Suamar just doesn't feel like it belongs to nightborne/night elf

[Beloren]

It does look a bit like Blood Elf does it not, other then the color scheme the following could almost be mistaken for Suramar:



It's Silvermoon though.

It shouldn't be a surprise though, the two groups are related.

It looks amazing, I've linekd this picture a few times, it does seem to have more night elfy looking buildings though, not quite the modified style of current Silvermoon, but it's really amazing this. I'd be happy if they rebuilt Silvermoon like this in game, then the darky elves can keep Suramar and snub themselves to death in it for all I care.. give !!

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[Deleted for Good Measure]

what did you say? I'm curious now...

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Okay, so this is clearly a joke then...? What do you think those ruins used to be? Lavish cities just like Suramar. Zin-Aszhari, the former Night Elf capital city, has always been described in the lore as being extremely luxurious. It was nothing like Darnassus, it was a huge city full of tall spires and had a very extravagant palace where Queen Azshara herself resided. What we got in the Well of Eternity dungeon was a tiny fraction of how glorious the city has always been described in the lore for as long as the Warcraft universe has existed.

I remember that, the WoE dungeon didn't seem to reflect the grandeur the lore describes, but Suramar does, why do you think it looks so bad? Is it the way it looked in lore actually? or blizz just hadn't done a proper Night elf city architecture and art assets till now? As you said, we've only seen ruins, and you can't blame me for feeling (not thinking) night elves fit more in ruins and trees, it's just how I've always seen them.

[Wildmoon]

Dunno the cultures of all elves originated from Night Elf, so anything fit the night elf. The nightborne were NE. The BE were NE. Not sure what's point. It's not like BE went out to create their own original culture except the sun thing. They just built from the original NE's culture.

The BE are just people who didn't like the new changes made to the NE society after the Sundering and they prefered to stick to the old one but less extreme in aristocratic aspects.

[shadowmatrix]

Suramar was never destroyed by the Sundering so what you are seeing is the city as it pretty much was when Azshara was ruling. It is neither a Blood Elf nor Nightfallen city, it is a Highborne city. Keep in mind that the Broken Isles is where the Elf civilization was based and all of their oldest construction is there. Long before Silvermoon, long before the world trees, long before any pacts with aspects or Naaru, the elves had Suramar.

Yes it looks weird compared to it's people because while the people changed the city didn't.

[G3 Ghost]

A nightborne, A, abused the font of power in the heart of Suramar.

A nightborne has allowed the legion into Suramar to subjugate her people. The Nightfallen are those Nightborne that went against that decision and fled when the shield came down or were cast out during the uprising.

Make no mistake, either. They tell you in every last question in one way or another that the vast majority of Suramar's populace hate what their leader has done, but are too afraid to stand up lest they be cut off from what makes them who they are.

Also, blood elves had their chance. Do you not remember er the entirety of the daily quest Isle in BCBGENERATION?

The blood elves had two amazing cities on that island, Quel'Donis?

It is not our fault that aside from a handful that follow the horse are bad guys.

[Faerillis]

The blood elves had two amazing cities on that island, Quel'Donis?

It is not our fault that aside from a handful that follow the horse are bad guys.

Speak comprehensibly? IE No one can really grasp what you're getting at, please explain further.

[daigotsurezan]

In The Beginning, there were just Elves.

During the War of the Ancients and the Sundering that immediately followed, the surviving elven populations lost contact with each other and diverged significantly. On the continent of Kalimdor, the druids and priestesses of Elune planted Nordrassil over the remade Well of Eternity and moved the entirety of their society toward nature magic, having seen how badly arcane magic messed things up before.

During this time, the Highborne who survived and continued to practice arcane magic were banished from Kalimdor and made their way to the Eastern Kingdoms, where they became the High Elves and built the Sunwell to sustain them in the absence of the Well of Eternity. Most of these high elves became Blood Elves following the events of Warcraft III.

