Spoilers: Who is right? Captain America or Iron Man?

[jellmoo]

The biggest issue here is Thor. More specifically Asgard. It played out in the comics with Thor coming to an agreement with Iron Man (after slapping the piss our of him at his leisure) where Asgard is seen as a unique political entity and therefore not subject to the Registration Act, but when you have a world inhabited by gods that could tear the human race apart 17 times before lunch without breaking a sweat, man made laws are impractical and unfeasible.

In reality, the biggest problem with Civil War is that Iron Man was clearly the villain. It came down to bad writing. Instead of two diametrically opposed sides both with valid points, it turned it Captain America being the good guy and Iron Man (and the pro-registration side) turning into cartoonish villains.

The individual that came off the best out of the whole event was Thing, with his "Fuck this, I'm moving to France!" attitude.

[Deleted]

If I had superpowers I'd use them for my ideals and how I think the world would be better off...I wouldn't give a damn about acting all goodie. I'd be the hero the world needs, not the one it wants.

So fuck the government.

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Yeah that's right, but that feels too far in the other direction now.

His name is Captain America.

Which was given to him before he took charge of his own purpose.

[yamilonewolf]

I don't agree that they need oversight or to be ruled, when they have the best intrest of us at heart. , i do agree that their names and powers should be documented in a secure location. That way when a guy wearing the Ironman suit robs a bank because he snapped, people know who did it (tho they know who iron man is but the point stands.)

The Problem with the super hero registration act is that it isn't enforceable with out leading to super hero on super hero fighting.


Do YOU want to be the one to tell the hulk he needs to register or he will be given a ticket/attacked what ever the punishment was... I sure as hell don't. and if one of the big players decides they don't want to register, theres not a human around that could make them. You'd need super hero enforcment ...and thus the civil war.

two quotes come to mind.

With great power comes great responsibility.
With great power comes great opportunity to abuse that power.

[TheSweetness]

I think Stan Lee said it best, "Whatever side Captain America was on, because he's the best, pure-hearted person in the whole world."

[Snuke]

Team Cap because...well...look at my avatar.

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While the exact details of the movie are still largely unknown, in the comics Captain America most certainly did not have this stance. Mostly proven by the fact that he fights super powered people...aka supervillains.

His line of thinking was...if government controlled the heroes...how long would it take for government to take the heroes and point them at the "enemy".

Sure he did. It's all the subtext.

[Anastacy]

Sure he did. It's all the subtext.

I mean...there's what happened, and then what someone wants to believe happened.

I can't change your mind from picking the latter, so.../shrug.

[Snuke]

I mean...there's what happened, and then what someone wants to believe happened.

I can't change your mind from picking the latter, so.../shrug.

Did he or did he not go on a rampage that made the general populace terrified?

[Shadowferal]

Two options: registered powered beings apprehend or eliminate 'majors' or nations declare war on so-called 'majors'.

A third option for some: Simply leave them alone.
The Hulk never wanted any trouble. He never goes around starting any. He always wanted to be left alone. But someone always drags Banner back in play.
Some of these majors are undefeatable. (At least in the comic books.) Leave them alone and they'll leave everyone else alone. If they get dragged back in play, it's typically because some "bad guy" thought he was badder than the other.

The thing with the Super Powered Registration in the comics, and a lot of people seem to forget this, is that you have a choice. Join up or be locked up for the rest of your life.

Unless you're a "major," then yeah, you're screwed over for life.
On the upside, you're on the government payroll.

Do YOU want to be the one to tell the hulk he needs to register or he will be given a ticket/attacked what ever the punishment was... I sure as hell don't.

Iron Man told Thor he had to register...it didn't go down well. At all. (The initial outcome had Stark telling the government and SHIELD to leave him alone...)

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While the exact details of the movie are still largely unknown, in the comics Captain America most certainly did not have this stance. Mostly proven by the fact that he fights super powered people...aka supervillains.

His line of thinking was...if government controlled the heroes...how long would it take for government to take the heroes and point them at the "enemy".

Ya..I posted these earlier:

Maria Hill meets Cap

The word "rebel" gets used

Anti-Superhuman Response Unit, and we want you to lead it Cap

He said "No," so they tried to arrest him on the helicarrier
.
.
.
.
(Maria Hill and Steve Rogers do eventually kiss and make up )

[Anastacy]

Did he or did he not go on a rampage that made the general populace terrified?

I'm not saying he didn't publicly fight for his viewpoint.

Hell, I didn't even say whether I thought he was right or wrong.

