Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen

[ro9ue]

Official site: http://www.pantheonmmo.com/

So I totally forgot about this game for a while, but after EQN was cancelled I started looking into new MMOs on the horizon I would be interested in. At the top of the list is Crowfall, and 2nd in line is Pantheon. Brad McQuaid is behind this game (EverQuest).

They are doing some cool new stuff like "types" of NPCs that might react differently to your actions and things like environmental mechanics. Also they are bringing back that old EQ feel for spells which they are calling the 'Living Codex'. Basically you don't just learn all your stuff as you level up through the game like in WoW, you might have to travel to the peak of a mountain and train with an old wizard for him to teach you a spell.

Here's a snippet off their website that sort of highlights some of the unique goals of the game:

The Pantheon Difference


An MMO Evolved

Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen will likely be a fundamentally different game compared to what you may have experienced playing other modern MMORPGs. From the moment you log in you will notice that the game is more social and has an emphasis on cooperative play. The monsters are often tougher and exploration is more involved. You will need friends in the game and your reputation can either help you progress or hinder it. Death in-game is meaningful and you’ll want to avoid it when possible. You’ll learn your surroundings and the lay of the land, spending meaningful time in each area and not just running through as quickly as possible to collect ten hides. You will need strategy, cunning and endurance to uncover all that Pantheon has to offer. You will find yourself in group and guild chats as you strategize or even just to pass the time between battles. Pantheon is social, thought-provoking, and the memories from your experiences in Terminus will last a lifetime.


Atmosphere/Climate System

One of Pantheon’s tenets is ‘Engage the World!’ When we talk about being a PvE MMO, our definition of ‘environment’ means a lot more than just fighting NPCs -- players will be contending with the world itself. Some regions will be very hot or cold. Some areas within a zone might be enchanted with complete darkness, or silence (meaning spoken spells won't work), or poison or miasma. Small tornados could travel through a region, compelling players to work their way around them, not through them, lest they take significant damage. Also, certain spells may work better or worse (or even only work) depending on the climate or atmosphere -- for example, a 'Call Lightning' spell could deal more damage than a typical ‘lightning bolt’ spell but could only be cast if there is a storm in the region.


Powerful Spells and Abilities: The Living Codex

In MMOs it is common to find rare items out in the world, by adventuring or by crafting, but abilities and spells are more often learned from trainers or even just given to player when his or her character levels up. In Pantheon, however, many of the more rare and exotic spells and abilities are found not at the local trainer but from a wise sage hiding in the depths of a dungeon or at the top of a remote tower.


Dynamic NPC Encounter Groups

The world is not static and unchanging – every day is not ‘groundhog’ day. Events occur that can completely change the population of a zone or the population of a group of NPCs within a zone (and the rarer the event, the rarer the rewards -- many exotic items can only be obtained when one of these zone events occur). An example: after you kill some key mobs guarding a hill giant camp, this triggers a zone event that loads up an invading force of Storm Giants who then proceed to attack the Hill Giant camp.


NPC Dispositions and Behaviors

An area we have not seen much innovation in MMORPGs, almost since their inception, is the area of NPC AI. What if certain enemies had different “dispositions” that had to be discovered by the player? Many NPCs in Pantheon will have advanced behaviors, like the propensity to flee if possible, or to stand and fight to the end. Some NPCs will be inclined to help other NPCs in the area, while some will not. Some will target certain classes within the group that is attacking them. NPC’s movement speeds may vary if they feel they are outmatched. While it is too early to go into a lot of detail, some of the different dispositions we are working on include: the Alarmist, the Bully, the Craven, the Opportunist, the Protector, and the Strategist.


Colored Mana System

Different classes will use different colors of mana. Some rare abilities, spells, and prayers will use more than one color of mana. These exotic abilities create an opportunity to sub-class your character, allowing players to customize their class to a degree, but without removing the interdependence between classes that is key to group content and building community.


Progeny System

Players will be able to 'retire' high level characters and then create their children as new characters, but these new characters, the 'progeny', will have certain abilities, stats, etc. that make them slightly yet noticeably better than a completely brand new character (but not to the point that it unbalances things).