Unbeknownst to both these groups, an entire city's worth of Highborne mages had survived the Sundering by putting up a magic barrier and using their potent magics (and a Titan artifact) to create the Nightwell. Millennia of isolation and exposure to raw arcane power from the Nightwell changed them into the Nighborne, in the same way that exposure to the Sunwell (and demonic energies) changed the High Elves and Blood Elves. As we see in the Suramar questline, during the current Legion invasion the Nightborn leaders decided to collaborate instead of resist and for the first time in ten thousand years lowered the barrier isolating their city.

And just for fun, many elves who were followers of Azshara at the time of the Sundering were transformed along with their queen into the Naga.

[Beloren]

Well since the city is powered by the Eye of Aman'thul (the source of the Nightwell's power) and we're taking the Eye of Aman'thul from the city, it's hard to imagine what will become of the city. The Blood Elves taking it over would not be one of the options though, since making it a Horde exclusive city when it is the heart of endgame content is not something they could do.

Don't get me wrong, I want Blood Elf content too! I'd love to see the Post-Nighthold Patch give content where the Horde and Alliance are in conflict as they try to very differently guide the city to recovery — with Night Elf Druids trying to make them re-imagine their society and its source of power and Blood Elf Mages trying to help them discover new fonts for the Arcane. It would be fantastic to see where Lor'themar's story is going and frankly, since the Horde is down to only one Unique Model Leader, it's time for the Regent-Lord to get an upgrade anyways.

Hell, take part of the Nighthold Raid, or just add a giant unexplored courtyard to the Nighthold and put it in as a new Battleground. Have parts of the city become World PvP zones for those who've completed the Nighthold Raid. Most importantly, give me a transmog set that is clearly meant to be a Blood Elven take on Nightborne Fashion as a reward from those.

Now this I really like, would be so cool to have similar armor thing. And yes, the nigthborne should lose the nightwell, and after Orgrimmar's defeat in SoO, the horde should gain the whole city, I mean, blood elves have behaved more responsibly and as elves they have as much right to it after the nightborne are punished or driven away

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In The Beginning, there were just Elves.

During the War of the Ancients and the Sundering that immediately followed, the surviving elven populations lost contact with each other and diverged significantly. On the continent of Kalimdor, the druids and priestesses of Elune planted Nordrassil over the remade Well of Eternity and moved the entirety of their society toward nature magic, having seen how badly arcane magic messed things up before.

During this time, the Highborne who survived and continued to practice arcane magic were banished from Kalimdor and made their way to the Eastern Kingdoms, where they became the High Elves and built the Sunwell to sustain them in the absence of the Well of Eternity. Most of these high elves became Blood Elves following the events of Warcraft III.

Unbeknownst to both these groups, an entire city's worth of Highborne mages had survived the Sundering by putting up a magic barrier and using their potent magics (and a Titan artifact) to create the Nightwell. Millennia of isolation and exposure to raw arcane power from the Nightwell changed them into the Nighborne, in the same way that exposure to the Sunwell (and demonic energies) changed the High Elves and Blood Elves. As we see in the Suramar questline, during the current Legion invasion the Nightborn leaders decided to collaborate instead of resist and for the first time in ten thousand years lowered the barrier isolating their city.

And just for fun, many elves who were followers of Azshara at the time of the Sundering were transformed along with their queen into the Naga.

do we know for sure it was the sunwell that made the night elves into high elves? because other sources say it was the exile and being cut off from the new well and nordrassil, then having to endure what they did and change themselves that did it, not the sunwell.

And was Suramar a highborne city? I recall only Eldre'thalas described as a highborne city, Suramar was highborne-led but all classes of night elves lived in there right? or am I wrong there.

Also I thought the night elves of Suramar just became a bit more corrupt due to the night well, Thalyssra's skin goes darker more night coloured in the video, and she becomes thinner, it doesn't seem that much of a change, she just becomes a bit uglier and more anorexic - though not as bad as the nightfallen state.