I was disagreeing with your over exaggerated assertion that he felt that super powered people should be able to do whatever they wanted.

[Dasffion]

Yeah that's right, but that feels too far in the other direction now.

His name is Captain America.

Freedom and justice are the ideals of America. You're not making the argument you think you are

[Witchblade77]

That would defeat the point of the movie really.

"Hey I have a modest, moderate compromise."

"Hey this is great, thanks!"

*Captain America and Iron Man stare at the Audience for an hour before credits*

hey who knows, maybe after kicking each others butt, they will end up coming up with a compromise anyways? what, one could only hope....

[Raldazzar]

So, in honor of the new movie coming out, lets talk super heroes! In the upcoming movie, it has a long lasting debate separating two groups of super heroes.

The debate: After massive amounts of collateral damage incurs after saving the world, the government moves to enact a policy that creates a system of accountability for the heroes.

The sides:
Captain America believes the heroes should be able to continually act freely without government influence.

Iron Man believes that the new act is fine and supports them having some oversight.

Who do you side with and why?

I side with Iron Man. They really should have someone looking over their actions. Super heroes cause a lot of damage that they government would need to pay for. Destroyed buildings, damaged property, hurt civilians. All need to be paid for by the government.

I feel you have NO idea how many attacks and things lead to people dead because the guys in charge are thinking costs/'big picture' rather than saving human life. this would be the same..

oh, theirs a void in the sky? well, we don't KNOW these things are hostile, let's not act yet..

oh Hydra infected shield. right no, let's not worry too much about that, i mean, have they been THAT bad since ww2?!

the govt is quite widely known for making collosal screw ups at the most inoportune times!

100% team cap.

[Fencers]

A third option for some: Simply leave them alone.

I already covered this in previous posts. The conventions of the Marvel fiction are the only safeguard from mass human extinction in the light of a superpower beings on scale of Marvel Comic's presentation.

The Hulk doesn't want a fight because he is the hero of a fictional series. If such a being existed in a realistic sense (such as it is), there could be no guarantee the Hulk will just leave us all alone because deep down he's just really sad.

And really, the Hulk is just one example. Vigilantes such as Iron Man himself, Wolverine, Cyclops, Ultron, Doctor Doom, Namor, Black Bolt, etc, etc- we, humans, could not exist in a world where beings with that power level as a happenstance of their being get to walk around willy-nilly.

In the context of the fiction; this question is silly.

In the context of a fun thought experiment applied realistically; it can only be slavery or annihilation.

[Deleted]

Freedom and justice are the ideals of America. You're not making the argument you think you are

And as long as the government is not going against that you would think Captain America of all people would support the American government.

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Which was given to him before he took charge of his own purpose.

His own purpose being defending America.

[segara82]

And as long as the government is not going against that you would think Captain America of all people would support the American government.

And that right there is the mistake so many make. Cap is not FOR the goverment of the USA, he wants so symbolize the American Spirit of Truth, Justice and so forth. He leads by example, never demanding somebody to do something he himself is not willing to take and is therefore respected by his colleagues.
Not because he's a g-man.

[Deleted]

And that right there is the mistake so many make. Cap is not FOR the goverment of the USA, he wants so symbolize the American Spirit of Truth, Justice and so forth. He leads by example, never demanding somebody to do something he himself is not willing to take and is therefore respected by his colleagues.
Not because he's a g-man.

Yeah, Captain America really has nothing to do with America.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I'm on the Caps side. We shouldn't be punishing people for having superpowers. Ironman is still being whiny and guilty about his weapons being used for evil.... thats the main reason he is on that side, imo.

[Snuke]

I'm not saying he didn't publicly fight for his viewpoint.

Hell, I didn't even say whether I thought he was right or wrong.

I was disagreeing with your over exaggerated assertion that he felt that super powered people should be able to do whatever they wanted.

That's exactly what he was fighting for. So long as they agreed with him, at least. But that's how most tyrants go about gaining/keeping their power. You really are blinded by the fact that it's Captain America or some shit.

[Alydael]

I agree with Cap't America. "Government influence" is just a big negative to me. Those guys can't do anything right, I am surprised they are able to dress themselves in the morning.

[Glorious Leader]

We regulate doctors, lawyers, scientists, hell even taxi cab drivers and we do so for very good reasons. I see no reason that people with the ability to drop buildings on each other shouldn't have similar limits.

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I agree with Cap't America. "Government influence" is just a big negative to me. Those guys can't do anything right, I am surprised they are able to dress themselves in the morning.

The government does lots of things "right" all the time and has been for years. They planned and executed Omaha beach for example.