[Legion - 7.2] Not's Demonology Guide

[manbeast4u]

Very excited for the incoming buffs. Hopefully this brings us closer to mage. Still waiting on the complete reroll, but I did boost a mage last night.

[Deleted]

I see you suggesting Hand of Doom over Power Trip for every fight in the Emerald Nightmare write-up, is it really better? The way I see it, not having Hand of Doom means that you have to invest an additional GCD every ~15 seconds, while a Power Trip proc saves you a Demon Bolt (about 1.5 seconds). So that would mean Power Trip is better than Hand of Doom if it procs more often than once every ~22.5 seconds, which is usually the case. Also, you can cast Doom on the move (and you have about a 7 second window to do so), so Power Trip makes you a bit more mobile. Am I missing something?

[manbeast4u]

I see you suggesting Hand of Doom over Power Trip for every fight in the Emerald Nightmare write-up, is it really better? The way I see it, not having Hand of Doom means that you have to invest an additional GCD every ~15 seconds, while a Power Trip proc saves you a Demon Bolt (about 1.5 seconds). So that would mean Power Trip is better than Hand of Doom if it procs more often than once every ~22.5 seconds, which is usually the case. Also, you can cast Doom on the move (and you have about a 7 second window to do so), so Power Trip makes you a bit more mobile. Am I missing something?

I could be wrong, but it's all about saving the GCD's while maintaining efficiency elsewhere; plus it's just easier. I just got done doing Emerald Nightmare as Demo on 3/5 of the fights (Destro for Tree/Dragons) and having Shadowflame + Lifetap to cast ate up every GCD I needed to use while moving. Just my guess though.

I have faith that Not did the majority of the math right haha.

[Deleted]

As a non-demo player (currently).

How big are the buffs exactly? They read really really good and it seems to be about a 15%(?) flat damage increase and thus makes demo very interesting since they are already the best pure ST warlock specc.

Destro looks to be about 8-9% damage increase (they didn't buff all of it. e.g. Imp wasn't buffed). How about Demo?
For cleave fights destro is probably better, but Demo should shine on ST shouldn't they?

[Deleted]

It looks like demo will be the best low-movement ST spec by a wider margin than before, the problems are, as before, that there is no real middle ground between AoE and ST talent-wise (you can be strong at one or the other or mediocre at both), weakness in high-mobility fights and the inability to effectively switch targets (making demo fairly weak in add-heavy fights).

Edit: Actually, with the Demonwrath, HoG and Implosion buffs, AoE will be much better even if you only take Implosion as an AoE talent and go ST otherwise. Mythic+ should be much better now for demos.

[PhilUK]

Does anyone have a WA for practicing Nots opener at 20% haste?

[jayx10]

Seems like many of the top Demonology Warlocks are going Synergy over Service. But...if you run with Darkglare, is it still worth taking Synergy? Seems like Demonbolt would get much more benefit from Synergy...

[Woz]

I see you suggesting Hand of Doom over Power Trip for every fight in the Emerald Nightmare write-up, is it really better? The way I see it, not having Hand of Doom means that you have to invest an additional GCD every ~15 seconds, while a Power Trip proc saves you a Demon Bolt (about 1.5 seconds). So that would mean Power Trip is better than Hand of Doom if it procs more often than once every ~22.5 seconds, which is usually the case. Also, you can cast Doom on the move (and you have about a 7 second window to do so), so Power Trip makes you a bit more mobile. Am I missing something?

It's all about not having to refresh Doom. Less maintenance casts = more demons. All about da demons.

As a non-demo player (currently).

How big are the buffs exactly? They read really really good and it seems to be about a 15%(?) flat damage increase and thus makes demo very interesting since they are already the best pure ST warlock specc.

Destro looks to be about 8-9% damage increase (they didn't buff all of it. e.g. Imp wasn't buffed). How about Demo?
For cleave fights destro is probably better, but Demo should shine on ST shouldn't they?

Based on some very rudimentary napkin math figures to be ~10-12% buff, closer to 10 I'd imagine with everything included. Sims should be updated soon?

Seems like many of the top Demonology Warlocks are going Synergy over Service. But...if you run with Darkglare, is it still worth taking Synergy? Seems like Demonbolt would get much more benefit from Synergy...

Synergy forever.

[Deleted]

Is the pvp trinket (flat Vers, 3k int proc at 840) worth anything?

[Deleted]

It's all about not having to refresh Doom. Less maintenance casts = more demons. All about da demons.

But the number of demons is dependent on your soul shard generation, and Power Trip should give you soul shards faster, shouldn't it? At least it should if you cast DE more than once every 11 seconds, which should always be the case

[MrFiddleswitch]

I know you guys are running sims still, but with the - Doomguard (Demonology)’s Doom Bolt damage increased by 18% - change, is Synergy still better than Supremacy on single target?

[tostoness]

I know you guys are running sims still, but with the - Doomguard (Demonology)’s Doom Bolt damage increased by 18% - change, is Synergy still better than Supremacy on single target?

Joined the forum just for this. Especially when it comes to high movement fights. Currently simulation craft shows it as a 2% increase in damage on light movement fights for me.