[Calfredd]

Also I thought the night elves of Suramar just became a bit more corrupt due to the night well, Thalyssra's skin goes darker more night coloured in the video, and she becomes thinner, it doesn't seem that much of a change, she just becomes a bit uglier and more anorexic - though not as bad as the nightfallen state.

Do you know what happens to blood elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become wretched. Do you know what happens to nightborne elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become withered. Two different but very similar states that robs the afflicted elf of their physical strength as well as their mental stability until they go feral.

[Sluvs]

I will try to explan to the best of my ability.

The Night Elves of old were a thriving society based on arcane magic and druidism. The ones that were richer, closer to the royal family and nobles in general with relations to the court, were called Highbornes. They were the ones that adopted the arcane traditions the most.

Now, after the war of the ancients the night elves that were not Highborne shunned and feared arcane magic, even forbbiding the practice of it. So it is no surprise that they chose to leave Suramar and what was left of the highborne behind. Not only that, but some of the Highbornes left suramar too in hopes of a better home somewhere else, they eventually became High elves. The ones that stayed in suramar became Nightbornes.

So as you can see, the high elves are directly related to the Night elves highbornes. And the image that we have of the night elves today is incomplete, because we only see a fragment of what night elf culture really is, we only see the druidism part. But arcane was always ingrained deeply in their culture, they just shunned and hated it. And that is why it took so long for the night elves to accept mages within their ranks.

So in short:
Night elves= Night elves commons that left suramar.
Highborne= Rich night elves
Nightborne= Descendants of highbornes that chose to stay
High elf= Descendants of Highborne that migrated, most of them eventually changed their names to Blood elves eventually.

[Beloren]

Do you know what happens to blood elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become wretched. Do you know what happens to nightborne elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become withered. Two different but very similar states that robs the afflicted elf of their physical strength as well as their mental stability until they go feral.

no, they do not, I thought only blood elves who gorged themselves on magic (fel or arcane) and couldn't discipline themselves enough to control their appetited became wretched, the inverse/opposite of the nightborne withered who become that way if they starved of nightwell arcane source.

very different situation, but the similarity is that they have magic issue, actually the blood elves no longer have magic issues like that, it got solved with the Sunwell's restoration and even their arcane addiction is healed now.

and wretched aren't robbed of physical strength.. but withered are.. I mean it's in the name, you know withering away, is what your mum calls yon you get quite thin, knowing that you have not been eating much or have become anorexic.. wretched is what you're called when you behave like a wretch, I mean it's all in the names right? Are wretched feral? they seem quite magical or capable of it, and they speak to you too, so they have higher functions enabled, the withered don't speak to you, they are mindless, nightfallen are very weak, not the case with the wretched that seem quite strong and able, just warped from their lack of control, the greedy imbeciles, - such an embarrassment to the blood elves but the quests tell you all this info.

[Spellweaver]

Now this I really like, would be so cool to have similar armor thing. And yes, the nigthborne should lose the nightwell, and after Orgrimmar's defeat in SoO, the horde should gain the whole city, I mean, blood elves have behaved more responsibly and as elves they have as much right to it after the nightborne are punished or driven away

But the Horde didn't lose a city, why should they gain another one?

Neither of the factions should get to fully claim Suramar City, it should remain in control of the Nightfallen and the Nightborne that aren't loyal to Elisande

do we know for sure it was the sunwell that made the night elves into high elves? because other sources say it was the exile and being cut off from the new well and nordrassil, then having to endure what they did and change themselves that did it, not the sunwell.

It was caused by being cut off from the Well of Eternity

And was Suramar a highborne city? I recall only Eldre'thalas described as a highborne city, Suramar was highborne-led but all classes of night elves lived in there right? or am I wrong there.

Both Zin-Azshari and Suramar had Highborne and non-Highborne inhabitants, Eldre'Thalas was described as a Highborne city because it's where Queen Azshara's servitors lived.

It's likely that the cities were still designed and built by Highborne, since they were the among the noble ranks.

[Wildmoon]

I will try to explan to the best of my ability.

