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  1. #21
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    hey guys we did it wrong in the past, u know back when people were stupid... so lets continue it forever
    There's a strong argument to be made that noncitizen taxpayers should be eligible to vote in certain elections.

    What happened to no taxation without representation? Or was that just another bullshit talking point of American mythology.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    hey guys we did it wrong in the past, u know back when people were stupid... so lets continue it forever, cause we are apparently stupid as well. i almost wish my family didnt go thru the process to make me legal, why bother?
    Representatives represent all the people living there. Someone who's undocumented is still a member of society, still part of the economy, and still a person living in that district.

    They didn't do it wrong in the past. They aren't doing it wrong now. People living in the middle of nowhere already have disproportionate representation in their favor: it's called the senate. We don't need the House of Representatives to become a bigger version of the Senate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    There are no 2 species that are 100% identical.
    Quote Originally Posted by Redditor
    can you leftist twits just fucking admit that quantum mechanics has fuck all to do with thermodynamics, that shit is just a pose?

  3. #23
    Merely a Setback Reeve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    There's a strong argument to be made that noncitizen taxpayers should be eligible to vote in certain elections.

    What happened to no taxation without representation? Or was that just another bullshit talking point of American mythology.
    I have a number of British non-citizen residents I work with that all have a big laugh about the "no taxation without representation" line. That said, I'm not in agreement with that argument.
    'Twas a cutlass swipe or an ounce of lead
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    And the scuppers clogged with rotting red
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  4. #24
    The representatives are chosen for servicing the factual population, whether it is eligible for something or not. Why is that even an issue?

  5. #25
    The Insane Masark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tackhisis View Post
    Why is that even an issue?
    Because doing it another way would be beneficial for a certain party.

    Warning : Above post may contain snark and/or sarcasm. Try reparsing with the /s argument before replying.
    What the world has learned is that America is never more than one election away from losing its goddamned mind
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    There's a strong argument to be made that noncitizen taxpayers should be eligible to vote in certain elections.

    What happened to no taxation without representation? Or was that just another bullshit talking point of American mythology.
    why do people have the notion they pay federal and/or state income tax? all you have to write is exempt and they take 0 dollars out... how do you not know this?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Garnier Fructis View Post
    Representatives represent all the people living there. Someone who's undocumented is still a member of society, still part of the economy, and still a person living in that district.
    yet we dont want them to be living here... mixed messages should not be sent... or we end up with people like you

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tackhisis View Post
    The representatives are chosen for servicing the factual population, whether it is eligible for something or not. Why is that even an issue?
    because they are here illegally at the failure of the US government and are criminals on the run. we are the silliest nation in the world when it comes to border laws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Masark View Post
    Because doing it another way would be beneficial for a certain party.
    so that is really what it comes down to, make the democrats stronger at the expense of the country and our laws. whatever works i guess.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    so that is really what it comes down to, make the democrats stronger at the expense of the country and our laws. whatever works i guess.
    People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

    At least, the democrats aren't running off to poison water in their home nation or trading off their military personnel to other countries for political benefit.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

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  8. #28
    Wait! People actually had a notion that anyone in power was willing to lose it by redistricting pretty much the entire US and whatever part of the US they are representing? Believing this would happen is like congress not giving themselves a raise when the country is in recession? lol
    Last edited by Barnabas; 2016-04-11 at 06:18 AM.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    yet we dont want them to be living here... mixed messages should not be sent... or we end up with people like you
    It doesn't matter whether we want them here or not. They're here. They get counted. As was pointed out earlier, this is so basic that even the most conservative justices didn't argue against it.

    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    because they are here illegally at the failure of the US government and are criminals on the run. we are the silliest nation in the world when it comes to border laws.
    Not all of them committed a crime. Improper entry into the U.S. is a crime; a misdemeanor. But something like 30-50% of illegal immigrants are Visa overstays or people who otherwise have an unlawful presence without committing improper entry. Unlawful presence is not a crime. It's a civil offense. You can't jail someone or charge them with a crime if all they're doing is not being here illegally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    There are no 2 species that are 100% identical.
    Quote Originally Posted by Redditor
    can you leftist twits just fucking admit that quantum mechanics has fuck all to do with thermodynamics, that shit is just a pose?

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Garnier Fructis View Post
    It doesn't matter whether we want them here or not. They're here. They get counted. As was pointed out earlier, this is so basic that even the most conservative justices didn't argue against it.



