Mafia 71: Inanimate Objects! Game Thread.

[listo95]

Alright first of all, listo stop lurking plx.

Anyway Blood Fox I really don't like how you rescinded your claim yesterday. I think you let it go on for too long and by claiming cop there is a possibility you outed Arialla to scum. But you claimed you got good reactions, so I'd like to hear exactly what you got.

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Oh and Ret I'd like to hear your read on Senna.

The goose does not listen to a question mark.

[dupti]

But I'm a trustworthy question mark, you know that

[Xanjori]

I don't know what was dumber. Letting BF do the usual retarded shit or just randomly lynching Large with him having no time to defend himself.

[Graeham]

I will try and save Arialla.

[Crackleslap]

arialla has been brought back to life!

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

[dupti]

Interesting. Please do not reveal your result yet Arialla (if you got one).

[listo95]

I will try and save Arialla.

Hi Retributionist.

[dupti]

Since Arialla is confirmed town now and Graeham is 99.99% town as well that makes Blood Fox' train pretty interesting.

I believe this was his train at it's highest:
Blood Fox: Arialla, Graeham, Largehorn, Catta, Xan, Senna

Arialla and Largehorn confirmed town. Graeham pretty much conf. town.
If Blood Fox is town, there is most likely one scum between Catta, Xan and Senna, although it's possible both day 1 wagons were town in which case scum wouldn't care who they voted on and they could honestly have parked their vote wherever they wanted to. In fact I think scum might've wanted to avoid voting on a cop claim, so I wouldn't really expect there to be more than one scum there but who knows.

There is most likely a scum in Blood Fox, Catta, Senna and Xan though. I personally find Blood Fox the most suspicious (for reasons already stated). I'd like to hear his reads.
I also still don't like Ret, but I want him to answer my previous question.

[Arialla]

Well then. That was weird shit

[Catta]

I don't know what was dumber. Letting BF do the usual retarded shit or just randomly lynching Large with him having no time to defend himself.

I echo this. Blood fox being a tosser, people calling him out on it and people following him and then go "oh well, lets kill largehorn" when he then admits to lying.

[Arialla]

I got a result...and as the person who is innocent saved me...

Graeham is innocent

[Catta]

I got a result...and as the person who is innocent saved me...

Graeham is innocent

You know, I wasn't sure after he resurrected you.

Better lynch him to be sure though.

[Senna1251]

Hey everyone, I'm here.

Got a stupid cold so everything seems fuzzy, I'm working on some thoughts.

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Well, in such a small game, I don't think it's too early for some analysis. Though I think what I'm doing is more of a summary rather than an analysis, especially because I'm not going to include my scum/town leans. That isn't to say that I don't have any, but there are some responses I'm waiting on before I'm willing to spell those out. However, one thing I'm going to do is group the summaries into 2: Those who voted on Largehorn, and those who did not. I find it very unlikely that no scum voted on Largehorn yesterday, but I also find it unlikely that every single person who is scum this game was on Largehorn. Therefore, there should be some number in each group, and personally I found it helpful by isolating each group and seeing who I found suspicious in each. YMMV of course.

Typing these up now, they'll be in spoiler tags because I don't know how ridiculous this is going to be. Not as bad as last game I promise.

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Spoiler: 

testing to make sure I remember how to do this

[Reticence]

Well, that was unexpected.

Oh and Ret I'd like to hear your read on Senna.

Slightly conflicted, but still not a fan, particularly after re-reading her interaction with you, yesterday.

For starters, I thought your post (#99) echoed a fair amount of my own misgivings about her initial reaction. As a brief aside, I did think that was interesting, given your initial read of that reaction. I felt the shift was rather understandable given the exchange in (#95)/(#96), though, but I was curious if you had already reconsidered before that.

Continuing on, I didn't like her response to you, at all.

Your logic makes sense Dupti, I really don't have a counter argument for it. I guess you're right, I was conceding, because after you voted on me I thought, "I don't know how I'm going to get out of this." It's not really excusable.

Vote: Blood Fox

Not for sympathy, but trying to play this game and take care of 2 young children is really difficult.

