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  1. #21
    Yeah, I assumed as much. It's really not that much damage if pack survives for longer than 20-30 seconds.
    Torty - Night Elf Druid - Turalyon EU

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Sprucelee View Post
    More opinion than guide, needs to be more open to alternate builds, which will be necessary based on encounters (and specific dungeons). But good to get the conversation started.

    In particular I find the legendary section to be lacking, for instance, Tearstone of Elune as a "C Tier" for a ring slot is way off IMO. WG is already smart healing, demanding efficient usage. RNG is not really a huge concern, and IMO it is the most straightforward TP legendary. Solid procs will lead into even bigger WG/Flourish/G'hanir combos. And to put those shoulders at "A tier"... heh
    I mention that builds will change based on encounter and situations in game, but feel that this is a great place to start for a newer player. Once we get some more information, it wouldn't be too difficult to have a section talking about optimal builds for each boss. That's what further forum discussion is about!

    In terms of the Tearstone, I would give it a solid B-/C+. In a 5 man, most times the member will already have rejuv up and it will at worst save you a GCD. I wasn't thinking of RNG based on WG as it is smart, but based on who might already have a rejuv. Very frequently the proc will be wasted in my opinion.

  3. #23
    the bracers that cause swiftmend to extent your HoTs is the once I'm most excited about tbh; that would save quite a lot of tank healing GCDs/mana in five mans, especially if you're using prosperity/sotf.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheze View Post
    the bracers that cause swiftmend to extent your HoTs is the once I'm most excited about tbh; that would save quite a lot of tank healing GCDs/mana in five mans, especially if you're using prosperity/sotf.
    I personally like using the bracers with cenarion ward. Can't wait till we get the t19 set bonus to use with it.
    Interested in joining Star Citizen? https://robertsspaceindustries.com/e...STAR-4NBQ-QV6X Get $5 of in game credits when enlisting with that link!

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  5. #25
    If you're going Tree of Life for 5-mans, wouldn't Abundance have some nice synergy with the instant regrowths and stuff? And I think Stonebark vs. Flourish is a hard one... Flourish can help quite a bit with group healing when you're in a pinch but that doesn't really help if the tank is dead I guess.

  6. #26
    Say if I have a an ilvl 840 gear with great secondary stats and an ilvl 850 with bad secondary stats, how do I determine which one is better?

  7. #27
    Is it possible to create some stat weights? Maybe 5 Man, Raid and a mixture of both or somehting. I would really appreciate that!

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by FruitCakeRonin View Post
    Say if I have a an ilvl 840 gear with great secondary stats and an ilvl 850 with bad secondary stats, how do I determine which one is better?
    The higher ilvl or socketed item, our weights have way too little variance for it to matter unless you also need dps, and then you just avoid mastery.
    Resto Druid - Temerity - 7/7M @ 3 Days / Week

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Sprucelee View Post
    The higher ilvl or socketed item, our weights have way too little variance for it to matter unless you also need dps, and then you just avoid mastery.
    Okey so between ilvl 840+socket and ilvl 850 how do I choose? Far as I've been able to tell the socket is worth more than the 10 ilvls especially since the 840 item has better secondary stats. Am I right?

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by FruitCakeRonin View Post
    Okey so between ilvl 840+socket and ilvl 850 how do I choose? Far as I've been able to tell the socket is worth more than the 10 ilvls especially since the 840 item has better secondary stats. Am I right?
    That's going to depend on a lot of factors. Something like wrists for example don't get as much extra stats from 10 extra item levels as a chest would. Whereas a socket always adds the same amount of stats.

    Statweights are a bit hard to get for healing. But if you're really doubting you could either go to a site like askmrrobot.
    Or if you just want to do a quick comparison, consider intellect to have a value of 1.0 and all secondary stats to be 0.6. It's not accurate but it'll give you a global idea of what to expect (For most classes secondary stats are generally worth about 60% of the main stat, with some exceptions like haste for balance druids which is better than intellect).

    So say that the +10 item levels give you +50 intellect, +45 haste and +55 mastery. And a gem sockets allows you to fit in a 150 haste gem.
    IT would be: 50 + 0.6 * 45 + 0.6 * 55 vs 150 * 0.6 => 110 vs 90; so the item level bonus would win here.

