1. #401
    I feel as though FotM would be more appropriately placed in a different talent tier, instead of trying to balance it along side ToF. Honestly, I've been playing ToF as a talent for so long I wish it were baseline, playing without fishing wouldn't even make sense to me.

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaesebrezen View Post
    I agree on that. Death's Embrace is a huge waste of points, and will just delay unlocking the better DPS stuff in the long run.

    Mass Hysteria is not necessary until raiding starts - which is roughly one month of time. Questing will net you 12 Artifact Traits, you need two more (still decently low cost) to reach MH if you go there first, and take the long route. Just that you have immediate access to Creeping Shadows (which is one of the better traits).

    Taking Death's Embrace will delay you unlocking all 3 major nodes by 3 trait points unless you skip Unleash the Shadows (which is bad).
    Do you have a source on the month until raids opens? WoD was a little over 2 weeks and I do not think they talked about increasing that time
    (they did talk about the time between HM and BRF)
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  3. #403
    Is there any number of Lingering Insanity stacks that would make it worthwhile NOT entering Voidform? I'm thinking if there were examples where BL was used on pull with a decent number of adds early in the fight to be able to SW: D, you might be able to start approaching 80+ stacks. So in that scenario, you loose all that haste on subsequent voidforms - would there ever be a point where holding onto lingering insanity could offset VFs 20% + Void Bolt bonuses? Gut reaction tells me that Mass Hysteria alone (and Legendary Shoulders of course) would be enough to make this undesirable, but I was curious if any of the more math savvy have better input

  4. #404
    If VTor is off cooldown, I would never forego activating VF. That being said:

    Let's assume an average stat of 30% haste, and averaging 30 stacks in VF.
    MB c/d @ 80% = 9/(1.3*1.8) = 3.85sec
    MB c/d @ 30% (max stacks in VF) = 6/(1.155*1.3) = 4.0sec average

    VT & SWP damage:
    80% haste = x1.8
    30% (max stacks in VF) = 1.155 * 1.2 * 1.31 = x1.816

    ...and access to Void Bolt.

    Conclusion:

    Even with ludicrous amounts of haste, VF should never be delayed for damage's sake because of how many multipliers we have on our dots. And Void Bolt.

    There is a point, though, where no amount of haste or crits will allow us to gain any more VF stacks w/o StM. Even with a full dispersion and 2 VTors, you need to be gaining 31 IPS in order to keep up with the bar, at your proposed 80 stacks, and unless you have baller crit streaks, this will most likely never be possible.
    Last edited by Ryeshot; 2016-07-28 at 08:29 PM.

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    Do you have a source on the month until raids opens? WoD was a little over 2 weeks and I do not think they talked about increasing that time
    (they did talk about the time between HM and BRF)
    Yeah, last time I heard it was 2 weeks before the raids opening.
    _____________________

    Homophobia is so gay.

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by KingdomOblivion View Post
    It is literally in what you quoted why I stated to go the shorter route to MH as oppose to the long way just to avoid the SW: D trait...If you feel like you can grind AP early (dungeon spamming, only a select few world quests give some) then sure go ahead the long route.

    Edit: We all know SoI is trash, obviously avoid going that way and just backtrack back towards the other way to Call to the Void.
    I disagree going the short way. Careful on tunneling the golden dragons so much. Normal traits can be just as good if not better. Going the long route will get us 18% SW:P, which is obviously huge combined with MH. Whereas going the short route would only net us 10% damage on SW and no scaling effect.

    Getting MH will be no issue at all by the first raid. The question is if we can get Call to the Void (2nd golden dragon) by then. But as long as we have % damage on SW:P, VT and VB I think we will be fine and ultimately worth going to the long route.

  7. #407
    Yeah, I think I'll go the long path. Accumulating the AP required doesn't seem so hard from my experience in the beta. I got 22 ranks on my main weapon (granted I played as Disc in beta) within 15 days of hitting 100. 22 ranks is the required points to get the two good Gold Dragons in Shadow (the long way). So while both might not be unlocked by the first raid unless I push harder than what I've done in beta, I think it's the better investment than going the short route.

    Thanks for the input folks.

  8. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by KingdomOblivion View Post
    It is literally in what you quoted why I stated to go the shorter route to MH as oppose to the long way just to avoid the SW: D trait...If you feel like you can grind AP early (dungeon spamming, only a select few world quests give some) then sure go ahead the long route.