    Not all of them committed a crime. Improper entry into the U.S. is a crime; a misdemeanor. But something like 30-50% of illegal immigrants are Visa overstays or people who otherwise have an unlawful presence without committing improper entry. Unlawful presence is not a crime. It's a civil offense. You can't jail someone or charge them with a crime if all they're doing is not being here illegally.
    No you deport them in both cases.

  11. #31
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    No you deport them in both cases.
    If they aren't causing trouble and are living productive lives - why should we?
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by sarahtasher View Post
    Ah, so Mastah Trump plan to deport the SCOTUS that don't agree with him. I suppose this is another ''LIBURAL PLOT'' to suggest that it's remarkably not what the Constittuion meant by ''separation of powers (you know, in the sissy parts that don't talk about guns)

    Incidentally, I'm not sure of the part about ''make a list of their names''...you think that the identitty of SCOTUS members is a super sekrit ?

    Maybe in your home, deep in Zul Aman. Or Farak. Or Gurub. Or Drak.
    He meant, good, have the undocumented and illegal immigrants counted so that ICE can find them and deport them. And I completely agree with that sentiment. I don't get why the fuck being squarely against ILLEGAL immigration makes you a fucking racist. We have laws for a reason, and I don't give a fuck why you're here, if you're here illegally, you should be deported. Everyone else is expected to follow the law, so why the fuck does being an immigrant make you special? We have a legal process to immigrate, follow it. And if you're one of those who think that the immigration process is too difficult and expensive (and I do agree that it is), then vote for people who will make the process easier and less expensive.

    And in case it isn't clear enough, being against ILLEGAL immigration does not at all mean you're a racist or hate immigrants, or want immigrants deported. I just want the laws of my country fucking followed. Nothing more, nothing less. If you want to live here, follow the fucking law like everyone else, including the laws that lay out how to live here permanently.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    If they aren't causing trouble and are living productive lives - why should we?
    Its the governments most important obligation, to protect our borders from invasion. You don't have anything without security over who comes in.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimboa24 View Post
    He meant, good, have the undocumented and illegal immigrants counted so that ICE can find them and deport them. And I completely agree with that sentiment. I don't get why the fuck being squarely against ILLEGAL immigration makes you a fucking racist.
    Because a lot of the rhetoric against illegal immigrants is mixed in with slurs based on their ethnicity and "protecting our culture" or garbage of that sort.

    We have laws for a reason
    We do! The reason being the benefit of society - the current immigration policies are not working in this regard.

    I just want the laws of my country fucking followed.
    I really hope you hate jaywalkers this much, since being an illegal resident is about as illegal as that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    Its the governments most important obligation, to protect our borders from invasion. You don't have anything without security over who comes in.
    Cool story. The undocumented migrants people are bitching about aren't a national security risk.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    No you deport them in both cases.
    Literally not even what we were talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    There are no 2 species that are 100% identical.
    Quote Originally Posted by Redditor
    can you leftist twits just fucking admit that quantum mechanics has fuck all to do with thermodynamics, that shit is just a pose?

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    If they aren't causing trouble and are living productive lives - why should we?
    Well of course, captain obvious, if someone is obeying the terms of their visa they shouldn't be deported. If they aren't then they should be removed.

  17. #37
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    Well of course, captain obvious, if someone is obeying the terms of their visa they shouldn't be deported. If they aren't then they should be removed.
    Again, visa aside, if they are not making trouble and living productive lives why should we?
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  18. #38
    Herald of the Titans Xisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    People ineligible for voting have always been counted even since the foundation of the United States, what else is new.
    That privilege was generally extended to Citizens.

    Counting non-citizens in reference to voting districts gives them a degree of control over the electoral process, which is absolutely absurd.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Again, visa aside, if they are not making trouble and living productive lives why should we?
    Because they are not allowed to vote unless they're citizens, and being able to influence Congressional districts effectively gives them electoral power.

    That's a problem.
    I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes
    Or should I?

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Garnier Fructis View Post
    Literally not even what we were talking about.
    Yes it is because if you don't even report an address change that is grounds to remove you from the country. So your entire premise about unlawful presence is the reason most people are deported is false and no point in being debated any further.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post

    Cool story. The undocumented migrants people are bitching about aren't a national security risk.
    The borders are wide open, its an endless flood that has already overwhelmed our courts and border patrol. We don't know who is here, best to ship them all back and choose who we want to allow in.

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