    Again it's very crude, because mastery swings all over the place, and haste and crit are generally better than versatility. But it'll give you a very rough idea if the difference is large on what to pick.
    If the difference is small, than you either have to go by gut feeling or compare it based on actual stat weights. Healing isn't really like DPS though, so there is a lot of personal choice and other factors to consider.
    Last edited by Nythiz; 2016-09-04 at 09:45 PM.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by FruitCakeRonin View Post
    Okey so between ilvl 840+socket and ilvl 850 how do I choose? Far as I've been able to tell the socket is worth more than the 10 ilvls especially since the 840 item has better secondary stats. Am I right?
    I think the ilv boost will be better because of the int+stam increase, but it depends on the exact stats. The only true exception to this will be rings and necks where you won't receive the Int gain. Noxxic currently has the stat weights based on sims listed as: Intellect [9.08] > Haste [7.58] > Crit [6.08] > Mastery [4.58] > Versatility [3.08] so if you trust that you could plug in the numbers.

    I also updated the legendary section to provide less bias.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by meriax123 View Post
    If you're going Tree of Life for 5-mans, wouldn't Abundance have some nice synergy with the instant regrowths and stuff? And I think Stonebark vs. Flourish is a hard one... Flourish can help quite a bit with group healing when you're in a pinch but that doesn't really help if the tank is dead I guess.
    I tried both stonebark and Flourish. Stonebark is really strong if your tank is chunking, but I found the flexibility of Flourish to just be amazing. It's usable in many situations. Lots of AoE damage? Flourish your WG. Heavy Tank damage? Flourish your Lifebloom, Rejuvs and Cenarion Ward so you can spam more Regrowth.

    I think i'll stick with Flourish most of the time. Exception is if there is a specific scenario where the tank just gets hammered and stonebark with it's +20% healing would clearly be a necessity.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Nythiz View Post
    I tried both stonebark and Flourish. Stonebark is really strong if your tank is chunking, but I found the flexibility of Flourish to just be amazing. It's usable in many situations. Lots of AoE damage? Flourish your WG. Heavy Tank damage? Flourish your Lifebloom, Rejuvs and Cenarion Ward so you can spam more Regrowth.

    I think i'll stick with Flourish most of the time. Exception is if there is a specific scenario where the tank just gets hammered and stonebark with it's +20% healing would clearly be a necessity.
    Have you noticed a time with heavy group damage more than once per 1.5 minutes (for our artifact ability)? I havn't had any trouble with group healing more than using Essence. For random groups, Stonebark seems to be useful more times than Flourish. For a specific 5 man, I could see it going either way based on your comp. A melee heavy comp might do better with flourish.

  14. #34
    So I'm using Grid+Clique atm, but Grid SUCKS for showing multiple HoTs/buffs; anyone use anything better? I'm about to try out Vuhdo...
    Uses the same signature for over a year, just randomly gets infracted for it recently.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomali View Post
    Have you noticed a time with heavy group damage more than once per 1.5 minutes (for our artifact ability)? I havn't had any trouble with group healing more than using Essence. For random groups, Stonebark seems to be useful more times than Flourish. For a specific 5 man, I could see it going either way based on your comp. A melee heavy comp might do better with flourish.
    I guess not really. But I also somewhat see them performing different and/or supplementary roles.

    Essence of G'Hanir (EoG) is flat out burst healing. For 8 seconds your healing practically doubles. It's really awesome in those burst damage moments.

    Flourish is extremely versatile though and also does things that EoG can't do. 4 examples of slightly different applications of Flourish:

    1) It can be used for the same thing as EoG in an AoE situation, if you do a WG into Flourish right away (since you get a lot of the big WG HoT ticks right away). Very bursty AoE healing
    2) It can be used for the same thing as EoG in a tank burst situation, if you Flourish a Cenarion Ward it does a lot of healing, especially since you're also flourishing all the other HoTs (which likely will be 4-6 of them (Rejuv / Germ / LB / Cult / Regrowth / WG). So not only do you extend the actual healing, you're also extending the mastery of the up to 7 mastery stacks.
    3) It can alternatively be used for a more long duration AoE healing. If you extend WG near the end of the cast, you're spreading the healing out more over the whole duration (instead of heavily frontloading the long WG if you Flourish right after the cast, see #1). In case of medium-high AoE damage.
    4) It can also be used to extend important rolling HoTs in case there is something you need to do. Haven't used it much for these reasons yet. But if you want to do some DPS while your HoTs keep rolling you could dump a flourish; if you want to execute a certain mechanic where you can't heal for a bit Flourish will help you; etc.
    Cooldown is short enough to use it for some of those shenanigans.

    And they're not mutually exclusive either. Usually combining them is overkill; but there are those "oh shit" moments and I don't think I've yet seen anything as amazing as the combination of (SotF+)WG+G'hanir+Flourish. That stuff almost brings tears to my eyes, it's like a floodwave of green numbers and all health bars skyrocket. I love that; it's like a condensed Tranquility; and I don't think many other healers can really get something like that floodwave of numbers and HPS output.