Now, I think the word "slip" is misused and overused, but I do find the mindset of trying to get out of anything to be a questionable thing in itself. I also find it interesting that she called your vote out in particular, because it suggests she finds you particularly threatening.

As to why I am conflicted:
- She claimed VT and offered to be lynched in place of a possible cop. I normally would want to give her a town point for this, as the likelihood of scum 1-for-1ing a TPR claim with a VT claim is basically nonexistent, making it an unlikely play by scum. On the other hand, if she is town then it's strange that she would make this offer while knowing that he was lying about her.
- She seemed hesitant to vote for Blood Fox until you essentially convinced her that it didn't make any sense for her not to, despite supposedly knowing that he was lying. That sort of hesitance in any other context would make me think they are allies, except the rest of the situation renders that rather improbable.

I am also interested in hearing why Blood Fox reads her as town after that whole ordeal.

If Blood Fox is town, there is most likely one scum between Catta, Xan and Senna, although it's possible both day 1 wagons were town in which case scum wouldn't care who they voted on and they could honestly have parked their vote wherever they wanted to. In fact I think scum might've wanted to avoid voting on a cop claim, so I wouldn't really expect there to be more than one scum there but who knows.

There is most likely a scum in Blood Fox, Catta, Senna and Xan though. I personally find Blood Fox the most suspicious (for reasons already stated).

What reasons are those? Obviously Arialla's flip contributes, and I saw the reasons you gave Senna, but those seemed more from her PoV and I couldn't find any others that you stated. In particular, I'm curious as to why Blood Fox is at the top of your list today when you said that you already didn't believe him yesterday when you voted on Senna. Was your vote on her really just the choice of which claim we could afford to lose?

[JynxieJ]

I'm here! House shopping is stressful!

Anyway sad arialla was the cop and died! However yay she's alive. So arialla and graeham are confirmed town. Hopefully graeham will have more of his special mojo

I would like to hear from blood about why he took so long to rescind his fake claim. I also doubt all scum would have lumped together on large. Anyone else have any reads character or actions? I'll be around for an hour or so but will be on tomorrow after work or on lunch.

[Senna1251]

Ok, first group is the people who voted on and lynched Largehorn:

Spoiler: 

The number behind the name in the votes indicates position on the train

Blood Fox
Votes: Senna (1), Largehorn (1)
Summary: Claimed cop page 1 with a guilty on Senna, then rescinded page 6 stating that Senna is most likely town, and that his play was helpful for reads. I have two questions for you @Blood Fox What made you decide to go for Largehorn over Catta (who was your most preferred at one point)? What are your thoughts on Dupti?

Graeham
Votes: Blood Fox (2, because Anakso unvoted, but after Arialla), Largehorn (2)
Summary: has bias that Senna is town, which helped form his reasons around voting onto the BF train. Extremely active during the last part of the day during Largehorn lynch. Has allegedly saved Arialla, and Arialla has claimed innocent on Graeham. As conf-town as you can get without mod confirming it.

Senna
Votes: Virothe (1), Blood Fox (3), Blood Fox (6, due to unvoting), Largehorn (3)
Summary: Please feel free to do at your leisure.

Jynx
Votes: Senna (5), Largehorn (4)
Summary: Kept a very neutral stance on the BF/Senna debate, and while voting for me stated that he could have gone either way. Wasn't particularly invested in the Largehorn lynch, and gave irl excuse for absence.

Ret
Votes: Catta (2), Senna (4), Largehorn (5)
Summary: Doesn't have a statement initially on BF/Senna interaction, when changing his vote to me his cited reason was the same as Anakso's (no better reason on day 1 for voting). Later cites that he was ok with his vote due to finding my reactions suspicious, which is a stance that continues into day 2 though maybe slightly more conflicted at this point.

Virothe
Votes: Arialla (1), Largehorn (6)
Summary: Commented that BF was just doing normal BF things as far as the claim goes, had one wacky post with multiple votes/unvotes, has created a point-based contribution system that has not been fully realized yet due to it being day 1, did not state reason for voting Large.

