Perferred Spec V. DPS Output

[Tziva]

What's top DPS can change, and usually does change. I feel like going "all in" on the theoretical best spec when it's still largely based on projections and numbers that will be tweaked isn't really the best plan unless you also happen to like that spec.

I'm going to prioritise the spec I enjoy and then I will focus on catching up an offspec artifact or two for the fights in which my main spec is not ideal. I try to balance what I like with what is best for the raid. That said, I'm primarily a heroic raider, so it's also not a big deal if I'm not 100% min/maxing the top spec.

[panzaghor]

Would play outlaw or mut if needed but i`m not giving up on sub

[billyisinehre]

What people don't realize is that currently Outlaw is outperforming in cleave and in ST. For the first tier if you're going to be competitive then grin and bear it.


That being said by the time any of the other specs can pull ahead and be better, more than just marginally, you will have so much of the AP % buff you'll be able to get the other specs way up there.

By the way if you want to see up-to-date information just keep an eye on these logs. It's the only place I've been able to find consistent up to date sims.

simc.skasch .com

[bigsuirlife]

I'll choose Sin to main hoping that in the future with set and artifact skill perform better then now.
but no matter...i'm not here for the world first kill

So preferred spec for me .

[Yhcti]

Have only spent 5 minutes on the game since the announcement that Legion was releasing but have to say I thoroughly enjoy Subtlety more than the other specs for general purpose and can definitely see it taking over the other specs once gear gets better and ilvl increases.

[Deleted]

Hi,
I was interested by a website showing the sims you say you've seen in vain. simc.skasch .com is 403 if anyone has another reliable source to give, i m still stuck between the rogue specs i love them all for what they each bring to the table.

I checked the onedrive simc, but, how about this ?

-If Fire is way too good, rather than bringing them down to a point where they are tied with or worse than Frost and Arcane, they will take them to slightly too good still.
-You shouldn't regret what you spent your Artifact Power on.

The gap between outlaw and the other specs doesn't seem right to me, it can't last, not with what blizz is saying!

[Celfydd]

simc.skasch .com is 403

Requires TLS:

https://simc.skasch.com/

[Deleted]

Thank you, i feel dumb lol. This says the same thing as the onedrive linked earlier, can't think blizz will let it go, will they ? I'm torn like so many of us !

[shaunika123]

What people don't realize is that currently Outlaw is outperforming in cleave and in ST. For the first tier if you're going to be competitive then grin and bear it.


That being said by the time any of the other specs can pull ahead and be better, more than just marginally, you will have so much of the AP % buff you'll be able to get the other specs way up there.

By the way if you want to see up-to-date information just keep an eye on these logs. It's the only place I've been able to find consistent up to date sims.

simc.skasch .com

well even with all the AK and stuff it's gonna take about 120 days to max out your artifact, and that 14,5% damage aint nothing to shy away from
plus the outlaw tree is so garbage beyond the first ~15 points that it's not a huge sacrifice to max something else

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?...HxBKV_biTNzfRY

i mean just check out the difference between 18 points in OL vs 26 points in OL and the same for sub the difference is astounding

[Dracovian]

i guess we have different ideas about the word eventually for me that means not in this tier, but as i said it's not all that matters since artifacts are locking us into a spec for the long haul not just "1 tier" so we have to make an educated guess early, and that educated guess says sub is gonna get better

Assassination will always be better in actual content just by the nature of DoTs. Sub could be even in sims and Assassination would crush it on live as long as there is more than 1 target because Rupture, Hemo and poison keeps ticking while dealing with mechanics while Sub's Nightblade cannot do even a fraction of that damage.

- - - Updated - - -

My preferred spec will always be Assassination, as I truly enjoy the poisons/bleeds style of play. Blizzard seems hell-bent on forcing our hands and making us play Outlaw. From current sims, Outlaw pretty much beats the other 2 specs in every aspect (ST, AOE, Cleave). I don't necessarily dislike Outlaw, but I certainly would prefer Mut. With that said, I will be making Mut my off spec in the hopes that Blizzard will make the spec a bit stronger further into Legion.

Outlaw has no business being best at ST. I have to believe Blizzard will tune that down if they are still better at everything on live.

[Zempai]

Would play outlaw or mut if needed but i`m not giving up on sub

ikr *craycray*

[ContortedPvP]

Unless Blizzard nerfs Outlaw, I would suggest maining Outlaw and building up your Assassination artifact in off time. Outlaw will most likely receive some form of a nerf when it is seen as the most effective rogue spec across the board.

[shaunika123]

Assassination will always be better in actual content just by the nature of DoTs. Sub could be even in sims and Assassination would crush it on live as long as there is more than 1 target because Rupture, Hemo and poison keeps ticking while dealing with mechanics while Sub's Nightblade cannot do even a fraction of that damage.

- - - Updated - - -



Outlaw has no business being best at ST. I have to believe Blizzard will tune that down if they are still better at everything on live.

actually both nightblade and rupture are pretty close to each other in terms of damage unless you're running exsang both are about ~25% of your damage
rupture of course has the added benefit of giving back energy but other than that it isnt much more damage/tick

also what "mechanics" are you dealing with? because sub will have more uptime even with mechanics due to shadowstrike, it can swap to adds faster, it can deal with adds better since it doesnt need the ramp up of assa, if anything even if sub was worse in dps it'd be better in progress due to it's mobility and reliable burst
yes if there are two stationary targets assa is great, but so is outlaw so that's a moot point.

