People shot dead by police in the US in 2015

[Stockers]

White male lives matter!

[anyaka21]

Oh god that idea is just fuckign stupid. There are tons of dumbass Chinese people in China just becuase the ones who move here tend to be better educated doesn't mean all Chinese people are now smarter. Immigrants across the board tend to perform better than the native populace in MANY countries, it's becuase they generally move with a plan, or with a job, or for education.

tbh, thats a terrible example because you are making a broad stroke generalization about immigrants and 'their plan'.

Hell, I also know some dumbass asian americans too, but also know a ton that aren't.

but i do think that it also makes for an interesting look into families. Asians tend to have the least single parent homes, white people below that, and black people below that as well. Or families that stay together tend to have better educated kids.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with their conclusions, I'm just looking at the facts. And as also said, this isn't inherent, I'm drawing a simple speculation about family life and education.

[Taneras]

Leaving now.

Good, I asked for statistics and you haven't given me any yet. I specifically asked you for a better metric to gauge violence outside of violent crime rates and you ignored the question. You're contributing nothing to this conservation because you have nothing to contribute.

For those still poking around...

https://infogr.am/Black-34991937313

Very interesting graphs, they show how crime rates currently look, how they'd look if black and white populations were equal and how crime rates would look if the black and white populations were flipped.

Outside of the common sense built just living and observing reality, it should be abundantly clear why blacks are over represented in police shootings when you consider their population percentage. They're much more violent. And no, I'm not saying that its in their DNA. The causes are numerous, and they're mostly socioeconomic, but that doesn't change the crime statistics.

[Kraenen]

Oh god that idea is just fuckign stupid. There are tons of dumbass Chinese people in China just becuase the ones who move here tend to be better educated doesn't mean all Chinese people are now smarter. Immigrants across the board tend to perform better than the native populace in MANY countries, it's becuase they generally move with a plan, or with a job, or for education.

Did you ever notice when people are referring to average differences in a population, your mind immediately jumps to absolutes such as "all asians are inherently smarter" or "all blacks are inherently violent"?

[Northy]

People who support BLM generally aren't coming from a fact-based or statistical viewpoint. Doing so would cause them to promptly leave BLM.

[Taneras]

Is it really that different from the news/media reporting?

Black people, 12% of population, 26% of death by cop.
White, 70% of population, 50% of death by cop

Technically, this still means a black person has more than 3 times more chances of being killed by a cop than a white. Talking in absolute is an easy way to hide the problem.

Can you use that same line of reasoning on police shootings and gender?

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just becuase the ones who move here tend to be better educated doesn't mean all Chinese people are now smarter.

I swear, if progressives couldn't strawman their opponents with "oh so you're saying all of x race is like that?" they wouldn't be able to comment on the matter at all.

[Varitok]

Is it really that different from the news/media reporting?

Black people, 12% of population, 26% of death by cop.
White, 70% of population, 50% of death by cop

Technically, this still means a black person has more than 3 times more chances of being killed by a cop than a white. Talking in absolute is an easy way to hide the problem.

What about violent crime rates ontop of those numbers? What percentage of both white and black and hispanic etc commited violent crimes and does it correlate to the shooting rate? I mean, taking flat death rates by police and not anything else is biased.


I'm not from the US and I'm so glad I'm not, i feel really bad for my american friends.

[Themius]

Did you ever notice when people are referring to average differences in a population, your mind immediately jumps to absolutes such as "all asians are inherently smarter" or "all blacks are inherently violent"?

THis is what he said. And the study is trying to say all blacks are less intelligent because of pseudoscience reasons
That said though, can you dismiss the facts out of hand? Are whites more intelligent tham blacks? Are asians more intelligent than whites?

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Can you use that same line of reasoning on police shootings and gender?

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I swear, if progressives couldn't strawman their opponents with "oh so you're saying all of x race is like that?" they wouldn't be able to comment on the matter at all.

I feel like you guys just ignored the reason for his post. Which was in response to a group who uses pseudoscience to say blacks are less intelligent period as a group because they're black.

