[7.2] Legion Shadow Priest Guide and Discussion

[Nyel]

Pretty sure that the Ring is the best Legendary for 5-man content due to trash being the biggest problem in most cases. Spreading your DoTs with one click is very decent. Another thing that could be very useful when 7.1.5 hits is the DoT refresh of the Ring. The best ST Legendary is the Belt, but I'm not sure if the Cloak isn't even better now.

[kalaratic]

the wrists are really fucking good on council fights with the buff it got and the cloak can put out 1 mil+ shadow word death crits so it's going to be interesting to see what can knock off the shoulders from the number 2 spot

[Dawnrage]

Eh, I would rank the cloak as our second best ST legendary next patch honestly. I don't think the shoulders are that great anymore, since the cloak does the same thing pretty much with the added bonus of tacking on damage (one SW: D gives you about 3-4 stacks of voidform with RoS, 1-2 with LI, if it procs at even a decent time + extra damage). IMO the ranking for ST is belt > cloak > wrist=shoulders > ring > everything else. For 10+ mythic+ fortified trash, I think it would go ring > sephuz > shoulders > wrist > belt=cloak > everything else.

Only way I would rank the shoulders above the cloak on ST is on a fight like EoA last boss where we are in execute the majority of the time, or a fight where we can use many SW: Ds on dying adds consistently. Even then the fight duration has to be much longer that we get multiple voidforms out of it, since the RPPM on the cloak and subsequently, the sheer damage buff to SW: D might win out on a short fight. SW: D is almost always 9%~ of my damage with the cloak on the PTR, not counting going into execute range. Even with cloak, LI is still the better talent.

Also our damage is pretty good on the current PTR. I don't know how other classes stack up with all the changes they got but we are doing real damage now outside of execute without S2M. I hate to say it but honestly LoTV is a really good talent now with all the changes, since it basically cuts off 30 insanity from when we can use voidform, as opposed to now where it's not a good idea to do it unless you are above 85~ insanity. On the PTR you can go into voidform asap with LoTV as soon as you hit 70 insanity and still overcap instantly. Not including our 4pc of course, which basically favors LoTV even more since we can spam more void bolts the faster we go into voidform. LoTV has too many benefits on the PTR since we can enter voidform asap, which means more dot refreshes translating to less time having to recast dots, more voidform uptime obviously, more LI uptime, more LI duration inside of voidform instead of outside, more void bolts, etc etc.

Dotting isn't that big a deal with void bolt refreshing them by 3 seconds. You almost never have to reapply dots with LoTV on pure single target without 4 pc, and with 4 pc, you never have to pretty much. Spread multi-dotting is a lot weaker now obviously, but I think we needed a nerf in that area anyway since we are still plenty strong keeping dots up on multiple targets especially with the buffs we got to them with increased duration and damage.

I just don't think Mindspike is that great after having messed with it a lot. The tradeoffs are just too big. If it was baked into the spec, I think it would be used sometimes, but right now, losing LoTV is too big a loss that Mindspike doesn't really make up. You would need some niche cleave situations for Mindspike to be worth taking, and the only fight in Nighthold I can think off the top of my head is Skorpyron maybe.

S2M is still a great talent but I think it's role is going to be relegated to hard enrage fights you want to burn down asap with hero. I don't think it's going to be practical to run S2M on every single fight like we currently do unless the fight is short enough to warrant it or the above mentioned.

[Arachnofiend]

What changes have happened that make going VF at 70 more appealing than 85? How do you cap to 100 after going in?

More insanity on all of your builders makes it pretty trivial to get to 100 regardless of when you enter VF.

[davesignal]

Especially when you get the four piece and can spend four seconds mashing Void Bolt to cap your insanity every time you enter Voidform.

[Dawnrage]

What changes have happened that make going VF at 70 more appealing than 85? How do you cap to 100 after going in?

A bunch of stuff.

1) More insanity on most of our generators (Mind blast from 12 -> 15, Mind flay from 8 -> 12 over it's duration)

2) Void bolt initial cooldown reduced to 1.5 seconds from 3 seconds when you first enter voidform means you can void bolt a GCD sooner.

3) LI being the talent of choice now over RoS for the most part with LoTV means we get additional haste going into voidform most of the time.

4) They changed the insanity drain formula again. From 8+0.55 per stack to 6+0.67 a stack means it's a lot easier to cap insanity at the beginning, and harder once you reach high voidform stacks, with the breakpoint on PTR being at 18 stacks in order to match the drain of live.

[Djriff]

Wait, RoS won't be go-to talent with LoTV now?

Never was?

