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  1. #401
    Last Night I picked up Tarnished Sentinel Medallion and The Deceiver's Grand Design. I was wondering if either of these are upgrade over DCM: Promises and 900 Perfectly Preserved Cake.

  2. #402
    DMC; Do you need the mana? If yes, then no.
    Cake; Deceivers will do far more if you can put it on targets that won't get gibbed instantly. Sentinel medallion is just for DPS purposes (it will boost healing slightly through atonement during the uptime, but it has negative synergy with disc; You need to put atonements out during the duration to gain healing from it, but each atonement you put out is one less spell that could hit the boss and trigger the additional attack).

  3. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracodraco View Post
    DMC; Do you need the mana? If yes, then no.
    Cake; Deceivers will do far more if you can put it on targets that won't get gibbed instantly. Sentinel medallion is just for DPS purposes (it will boost healing slightly through atonement during the uptime, but it has negative synergy with disc; You need to put atonements out during the duration to gain healing from it, but each atonement you put out is one less spell that could hit the boss and trigger the additional attack).
    Ok, thanks for the info.

  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryzek View Post
    Ok, thanks for the info.
    Yes, cheers.

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryzek View Post
    Last Night I picked up Tarnished Sentinel Medallion and The Deceiver's Grand Design. I was wondering if either of these are upgrade over DCM: Promises and 900 Perfectly Preserved Cake.

    Wanted to chime in here, first of, my thoughts and prayers are with you for your lack of velen's. That said the sentinel medallion is actually listed as one of the best trinkets for disc right now. This is most likely targeting mythic players, but sentinel's is used over promises. I don't know the ilvl difference (i.e. if a 915 owl > 900 promises or if owl > promises always (if it was a 900 owl)), but since you lack velen's anyway I would suggest using both owl and promises.

    A scenario where I would use Deceiver's as disc would just be if tank healing wasn't up to par. It isn't really out niche at all, but it can help. Since you don't have velen's hogging a spot, you should try promises + owl trinket, and occasionally consider putting in deceiver's (over owl) if the tank healing is really, really bad (or in m+ which makes more "sense").

    As for why to hold onto promises and not run Deceiver's + owl, would be that promises gives a lot of flexibility in our rotation, in that you could over extend yourself and actually recover from it, if you're very comfortable with your mana, and you're already taking mindbender, you could try it though.

    For specific ways or instances to use the owl trinket, I'd check in on the focusedwill discord conversations, definitely don't be afraid to ask about it. Link is on focusedwill.com

    Cheers!
    Daft Punk Forever!

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by arizonapriest93 View Post
    Wanted to chime in here, first of, my thoughts and prayers are with you for your lack of velen's. That said the sentinel medallion is actually listed as one of the best trinkets for disc right now. This is most likely targeting mythic players, but sentinel's is used over promises. I don't know the ilvl difference (i.e. if a 915 owl > 900 promises or if owl > promises always (if it was a 900 owl)), but since you lack velen's anyway I would suggest using both owl and promises.

    A scenario where I would use Deceiver's as disc would just be if tank healing wasn't up to par. It isn't really out niche at all, but it can help. Since you don't have velen's hogging a spot, you should try promises + owl trinket, and occasionally consider putting in deceiver's (over owl) if the tank healing is really, really bad (or in m+ which makes more "sense").

    As for why to hold onto promises and not run Deceiver's + owl, would be that promises gives a lot of flexibility in our rotation, in that you could over extend yourself and actually recover from it, if you're very comfortable with your mana, and you're already taking mindbender, you could try it though.

    For specific ways or instances to use the owl trinket, I'd check in on the focusedwill discord conversations, definitely don't be afraid to ask about it. Link is on focusedwill.com

    Cheers!
    Thanks for the info. I'm kinda treating my DMC as a security blanket right now. I need to test how I do with out it but tbh I know I waste a lot of mana. I'm still new to healing in general. This week I ran DMC and Medallion and I was pretty happy with the results. I'm still learning and trying to get better at timing my bursts but medallion worked well when I did the burst right. No velen's yet I run high priest ring and pradz neck, hopefully Velen's will come in time.

  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryzek View Post
    Thanks for the info. I'm kinda treating my DMC as a security blanket right now. I need to test how I do with out it but tbh I know I waste a lot of mana. I'm still new to healing in general. This week I ran DMC and Medallion and I was pretty happy with the results. I'm still learning and trying to get better at timing my bursts but medallion worked well when I did the burst right. No velen's yet I run high priest ring and pradz neck, hopefully Velen's will come in time.
    Totally, and those are at least the 2nd/3rd best so that doesn't suck as much (even if velen's is god mode). Good luck mastering it all!
    Daft Punk Forever!

  8. #408
    Mana should really be all that much of an issue anymore I'm fairly med low geared at 913 ilvl doing heroics with 20 ish people usually 3 healers and for me mana is only an issue when I'm carelessly dps tunnelling, I switched to Sea Star of the Depthmother and Deceiver's Grand Design about a week ago both are decent trinkets vs the others in this tier, also deceiver's shouldn't be underestimated a 2mil shield proc per trinket which stacks is insanely good for giving healers time to react. Like at that point on Sisters heroic solo tanking where the tank is being chunked and about to die painfully, this trinket can help them live a bit longer.
    Last edited by CoolNitro; 2017-07-23 at 05:29 AM.