[Kraenen]

THis is what he said. And the study is trying to say all blacks are less intelligent because of pseudoscience reasons
That said though, can you dismiss the facts out of hand? Are whites more intelligent tham blacks? Are asians more intelligent than whites?

Not sure which study you're pointing to - the SPL one? I'm not familiar with Amren enough to make that call. IQ is not pseudoscience if you're referring to that. The racial differences may have been fudged though (Lynn is following in the footsteps of a fraud IIRC), so I'm mostly on the fence about it. Moreso on inherent differences. It's possible some ethnicities have different genes (woa, really?) and therefore different intelligences (there are certain genes isolated for intelligence), or different outlets for aggression and different levels of testosterone (not sure why evolution would do this, though, although it's possible hormone levels differ).

That said - yes, to both. (Note however I'm not making any conclusion about why they are smarter)

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I feel like you guys just ignored the reason for his post. Which was in response to a group who uses pseudoscience to say blacks are less intelligent period as a group because they're black.

I just said it because I've noticed you making the mistake before. Just keep an eye on it, that's all.

[Taneras]

I feel like you guys just ignored the reason for his post. Which was in response to a group who uses pseudoscience to say blacks are less intelligent period as a group because they're black.

I don't have any interest in whether or not one race is more intelligent on average when compared to a different race so I'm not going to check to see how legitimate their findings are. First, I think it's nearly impossible since "race" isn't the only factor that would control intelligence, there are so many cultural and economic factors to control for. And second, it ultimately doesn't matter to me because I judge each person individually.

As for the group itself, unfortunately there are racist groups scattered around the world who are racist against different groups of people. I tend to ignore them so long as they're not influencing public policy or burning crosses in people's front lawn.

[Themius]

Not sure which study you're pointing to - the SPL one? I'm not familiar with Amren enough to make that call. IQ is not pseudoscience if you're referring to that. The racial differences may have been fudged though (Lynn is following in the footsteps of a fraud IIRC), so I'm mostly on the fence about it. Moreso on inherent differences. It's possible some ethnicities have different genes (woa, really?) and therefore different intelligences (there are certain genes isolated for intelligence), or different outlets for aggression and different levels of testosterone (not sure why evolution would do this, though, although it's possible hormone levels differ).

That said - yes, to both. (Note however I'm not making any conclusion about why they are smarter)

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I just said it because I've noticed you making the mistake before. Just keep an eye on it, that's all.

it's a study i've referenced before that tried to say blacks were less intelligent based on what scores blacks were getting on iq in africa; however, white africans also scored lower than whites everywhere else and it is the studies like those these groups tend to push. The point was IQ is highly reliant on culture 1 and secondly really just measures a particular intelligence.

The whole "intelligences and aggression" because they're black, is stupid and any person who believes it is just as stupid and deluded.

[Kraenen]

it's a study i've referenced before that tried to say blacks were less intelligent based on what scores blacks were getting on iq in africa; however, white africans also scored lower than whites everywhere else and it is the studies like those these groups tend to push. The point was IQ is highly reliant on culture 1 and secondly really just measures a particular intelligence.

IQ is mostly hereditary, that should be well known by now.

The general figure for the heritability of IQ, according to an authoritative American Psychological Association report, is 0.45 for children, and rises to around 0.75 for late teens and adults.[5][6] The heritability of IQ increases with age and reaches an asymptote at 18–20 years of age and continues at that level well into adulthood.[7] Recent studies suggest that family and parenting characteristics are not significant contributors to variation in IQ scores;[8] however, poor prenatal environment, malnutrition and disease can have deleterious effects

Saying IQ is highly reliant on culture is just a relativist cop-out at this point. The go-to phrase should be "IQ is highly reliant on heredity, while somewhat reliant on culture"

The whole "intelligences and aggression" because they're black, is stupid and any person who believes it is just as stupid and deluded.

This isn't a real sentence, could you form one? I see you're quoting me but then referring to something I didn't conclude afterwards.