[Dawnrage]

Wait, RoS won't be go-to talent with LoTV now?

If things stay the way they are on the PTR, no.

RoS is strong now because of S2M. It's pretty much a requirement if you run S2M, and since you run S2M for almost every single raid fight, RoS is the default choice. On the PTR, that won't be the case anymore since S2M's duration had a severe nerf, though RoS will still be the default talent to get if you run S2M.

For LotV, RoS is fine on live because of the current LI and VL. Void Lord is ok, but it's really not that great considering we have no problem capping insanity at the start of voidform currently so that extra haste is merely just a (decent) damage boost. RoS also has a damage boost component attached to it, but has an additional effect of increasing our insanity generation especially if there's stuff we can SW: D during fights.

On the PTR it's different, since we no longer have a haste buff anymore when we exit voidform. There's a HUGE dropoff now on your damage when you exit voidform compared to live, and the LI talent remedies that a lot so you don't stay out of voidform too long and can enter back sooner. It basically gives both extra insanity and damage, which is kind of what RoS does. However it doesn't have any (real) requirements the way RoS does. SW: D was also buffed to give 15 insanity instead of 10.

Not to say that RoS will be useless for LoTV. If you were doing a low level mythic+ with a tank that pulls really slowly or have pulls that are far apart enough that you can't really make use of long voidforms and LI stacks after you fall out of voidform, then RoS will still be the better talent for those situations. For any raid fight though, LI is going to be way better, imo.

[RsinRC]

The cape is going to be strong with RoS and LotV if you want longer and stronger LotVs

- - - Updated - - -

I'm curious to know if you can get LotV up to 60+ with the new changes in 1 fight it'll be better than a stm in said fight. If so StM is going to be the pick for much shorter fights while LotV grows stronger the longer the encounter.

[davesignal]

Sadly, I think the best thing we can hope for is S2M being overwhelmingly strong on short fights and LoTV being better on long fights. But I hate, hate, HATE mandatory talent swaps on a per-fight basis that drastically change your playstyle.

Might as well just make us mages or rogues who are forced to swap specs on a per-fight basis.

[RsinRC]

@davesignal I actually don't mind being able to change between shorter more often VF's to one that makes 1 VF longer. We only have 1 spec so if something works best for 1 fight and another works best for a different one im all for it. And It "seems" like they're doing just that but it all comes down to patch release

[kalaratic]

i'm hoping now that surrender is a lot weaker they can buff our 2 piece because holy fuck i haven't seen a worse one in a long time. they are always so afraid of shadow being too strong on multi target that we see shit like sphere of insanity, void eruption, and this set being ridiculously weak that they don't even need to exist.

[pkusa]

probably a really dumb question, but are we still going to be using S2M in raids? And if so, in what situations.

[Deleted]

What i'd like to know is someone raiding with new changes and old gear (no nighthold set and new legendaries) and see how much dps he does now with S2M compared to live STM.

[Deleted]

Hey guys! I haven't posted here in a while - due to just being busy. Here's some more Shadow Priest game tips I have uploaded that (hopefully!) will help some of you guys improve or enhance your gameplay! Enjoy!

[Djriff]

What i'd like to know is someone raiding with new changes and old gear (no nighthold set and new legendaries) and see how much dps he does now with S2M compared to live STM.

Hey i actually did that a couple days ago.

.

StM Norm = normal boss fight.

Granted this was on training dummies.

[Kilee25]

So... an overall nerf?

[Djriff]

So... an overall nerf?

That was before the damage buffs. I'd have to test it again.

[Ilfayt]

So... an overall nerf?

Important to note, not only is it before the damage buffs(like he said), but also keep in mind his graph starts at 300k. The 25% buff is across the board, practically universal(25% to spells). Voidform got a 10% nerf, and there will be a few outliers, but I'm betting we'll see the 'red bar' get back up to what it was if not a little higher, with S2M getting 'back up' a bit, but not nearly close to what it was.

Looks like S2M may be more 'burn through the hard 3rd phase' type spec, the kind of situation where dps in the other parts of the fights don't matter as much as surviving mechanics and definitely not as much as that final 'burn phase', but I could be wrong. It's interesting to note when you're looking at S2M's dps, it's important to realize how much is 'rear-loaded'. The 'dps number' you see is a result of the lows for the whole fight+the 'high' at the end 'averaged' out most of the time. So even if S2M still has death mechanic and is still top, but not 'in the stratosphere' like it is now, it will have a use.

[Vampiregenesis]

Just got Anund's seared shackles today , it feels bad to wear this while playing holy but the stats it offers are perfect for holy and its much better than the one i had. I think i should start learn playing shadow.