    Edit: We all know SoI is trash, obviously avoid going that way and just backtrack back towards the other way to Call to the Void.
    No its not literally what you said. It is a huge, i repeat HUGE disadvantage of going the short route, you will lose 3!!! traits on nothing. dispersion CDR is literally better than that. You don't want to get stuck for 1 Month later in the addon on 3 traits to actual dps traits only because you felt like skilling MH the short way. It seems a little difference at first, but later the Traits get really expensive and you would lose about 3-4% dps within the first month of raiding

  9. #409

    Did shadow crash just get a nerf? (it triggers GCD now)

    Just this morning it was off the GCD, now it triggers it.

  10. #410
    Deleted
    Been following the thread and really didn't see anywhere specific about Artifact Traits. Is there any place where we can read and see a guide on what traits to follow up or prioritize?

  11. #411
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffosi View Post
    Been following the thread and really didn't see anywhere specific about Artifact Traits. Is there any place where we can read and see a guide on what traits to follow up or prioritize?
    I had planned on adding that in a couple of weeks. I have it all updated already just working on the formatting of it now. I'm also trying to condense it as atm I'm over the character cap for a post lol.

  12. #412
    Quote Originally Posted by Fascinate View Post
    Just this morning it was off the GCD, now it triggers it.
    What exactly?

    Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

  13. #413
    Quote Originally Posted by Palaryel View Post
    What exactly?
    Shadow Crash.

    It was from a new thread that I merged with this one. Title transferred, not sure if you can see that on Tapatalk.

  14. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffosi View Post
    Been following the thread and really didn't see anywhere specific about Artifact Traits. Is there any place where we can read and see a guide on what traits to follow up or prioritize?
    You have two general steps to do:
    - Go to Call to the Void and pick up Sinister Thoughts afterwards.
    - Go to Mass Hysteria over Unleash/SW:P/Dispersion Traits (recommended), or over Death's Embrace (not recommended).

    Depending on what content you do, when raids starts, how much you play, you choose either of these two steps, and then take the other.

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by Palaryel View Post
    What exactly?

    Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
    Like above, shadow crash. It's either an undocumented nerf or a bug. Its been off the GCD as long as i can remember (ive been on PTR a few weeks) and now it triggers the GCD in game.

  16. #416
    Quote Originally Posted by N1gh7h4wk View Post
    No its not literally what you said. It is a huge, i repeat HUGE disadvantage of going the short route, you will lose 3!!! traits on nothing. dispersion CDR is literally better than that. You don't want to get stuck for 1 Month later in the addon on 3 traits to actual dps traits only because you felt like skilling MH the short way. It seems a little difference at first, but later the Traits get really expensive and you would lose about 3-4% dps within the first month of raiding
    ???

    I LITERALLY said why one would go the short route vs. the long route(AP Cost), can you not read? Assuming raids open within 2-4 weeks, AP gains are gonna be SLOW as all hell. It is extremely tedious and ridiculous to try and farm AP with low Artifact Knowledge. Blizzard's system is currently 5 days for 1 artifact knowledge gain then 4 ish for the next and it's probably gonna stay that way for the first few Artifact Knowledge levels. Unless I'm reading into MH wrong, It provides the same buff the 'To the Pain' does at just 8 stacks of Voidform and further increasing it the longer you stay in it. Short way or Long way, you don't miss out on the dispersion CD reduction trait so idk why you even mentioned that. And you're reiterating what I've been stating with your last sentence(traits getting expensive)..
    Roland, Oscuridad of Sargeras
    <Design> 13/13M HFC - Recruiting

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by KingdomOblivion View Post
    I LITERALLY said why one would go the short route vs. the long route(AP Cost), can you not read? Assuming raids open within 2-4 weeks, AP gains are gonna be SLOW as all hell. It is extremely tedious and ridiculous to try and farm AP with low Artifact Knowledge. Blizzard's system is currently 5 days for 1 artifact knowledge gain then 4 ish for the next and it's probably gonna stay that way for the first few Artifact Knowledge levels. Unless I'm reading into MH wrong, It provides the same buff the 'To the Pain' does at just 8 stacks of Voidform and further increasing it the longer you stay in it. Short way or Long way, you don't miss out on the dispersion CD reduction trait so idk why you even mentioned that. And you're reiterating what I've been stating with your last sentence(traits getting expensive)..
    I remember someone saying that they were able to get MI unlocked right around 110. Is this not still the case? They went the long route too.

  18. #418
    I really hope SC being on the GCD is a bug. This talent sucks already, I'd rather have it not annoying.
    _____________________

    Homophobia is so gay.

  19. #419
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Djriff View Post
    I had planned on adding that in a couple of weeks. I have it all updated already just working on the formatting of it now. I'm also trying to condense it as atm I'm over the character cap for a post lol.
    Thank you so much for the reply. I will just wait for your update then.

  20. #420
    Anyone know what the best trinkets are right now for the Pre-Patch?

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