Arialla
Votes: Blood Fox (2), Largehorn (7)
Summary: Sorry, I didn't do one because mod-confirmed cop.

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Ok, second group is the people who did not vote on Largehorn:

Spoiler: 

Anakso
Votes: Blood Fox (1), Senna (3)
Summary: The vote on Blood Fox happened before Blood Fox claimed cop, stated afterward that the claim was BF doing BF things, but places vote on me because there's not a better reason for Day 1 than BF saying so. Has disappeared since.

Catta
Votes: Xanjori (1), Blood Fox (5)
Summary: Was around and fluffing, no reason for BF vote at time of voting, but later stated that because BF is full of it, now on day 2 is, I think it's accurate to say, disgusted with how page 6 went down after BF confessed to doing BF things.

Dupti
Votes: Anakso (1), Senna (5)
Summary: Stated early on that BF was just trying to get reactions, had interesting post early on which stated that Ret was probably scum, elaborated later that he was not a fan of Ret and Anakso's votes on me (me assuming that it was due to him town-reading my reactions to BF), was not a fan of lynching either BF or Senna even though was doubtful of BF cop claim, stated that Senna vote was less risky. Quite active, and as usual asking many questions.

Listo
Votes: No vote on record
Summary: disagrees with BF on where scum could be found (though retracts the statement somewhat at the end of the post), was active on mmoc during the last couple hours of the day but not in game thread so lurker status complete.

Xanjori
Votes: Catta (1), Blood Fox (6)
Summary: Stance on BF vs. Senna is that BF claim is full of shit, speculates that both BF and Senna are town but votes BF due to where trains where at at the time and not being able to be available for the rest of the day, now on day 2 is, I think it's accurate to say, disgusted with how page 6 went down after BF confessed to doing BF things.

[Blood Fox]

so first off why are blood fox things blood fox things?

half the people piss and moan when there is nothing productive on day 1.
half the people piss and moan when I do stuff to stop that from happening.

I'm going to be the villain in everyone eyes as usual. but I always love the " blood fox is doing blood fox things" comments that always show up, along with the why does everyone follow blood fox? If its not obvious by now then you need some help.

so lets see what my cop claim did:

1. stopped normal day 1 fluff
2. forced people to pick a side which likely spread out skum votes evenly into the categories of " vote on blood fox, vote on senna, and not participating"
3. forced a quick lynch which is full of information.

Stopping normal day one fluff was just for the lulz. Forcing people to pick sides in the debate is awesome because i believe it was town vs. town lynch options. which means any sane scum group would spread out their votes between the three options. now we play the find the skum in each category game. Finally a quick lynch tells us alot that weas can use later on.

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I don't know what was dumber. Letting BF do the usual retarded shit or just randomly lynching Large with him having no time to defend himself.

oh n o not a random lynch on day one where they have so much back up to defend themselves, OHHH NOOOOO!!!!

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Anyway Blood Fox I really don't like how you rescinded your claim yesterday. I think you let it go on for too long and by claiming cop there is a possibility you outed Arialla to scum. But you claimed you got good reactions, so I'd like to hear exactly what you got.

1.
do you honestly think I care for your opinion? next time direct your comments in a general manner that addresses the town if you want to make a point.
2.
lol what how did I out Arialla? I would have done the same shit if I was the cop.
3.
lol I'm not going to tell you shit. Try again with some effort

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also can we stop with the fucking charade of pretending to all be VT and admit we all have power roles?
k thankz

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doc here, will protect myself tonight as proof, mafia please try to kill me to confirm.

[Virothe]

Virothe
Votes: Arialla (1), Largehorn (6)
Summary: Commented that BF was just doing normal BF things as far as the claim goes, had one wacky post with multiple votes/unvotes, has created a point-based contribution system that has not been fully realized yet due to it being day 1, did not state reason for voting Large.

Reason for voting Large: We were only a couple hours out and the next largest train had less than half the amount of votes needed for a lynch. So I felt if I didn't vote we were not going to get a lynch.