Situational Gear

In Pantheon, there often won't simply be a weapon or piece of gear that is the absolute best item for your character’s class and level. Instead, many items will be more situational, and the player will need to ask himself, 'where am I?', 'what am I going to fight next?', and 'who in my group is what class, and what items do they have that may help defeat the next encounter?' Items that protect against climates/atmospheres (areas of extreme heat or cold, or disease, or absolute darkness) will often be important. So also will 'bane' items that are especially effective against certain types of mobs (for example, the Undead, or Dragonkind).


The Perception System

One of the most profound things about Pantheon is how we are designing the game from the ground up so that the Environment truly matters – we want players to care about the world they are in, and why things are the way they are. When you think of MMOs, when is the last time you discovered the meaning, or the history, or the secrets of a person, place or event without being told by a text box? What if we’ve conceived of a way to bring players back to exploring because they are compelled by what they see in front of them - not because a blinking light tells them to go there? In Pantheon, Wizards will be able to perceive things that a Warrior cannot. Through prayer, a Cleric may gain insight into an area, or a creature, that a Rogue could never know. Through our perception system, Pantheon will redefine how the game world becomes known, and how players will work together to progress.

While I like what they are talking about here philosophically, I do worry a bit about the execution... it looks a bit TOO old school, but judge for yourself:

[DesoPL]

Another fantasy MMO meh just booring.

I will wait for Ember in my personal box of shame.

[Tommy T]

Looks good.
Will keep an eye out.

[Calfredd]

I just can't trust anything McQuad is behind and I apologize for not being able to put as much trust in him as you.

Is this the project MMO that lost most of it's staff and is being ran mostly by volunteers now or was that a different one like Trials of Ascension?

[Edge-]

I just can't trust anything McQuad is behind and I apologize for not being able to put as much trust in him as you.

Is this the project MMO that lost most of it's staff and is being ran mostly by volunteers now or was that a different one like Trials of Ascension?

Nope, that's this one. Internal drama with McQuaid apparently giving himself like a 4+ month pay advance out of the funds they'd raised through their site and people leaving, not sure how much of that is accurate or not though. But yeah, they're working with a mix of volunteers and some paid staff last I recall.

But they've been doing crowdfunding through their sites and have actually been making pretty decent progress. I'm still skeptical about McQuaid being able to ultimately deliver, since he's not so great at the whole business side of things. But if he can get the game out and deliver on even half of what he's been talking about I'm down to play it. He's always had super interesting ideas.

[grexly75]

Mmm another MMO in an already overcrowded market.. Like the last one Black Desert was supposed to be the bees knees and have not heard a peep about how well that one in a long time..

[Puupi]

Looks horrible, welcome back to 2005.

[sinilaid]

any idea when EA will begin?

[ro9ue]

Nope, that's this one. Internal drama with McQuaid apparently giving himself like a 4+ month pay advance out of the funds they'd raised through their site and people leaving, not sure how much of that is accurate or not though. But yeah, they're working with a mix of volunteers and some paid staff last I recall.

But they've been doing crowdfunding through their sites and have actually been making pretty decent progress. I'm still skeptical about McQuaid being able to ultimately deliver, since he's not so great at the whole business side of things. But if he can get the game out and deliver on even half of what he's been talking about I'm down to play it. He's always had super interesting ideas.

I'm totally skeptical as well from hearing about all the drama surrounding him. For that reason, I didn't donate to the kickstarter. However, I want to link this video because honestly it sort of humanized the guy for me. I don't think he was a complete dick - I just think he was going through some shit and fucked up bad.

Regardless, Pantheon will be a "wait and see" for me. But I wish him and his team all the best.

[May90]

The list of features looks pretty slick, especially the promise of challenging mobs in the world and the necessity to actually group with other players. Will see if they deliver!