[Themius]

IQ is mostly hereditary, that should be well known by now.


Saying IQ is highly reliant on culture is just a relativist cop-out at this point. The go-to phrase should be "IQ is highly reliant on heredity, while somewhat reliant on culture"


This isn't a real sentence, could you form one? I see you're quoting me but then referring to something I didn't conclude afterwards.

You didn't make that conclusion however your comments alluded to as much. By subscribing to the belief that intelligence is based on genetics and the genetics of blacks are different because people have races (which isn't really a thing) points to you agreeing with assertions that certain races are just better / smarter because they popped into the world.

[Kraenen]

You didn't make that conclusion however your comments alluded to as much. By subscribing to the belief that intelligence is based on genetics and the genetics of blacks are different because people have races (which isn't really a thing) points to you agreeing with assertions that certain races are just better / smarter because they popped into the world.

No I said, and have always said, I'm open to the possibility. Different races have different genetics (it's a thing, sorry). That doesn't mean they are apes, as you seem to think (remember what I said earlier about rushing to absolute and extreme conclusions based on slight average differences). And it doesn't mean any superiority or inferiority. That's your assertion. If the IQ stuff is true, it wouldn't have just "popped into the world", it would've happened through evolution/natural selection. Are you open to the conclusion being possible, or are you just flat out saying there can't possibly be any differences in hormones or IQ between ethnicities?

[satimy]

The police need to start killing more white women and Asians to start being fair

[anyaka21]

THis is what he said. And the study is trying to say all blacks are less intelligent because of pseudoscience reasons
That said though, can you dismiss the facts out of hand? Are whites more intelligent tham blacks? Are asians more intelligent than whites?

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I feel like you guys just ignored the reason for his post. Which was in response to a group who uses pseudoscience to say blacks are less intelligent period as a group because they're black.

now you're misquoting or misinterpreting me.

IQ tests are not pseudo-science. Further, I never stated that blacks are dumber because they are black. Thats you pwn rose colored interpretation.

Thus if you back and read, I did say it wasn't inherent, that would be a conclusion that they have drawn. Not Me.

But facts are facts, and people draw different conclusions from said facts.

Thus if Asians > White > Black in terms of intelligence or IQ tests, why is that? They may say its because they are black or inherent, or genetic. I'm suggesting family life, stability of home as being a key factor. This is not inherent. Fix your families and you might fix intelligence.

I wonder if there is a study done about IQ and family, esp in regards to stable family homes vs single parent homes, as well as throwing race into the mix.

[Kraenen]

IQ tests are sort of besides the point. If you speculate one group of people may be more violent than another (explaining some of the variance in criminality beyond SES, racism, etc...) you'd look for differences in what causes violence. Social reasons like being ostracized, living in poverty, the constant threat of violence, or abusive parents may account for some of the relationship, but the rest may well be explained by heredity. It's a common thread for alcoholism or child abuse to run in families, and other issues like anti-social or conduct disorder have their own hereditary components.

My line on this is, taking a page from much of psychopathology and genetics, that it takes certain conditions to activate a predisposition/vulnerability, and that without those conditions the disease would lie dormant. However you wouldn't have the same disease without the predisposition. I mentioned before that the proportion of people with the "warrior gene" varies based on ethnicity, but only activates under conditions such as an abusive parent. This is the key middle ground in the debate.

At the end of the day, I'm not sure how much it matters if it really is true one group is more violent or more intelligent than another in an inherent sense. Suppose it's true. Okay, now what? The important point would be that we address any vulnerabilities, as fair-skinned people apply skin lotion, we should be sure to apply the proper parenting interventions for people with the "warrior gene".

[Bullarkie]

And revised by a guy who supports negative population growth (aka not only stop reproduction but depopulate with whatever this means), fanatic anti-immigrationist and writer of totally non-racist papers like
"The Impact of Refugees on the Size and Security of the U.S.Population" and "The Negative Economic Impact of Immigration on American Workers"

What does this have to do with the fact that the first edition was written by Katheryn Russell-Brown?