The Night Elves of old were a thriving society based on arcane magic and druidism. The ones that were richer, closer to the royal family and nobles in general with relations to the court, were called Highbornes. They were the ones that adopted the arcane traditions the most.

Now, after the war of the ancients the night elves that were not Highborne shunned and feared arcane magic, even forbbiding the practice of it. So it is no surprise that they chose to leave Suramar and what was left of the highborne behind. Not only that, but some of the Highbornes left suramar too in hopes of a better home somewhere else, they eventually became High elves. The ones that stayed in suramar became Nightbornes.

So as you can see, the high elves are directly related to the Night elves highbornes. And the image that we have of the night elves today is incomplete, because we only see a fragment of what night elf culture really is, we only see the druidism part. But arcane was always ingrained deeply in their culture, they just shunned and hated it. And that is why it took so long for the night elves to accept mages within their ranks.

So in short:
Night elves= Night elves commons that left suramar.
Highborne= Rich night elves
Nightborne= Descendants of highbornes that chose to stay
High elf= Descendants of Highborne that migrated, most of them eventually changed their names to Blood elves eventually.

There was no druidism in the night elf culture until Malfurion learned and started teaching the arts which was shortly before WotA. The Night Elf lived somewhat close to nature but there was no such a thing as druidism.

[daigotsurezan]

do we know for sure it was the sunwell that made the night elves into high elves? because other sources say it was the exile and being cut off from the new well and nordrassil, then having to endure what they did and change themselves that did it, not the sunwell.

Also I thought the night elves of Suramar just became a bit more corrupt due to the night well, Thalyssra's skin goes darker more night coloured in the video, and she becomes thinner, it doesn't seem that much of a change, she just becomes a bit uglier and more anorexic - though not as bad as the nightfallen state.

Do you know what happens to blood elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become wretched. Do you know what happens to nightborne elves who get cut off from their source of power? They become withered. Two different but very similar states that robs the afflicted elf of their physical strength as well as their mental stability until they go feral.

I think Calfredd explains this best.

And was Suramar a highborne city? I recall only Eldre'thalas described as a highborne city, Suramar was highborne-led but all classes of night elves lived in there right? or am I wrong there.

The term "Highborne" was a class distinction; consider them the nobility whereas most of the elves were the peasantry. But you would still describe someone from France, regardless of their social position, as French. The Highborne aren't some kind of subspecies of superior elf.

[StationaryHawk]

It sounds to me like you just plain don't like night elves, and I don't see what that has to do with whether Suramar is aesthetically fitting for the nightborne.

[Themanintobuildafire]

My thought was how is it that this city was on our planet for 10k years, and we've been playing for 10 years (but most likely that is a generation in-game looking at the new king of Stormwind) and we never had a ship find it? Our travels across the sea from Org to STV didn't see the Broken Isles and this awesome city?

I am hoping at the end the shield goes down, the demons leave the city and we get it as a major hub. Doubt that will happen but would be awesome it is such a cool city. (well would be better if we had flying...the different levels make me nuts atm)

[Sanguinerd]

Yeah Blizzard should really retcon it cus one random chap doesn't "feel" it...

Looks and feels fine to me, I like the story.

[Calfredd]

Yeah I'm about to give up. The OP is clearly fanboying so hard that he is feigning ignorance and willfully obstinate no matter how many times the situation is explained to him just because he likes blood elves more.

[Beloren]

It sounds to me like you just plain don't like night elves, and I don't see what that has to do with whether Suramar is aesthetically fitting for the nightborne.

maybe, some people don't like orcs, and blizzard has tried very hard in every expansion but this one to make them like them, but they still don't. Can't explain it, some races are just nice, others... well....

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Yeah I'm about to give up. The OP is clearly fanboying so hard that he is feigning ignorance and willfully obstinate no matter how many times the situation is explained to him just because he likes blood elves more.

okay, maybe you're right, maybe you're not, but I can't be the only one that feels the same.

[Calfredd]

okay, maybe you're right, maybe you're not, but I can't be the only one that feels the same.

The same what? The same level of fayboyism towards a subspecies of elf?