    Stonebark is also really really good for 5 mans and mythic especially. It makes the tank heal cooldown more readily available, and even more important it empowers other HoTs by 20%, which is like 2 extra mastery stacks when you need them most. But it's also very one dimensional in it's use; whereas Flourish is really versatile.
    I dunno I like both, but Flourish is probably my favorite new Resto spell.
    Last edited by Nythiz; 2016-09-05 at 10:20 PM.

  16. #36
    So, stats.

    Are there any stat weights out that are reliable? I'd like to use them along with Pawn.

    From what I've read, it seems like people disagree on whether to put Haste or Crit on top.

    Also, what is the value of the secondary stats relative to Intellect? If we exclude Stamina from the equation, what kind of item increase are we looking at before it's worth it to sacrifice some Intellect for other stats?

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkwingDuck View Post
    So, stats.

    Are there any stat weights out that are reliable? I'd like to use them along with Pawn.

    From what I've read, it seems like people disagree on whether to put Haste or Crit on top.

    Also, what is the value of the secondary stats relative to Intellect? If we exclude Stamina from the equation, what kind of item increase are we looking at before it's worth it to sacrifice some Intellect for other stats?
    I'd really like some numbers too.

    Especially with rings its really difficult to decide, because ilvl isnt as impactfull there.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Nythiz View Post
    I guess not really. But I also somewhat see them performing different and/or supplementary roles.

    Essence of G'Hanir (EoG) is flat out burst healing. For 8 seconds your healing practically doubles. It's really awesome in those burst damage moments.

    Flourish is extremely versatile though and also does things that EoG can't do. 4 examples of slightly different applications of Flourish:

    1) It can be used for the same thing as EoG in an AoE situation, if you do a WG into Flourish right away (since you get a lot of the big WG HoT ticks right away). Very bursty AoE healing
    2) It can be used for the same thing as EoG in a tank burst situation, if you Flourish a Cenarion Ward it does a lot of healing, especially since you're also flourishing all the other HoTs (which likely will be 4-6 of them (Rejuv / Germ / LB / Cult / Regrowth / WG). So not only do you extend the actual healing, you're also extending the mastery of the up to 7 mastery stacks.
    3) It can alternatively be used for a more long duration AoE healing. If you extend WG near the end of the cast, you're spreading the healing out more over the whole duration (instead of heavily frontloading the long WG if you Flourish right after the cast, see #1). In case of medium-high AoE damage.
    4) It can also be used to extend important rolling HoTs in case there is something you need to do. Haven't used it much for these reasons yet. But if you want to do some DPS while your HoTs keep rolling you could dump a flourish; if you want to execute a certain mechanic where you can't heal for a bit Flourish will help you; etc.
    Cooldown is short enough to use it for some of those shenanigans.

    And they're not mutually exclusive either. Usually combining them is overkill; but there are those "oh shit" moments and I don't think I've yet seen anything as amazing as the combination of (SotF+)WG+G'hanir+Flourish. That stuff almost brings tears to my eyes, it's like a floodwave of green numbers and all health bars skyrocket. I love that; it's like a condensed Tranquility; and I don't think many other healers can really get something like that floodwave of numbers and HPS output.

    Stonebark is also really really good for 5 mans and mythic especially. It makes the tank heal cooldown more readily available, and even more important it empowers other HoTs by 20%, which is like 2 extra mastery stacks when you need them most. But it's also very one dimensional in it's use; whereas Flourish is really versatile.
    I dunno I like both, but Flourish is probably my favorite new Resto spell.
    Hello.
    Are you using some macro to cast all thre spells at once ?
    Something like
    /cast WG
    /cast Flourish
    /cast G'hanir

    Bcs as you said this combo could be quite nice in Heorics and Mythics dungeons during lot of AOE damage.
    Thank you

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Smejusak View Post
    Hello.
    Are you using some macro to cast all thre spells at once ?
    Something like
    /cast WG
    /cast Flourish
    /cast G'hanir

    Bcs as you said this combo could be quite nice in Heorics and Mythics dungeons during lot of AOE damage.
    Thank you
    You can't cast them all at the same time because of GCD limits. You could do a cast sequence but it would still require three globals.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerxyrall View Post
    I'd really like some numbers too.

    Especially with rings its really difficult to decide, because ilvl isnt as impactfull there.
    Noxxic is the only place where I could find weights:
    Intellect [9.04] > Haste [7.54] > Crit [6.04] > Mastery [4.54] > Versatility [3.04]

    I don't know how reliable it is, but I'm giving it a go for now.

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