[ChristopherD87]

Hey guys, curious question on mythic and mythic plus for demo.

First of all, all this bad rep we're giving ourselves is 99% of the reason locks have a bad name. No we may not be ideal for world first races. But for anything else were fine. No, not top of the charts but not bottom (affliction aside lol). Just my opinion, let the flaming begin.

Ok so my question. Ilvl 849 demo lock. Have completed only 4 mythic+ so far (three +3 and one +5). I have been using my single target build doing "ok" trash dps. Was wondering if i went with my aoe build, how much of a dps loss would it be on boss fights? Or would it be with the uptime i would get from my imps dying?

Thanks in advance guys

[Styxz]

Joined the forum just for this. Especially when it comes to high movement fights. Currently simulation craft shows it as a 2% increase in damage on light movement fights for me.

I really hope they remove this talent soon. It's Warlock's (old) Rune of Power. IDC how strong it is. NOPE.

[MrFiddleswitch]

Joined the forum just for this. Especially when it comes to high movement fights. Currently simulation craft shows it as a 2% increase in damage on light movement fights for me.

This exactly. While I don't really care for losing the 3 Minute CD version or the extra pet for Thal'kiel's - having him during moderate to high movement, for the entire execute phase during progression, and even on some target switching fights where the Felguard can run into some uptime issues moving between targets (looking at you Il'gynoth and Elerethe) would be nice if it will be more of a competitive option with this buff.

[Lucrece]

I really hope they remove this talent soon. It's Warlock's (old) Rune of Power. IDC how strong it is. NOPE.

Why is having a permanent doomguard/infernal such a horrible thing?

I find most people who have these opinions, as well those of passive talents, to just be mostly bandwagon parroting. Game's had tons of passive talents since its inception and only very lately did it even become something people bragged about hating.

[Fyoria]

Hey guys, curious question on mythic and mythic plus for demo.

First of all, all this bad rep we're giving ourselves is 99% of the reason locks have a bad name. No we may not be ideal for world first races. But for anything else were fine. No, not top of the charts but not bottom (affliction aside lol). Just my opinion, let the flaming begin.

Ok so my question. Ilvl 849 demo lock. Have completed only 4 mythic+ so far (three +3 and one +5). I have been using my single target build doing "ok" trash dps. Was wondering if i went with my aoe build, how much of a dps loss would it be on boss fights? Or would it be with the uptime i would get from my imps dying?

Thanks in advance guys

All I do is swamp out Demonbolt for Darkglare for heavier AOE personally. It's been working out well. You won't be wrecking the meters for burst AoE, but we never have. Our single target DPS doesn't suffer too bad from Darkglare either.

[Octa]

Why is having a permanent doomguard/infernal such a horrible thing?

I find most people who have these opinions, as well those of passive talents, to just be mostly bandwagon parroting. Game's had tons of passive talents since its inception and only very lately did it even become something people bragged about hating.

Weird I've been seeing it for years.
And I don't think it's really bragging as much as it is showing disdain for a playstyle that sucks (which to be fair, most lock playstyles do now).

[Lucrece]

Weird I've been seeing it for years.
And I don't think it's really bragging as much as it is showing disdain for a playstyle that sucks (which to be fair, most lock playstyles do now).

How does the playstyle suck lol, you are virtually replacing one pet for another. Guess most MOBA's suck as well since a large part of their progression are passive increases. Not everything needs to be a new active skill.

Look at feral druid. Tons of buttons and timers/pandemics to track, total shit to play as regardless. More shit to press or track does not necessarily make a spec more fun. Don't generalize your preferences for a universal standard of excellence.

Demonhunter has only a few buttons and many of its talents are passives, but it derives its gameplay from proper use of movement skills to minimize exit from melee range and loss of autoattacks, not to mention not fucking up a raid mechanic.

[Octa]

How does the playstyle suck lol, you are virtually replacing one pet for another. Guess most MOBA's suck as well since a large part of their progression are passive increases. Not everything needs to be a new active skill.

Look at feral druid. Tons of buttons and timers/pandemics to track, total shit to play as regardless. More shit to press or track does not necessarily make a spec more fun. Don't generalize your preferences for a universal standard of excellence.

Demonhunter has only a few buttons and many of its talents are passives, but it derives its gameplay from proper use of movement skills to minimize exit from melee range and loss of autoattacks, not to mention not fucking up a raid mechanic.

Guess people can't like the direction locks have gone according to you, got it. I do not like the direction ANY spec went with this expansion. All of them are, for me, a step backwards. I also hate having a huge portion of my damage done passively by my pet (I concede I am no longer maining a warlock at this point since I'm tanking and have no tried perma doomguard since some point in HFC). I disliked the fact that it drastically changed the playstyle of specs during WoD when you spec'd into perma pet which, again, I think was a step backwards at the time.

At no point anywhere did I generalize my preferences as a universal standard of excellence. Ever.

Take it down a notch dude, I was simply saying that I don't think the majority of people are just hopping on a bandwagon pretending to be cool and that people have complained about issues like this for a long time. Pretty simple.