

Very good point sir

[buffalowbie]

You need to give more context with 9/13M. Also, why are you asking this? Is it so you can pat yourself on the back?

Did you skip Gorefiend?
Because you can faceroll the first 5, and at least 3 of upper (Iskar, Soc and Fel Lord). And if you have a healers and tanks with half a brain you can get Tyrant easily as well. I'd say most guilds this tier are going to be able to brute force 5/13M without a Gorefiend skip and 9/13M with one.

[Kreeshak]

You need to give more context with 9/13M. Also, why are you asking this? Is it so you can pat yourself on the back?

Did you skip Gorefiend?
Because you can faceroll the first 5, and at least 3 of upper (Iskar, Soc and Fel Lord). And if you have a healers and tanks with half a brain you can get Tyrant easily as well. I'd say most guilds this tier are going to be able to brute force 5/13M without a Gorefiend skip and 9/13M with one.

I explained in the OP why I ask:

I want to put some perspective into our performance.

We have killed Gorefiend 5 times, last two on the first try of the night. We haven't killed Velhari yet.

[chooi]

If you're killing mythic bosses at all then you're not an average raider compared to all raiders, as most people raiders never step foot into mythic.

*ding ding ding ding* We got a winner!