[Slaughty8]

Looks horrible, like an MMO from 2005-2008 max, not for me. It looks like it will simply be a copy of old mmo's with some new systems and updated functions...no thanks, I prefer Guild Wars 2, The Elder Scrolls Online and Albion Online
Additionally, the game looks like aimed at old-mmmo-nostalgia people who somehow still have too much free time.

This game will be popular for the first week or month because of old mmo nostalgia and be forgotten by many.

[TheMediator]

Looks horrible, like an MMO from 2005-2008 max, not for me.

Not only graphically, but in design intent as well. Reading the description made it sound like one of those Korean grind-a-thon MMOs.

[Arrashi]

Honestly i hoped for real patreon MMO. Where you beg strangers for money so you can make your "art" and shiet.

[Enitzu]

Not only graphically, but in design intent as well. Reading the description made it sound like one of those Korean grind-a-thon MMOs.

Which is pretty much what its based on. There are a lot of people who hate the way current games give everyone a trophy. Some of us want to actually work for what we get and not have the LFR mentality. But for those that want the easy games, there's a ton of them. It won't be for everyone but for those that enjoy in depth games and actually working for what you get then it will be for them. Today's games are finished in a month of new content. I want a game that will give me a reason to keep playing for years, not weeks.

[TheMediator]

Well that's just it, so many players claim that they want exactly that, and then the games release and they fall on their face because all the "hardcores" don't show up in any numbers.

Right. Wildstar went right into the fucking toilet, and this design seems even more niche than that game was.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I try to open my horizions but I feel like this will have a lot of problems and such. I don't know if it feels like a korean grindy fest but I think it just might not be what I'd like or taste. I'd say be skeptical.

[Edge-]

Which is pretty much what its based on.

No, it's based on McQuaid's prior games, EQ1 and Vanguard. Both were far more group-centric and grindy and are more in-line with what McQuaid has laid out for Pantheon.

Right. Wildstar went right into the fucking toilet, and this design seems even more niche than that game was.

Eh, WildStar went with "HARDCORE RAIDING YEAH" while this is taking a different approach and going for a more group-oriented world overall. Yeah, it's supposed to be "more difficult" than other MMO's that allow for easy soloing through content, but it's hardly in the same design direction of WildStar.

Also, it's got a fraction of the budget, so its bar for success is considerably lower.

[May90]

Which is pretty much what its based on. There are a lot of people who hate the way current games give everyone a trophy. Some of us want to actually work for what we get and not have the LFR mentality. But for those that want the easy games, there's a ton of them. It won't be for everyone but for those that enjoy in depth games and actually working for what you get then it will be for them. Today's games are finished in a month of new content. I want a game that will give me a reason to keep playing for years, not weeks.

I think both approaches are wrong. Endless grind is wrong, and getting everything for free is wrong.

What I would like is a game with meaningful experience. I don't care how long or short it is, but I want it to be enjoyable. I don't want to "work" towards something; I have a job for that. I want to enjoy living in a virtual world - and sadly so far I've only seen one MMO offering that, Ultima Online, and that is extremely outdated. Ironically, games like TES series, single player games, give me a much better feeling of the open world with real people in it, than MMORPGs.

Maybe this game will deliver? Will see.

[TheMediator]

Eh, WildStar went with "HARDCORE RAIDING YEAH" while this is taking a different approach and going for a more group-oriented world overall. Yeah, it's supposed to be "more difficult" than other MMO's that allow for easy soloing through content, but it's hardly in the same design direction of WildStar.

Also, it's got a fraction of the budget, so its bar for success is considerably lower.

The Wildstar analogy isn't meant to say the game is like Wildstar, but simply to say that both games use an outdated formula that no longer (or in this game's case, never worked) in western markets.

[Edge-]

The Wildstar analogy isn't meant to say the game is like Wildstar, but simply to say that both games use an outdated formula that no longer (or in this game's case, never worked) in western markets.

They still work, just on a smaller scale. They're niche markets while WildStar was aiming for mass market appeal.

There are a handful of games based around said niche designs that are still alive and kicking (including EQ1) and there is definitely a market for it. It's just not a AAA sized market, which is fine for these games and their decidedly less than AAA budgets and goals.