I didn't really have a reason to support any wagon, I was fine with a Blood lynch but I just had serious doubts that would be able to happen when I switched. So I went for Large.

[dupti]

What reasons are those? Obviously Arialla's flip contributes, and I saw the reasons you gave Senna, but those seemed more from her PoV and I couldn't find any others that you stated.

I'm not sure I understand, do you disagree with my logic?

If Blood Fox is town, then I'd be very surprised if a scum didn't vote on him. Since we know now three out of six are confirmed town that leaves us a pool with 3. (Catta, Senna and Xan). If Blood Fox is scum then it obviously doesn't mean much, as scum could've been bussing.

In particular, I'm curious as to why Blood Fox is at the top of your list today when you said that you already didn't believe him yesterday when you voted on Senna. Was your vote on her really just the choice of which claim we could afford to lose?

I already explained this. I found Blood Fox the most suspicious out of the bunch because I didn't like how he rescinded his claim. It seemed to me more like he was trying to save himself than it was to save Senna, seeing as he was the leading train at that point.

As for my vote on Senna yesterday, then I explained that one as well. I'd never lynch a cop claim before a VT claim day 1, even thought the cop claim was most likely bullshit there was still a slight chance that it wasn't.

1.
do you honestly think I care for your opinion? next time direct your comments in a general manner that addresses the town if you want to make a point.
2.
lol what how did I out Arialla? I would have done the same shit if I was the cop.
3.
lol I'm not going to tell you shit. Try again with some effort

1. Why would I? You're the one who claimed "oh I got so many good reactions", but apparently you have absolutely nothing. I know you said where you thought scum would be yesterday, but listo openly disagreed with you so surely not everyone sees it the same way you do, so I honestly don't even understand why you're saying that I should direct my comments in a general manner that addresses the town, when it's you I want to hear from.
Anyway, I mean you know if you're town, so it's possible you got something that I didn't. But I do not know if you're town I also do not know Senna's alignment, so I honestly didn't get much from your called reaction test and I won't really be able to until we get more information. That is why I'm curious as to what you learned.

2. I'm not saying it did, I'm saying it is possible. The think the N1 kill on Arialla was a bit weird. I'd say it was either because they thought he was CC'ing you or because they have an agenda (like they don't want to kill the most active players right away like what happened last game).

3. I assume this means you have nothing to tell, kewl.

also can we stop with the fucking charade of pretending to all be VT and admit we all have power roles?
k thankz

This is interesting, seeing as no one else seems to want to touch this (at least so far), I'll.

I was actually thinking about the same thing, because in Crackle's last intermission game there was no VT's either (at least I believe it was in the last one).
I can confirm I am a tpr as well, Senna has claimed a VT.

So, does anyone else claim VT? Also please note if there are indeed VT's, we only need one more VT to claim as there is no reason to out all of them because it'd reveal all TPR's.

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Oh almost forgot. Ret the reason I asked you about Senna was because I didn't understand why you unvoted her yesterday when you found her suspicious.

[Senna1251]

Reason for voting Large: We were only a couple hours out and the next largest train had less than half the amount of votes needed for a lynch. So I felt if I didn't vote we were not going to get a lynch.

I didn't really have a reason to support any wagon, I was fine with a Blood lynch but I just had serious doubts that would be able to happen when I switched. So I went for Large.

I had assumed as much, but I was trying not to put words in everyone's mouth.

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I was actually thinking about the same thing, because in Crackle's last intermission game there was no VT's either (at least I believe it was in the last one).
I can confirm I am a tpr as well, Senna has claimed a VT.

So, does anyone else claim VT? Also please note if there are indeed VT's, we only need one more VT to claim as there is no reason to out all of them because it'd reveal all TPR's.

I'm not sure why you would ask this. If anyone answers you, even just one more VT, that's a lot more ammunition for scum in a game this size. If it's to testy the validity of my claim, I would rather that I was lynched than another VT revealed so scum know where to aim. Not saying I want to be lynched, simply which scenario I would prefer.

From a town point of view, I could care less for the most part which townies have power roles or not, I'm looking for who is scum.