[Dracovian]

actually both nightblade and rupture are pretty close to each other in terms of damage unless you're running exsang both are about ~25% of your damage
rupture of course has the added benefit of giving back energy but other than that it isnt much more damage/tick

also what "mechanics" are you dealing with? because sub will have more uptime even with mechanics due to shadowstrike, it can swap to adds faster, it can deal with adds better since it doesnt need the ramp up of assa, if anything even if sub was worse in dps it'd be better in progress due to it's mobility and reliable burst
yes if there are two stationary targets assa is great, but so is outlaw so

Rupture does over twice Nightblade's damage and you are not accounting for Deadly Poison and Hemo. It's statistically proven Assassination is far ahead of SUb with over 1 target. At 3 target it even beats Outlaw.

[shaunika123]

Rupture does over twice Nightblade's damage and you are not accounting for Deadly Poison and Hemo. It's statistically proven Assassination is far ahead of SUb with over 1 target. At 3 target it even beats Outlaw.

well in low gear levels it does
in 880 mythic outlaw is ahead on 3 targets also, and that means that with more gear it's gonna be even more ahead

and in good gear nightblade is easily similar to rupture's damage because you know.. it actually scales with stats.

even in crappy 835 gear it's only about a 30-40% difference
hardly "twice over"

that of course doesnt mean assa isnt better in multitarget, it is that's assa's niché, if it was bad at that the spec would be pointless.

[Naptimez]

This is a very easy decision based on the most recent sims. Outlaw is the only valid option. Mythic raiders won't choose a spec that is mathematically inferior unless it's within 2% or so. Outlaw is absolutely a no-brainer right now. Taking one of the other two is shooting yourself in the foot. Sub is not going to be better than Assassination until WELL after EN, and Outlaw is better than assassination already in single target. Blizzard will tune outlaw, but they will not destroy it. They have EXPLICITLY stated that they will not be making more than incredibly minor changes to specs after legion goes live because of commitment to artifact weapons. It will not take 120 days to max out artifact weapons unless you're talking about the 20 "paragon" traits, of which, only the first point is efficient. Another minor factor for hardcore progression that is being overlooked is that you gain 0.75% of your max health per trait purchased in a weapon, something that is NOT irrelevant in very early progression. I sincerely doubt unless blizzard goes against what it has said it will do that assassination will ever be a #1 spec in legion. Not until well into the expansion involving a number of changes to all 3 specs. Anyway, as I said, to choose a spec that isn't Outlaw, based on current numbers, is to choose to be worse - something progression mythic raiders do not choose.

[Gilor]

This is a very easy decision based on the most recent sims. Outlaw is the only valid option. Mythic raiders won't choose a spec that is mathematically inferior unless it's within 2% or so. Outlaw is absolutely a no-brainer right now. Taking one of the other two is shooting yourself in the foot. Sub is not going to be better than Assassination until WELL after EN, and Outlaw is better than assassination already in single target. Blizzard will tune outlaw, but they will not destroy it. They have EXPLICITLY stated that they will not be making more than incredibly minor changes to specs after legion goes live because of commitment to artifact weapons. It will not take 120 days to max out artifact weapons unless you're talking about the 20 "paragon" traits, of which, only the first point is efficient. Another minor factor for hardcore progression that is being overlooked is that you gain 0.75% of your max health per trait purchased in a weapon, something that is NOT irrelevant in very early progression. I sincerely doubt unless blizzard goes against what it has said it will do that assassination will ever be a #1 spec in legion. Not until well into the expansion involving a number of changes to all 3 specs. Anyway, as I said, to choose a spec that isn't Outlaw, based on current numbers, is to choose to be worse - something progression mythic raiders do not choose.

You're completely correct - as a mythic raider I'm not being given a choice atm, I have to go Outlaw assuming things go live like this. The concern I've had from the start of this is that Blizzard have a history of nerfing combat when it's ST is so high it makes the spec obligatory. I don't want to put a lot of work into one artifact only to have it devalued by re-balancing. They can EXPLICITLY say what they like but anyone who thinks they'll leave Outlaw untouched at 20%+ ahead hasn't been paying attention to what they actually do. I'm just going to get the first 13 points in both Sin and Outlaw artifacts and hope that they've decided which way they're going to go before I have to start spending bulk AP on one or the other.

[TheRogue]

20% ahead is stars aligning. The delta between mean and max for outlaw is outrageous even on the early sims. Using the mean for all specs bring them within a few percent of each other.

[Minka]

20% ahead is stars aligning. The delta between mean and max for outlaw is outrageous even on the early sims. Using the mean for all specs bring them within a few percent of each other.

Mean DPS for outlaw is also much much higher

[Gilor]

20% ahead is stars aligning. The delta between mean and max for outlaw is outrageous even on the early sims. Using the mean for all specs bring them within a few percent of each other.

20% is the mean on the sims from 22nd of August, You don't even want to go look at what it is when "stars align."