  9. #409
    All right I take back what I said about mana not being an issue, I had an unfortunate day where there wasn't enough pallies for a wisdom on all healers and none on me, I seriously felt the lack of mana and was forced to use the DMC trinket to have any hope of reaching the end of a fight without running dry. I guess I took for granted the abnormal amount of pallies we usually have in the raid sometimes enough for 2 wisdoms, that paired with our reduced mana hunger from last tier meant I was overflowing with mana without properly taking into account external buffs.

  10. #410
    How is Barbaric Mindslaver? Got one 920 with leech, but the proc only accounts for 2% of my healing, give or take 1%. Is the passive int gain and the leech going to be worth it over a 905 Flask or a 900 owl trinket?

  11. #411
    Epic! Zombina's Avatar
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    I've been away a while and Im just now catching up on getting to AK level 40, which might take a while. With that in mind, is it better to go for the the 7.2 artifact traits first or go back and max out some of the better old traits to 4/4 first?

    Whichever I choose to do second looks like it might take a really long time to do, if I ever even get around to it. So Im looking for the best immediate boost.
    Last edited by Zombina; 2017-08-17 at 04:02 PM.

  12. #412
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombina View Post
    I've been away a while and Im just now catching up on getting to AK level 40, which might take a while. With that in mind, is it better to go for the the 7.2 artifact traits first or go back and max out some of the better old traits to 4/4 first?

    Whichever I choose to do second looks like it might take a really long time to do, if I ever even get around to it. So Im looking for the best immediate boost.
    AK research is done in 4 hours. If you can farm the order ress (which you should be able to), you can get from 25 to 40 in as little as 3 days, and after you hit 40, it won't be more than a week from literally level 0 artifact, up to level 52 (which is concordance) if you're actively playing.

    That being said, for disc, Penance damage is stronger than the new traits if you want to look good on meters. The new 4 pointer is pretty damn good for overall "output", though, but it doesn't show. I have 2 relics with the trait (heroic loves to throw titanforged fragments from maiden at us), which means I reduce damage taken from people with my atonement by 3%. On our latest sisters kill, people took a total of 1.11B damage when my atonement was present (as seen: https://gyazo.com/e65fc93b35fd6fadce8404930a1b6425 ) - which means that the "effectivity" of my 3% damage reduction was about 33M healing worth; Or about 7% HPS, as I did 457M healing (490/457=1.072; so realistically, 1.2% HPS per trait).

    Now, out of my healing, 70% came from atonement, and out of my atonement-granting spells, Penance did 40% of my damage.

    That means a 5% buff to 40% is ~2%, and a 2% buff to 70% is ~1.4% - or ever so slightly more than the new damage-reduction trait (that clocks in at around 1.2% per trait, as explained above).

    Of course, there's multiple ways to look at this;
    -Sisters is a good fight because you're relatively sure that no matter who you have atonement on, it's going to get value out of the damage reduction, as there's lots of raidwide damage. As it's a percentage reduction, the size of the hits do not really matter.
    -Penance provides damage (which is a big part of why you'd want a disc over any other healer).
    -Penance provides more burst (again, big part of disc' strength is burst; Amplifying that is a worthy cause).
    -Penance can overheal; This never will
    -For dungeons, where nobody else is going to be helping you heal people, more damage/effective healing is likely preferable to reduction.

    Etc, etc.

    'Course, as said, you'll get all the talents in no time, but if it comes to it, I'd pick up a penance trait, then go for the new ones; And if you have to pick relics in Tomb, I'd think long and hard about what's actually more "effective" in terms of fulfilling your role, versus what LOOKS better, because I don't think I'd value the SW:P relic over the new trait. It's also worth noting that the better you become at pushing disc, the "worse" the trait becomes. Using Supz as an example of a really fucking good disc, in this log:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...24true%24false The raid took 900M damage under atonement, with a 3% (he's got two relics as well) DR, so about 27M.
    Sups however, did 540M HPS, which means that he would "only" gain 5% HPS from the 6x traits, where I gained 7%.

  13. #413
    For Mythic KJ when are good times to use barrier? Like if I use it for the second eruption the CD isn't up again for the first Darkness of a thousand souls. Is it better to use it on the second erupting adds or the phase 4 transition? Also we have a resto shaman but spirit link is also a 3min cd so which is better used for erupting and for the first darkness?

  14. #414
    Its still haste>mastery>crit in raid for disc ?

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by bl1zzaga View Post
    Its still haste>mastery>crit in raid for disc ?
    Secondary stats are pretty equal. It's a good rule of thumb to just wear your highest item level pieces in most cases (except for tier and trinkets).

  16. #416
    Quote Originally Posted by MendUS View Post
    Secondary stats are pretty equal. It's a good rule of thumb to just wear your highest item level pieces in most cases (except for tier and trinkets).
    Actually slightly curious - all stats are relatively equal as you say, but is there a point where too much of one becomes well... "too much"? Asking because I'm capable of pushing +14K haste with no real Ilvl drops in my current gear, but it does drop my mastery awfully low (and mana actually starts to be an issue when you can cast as fast and much as you can with 14K haste). I'm deffo wearing a high crit, high haste set for dungeons where you actually occasionally cast non-atonement heals, but curious if I should be concerned with staying near the ~45-50% mastery most people tend to go with, or if dropping to say ~35% in favor of DPS stats is "okay".

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracodraco View Post
    Actually slightly curious - all stats are relatively equal as you say, but is there a point where too much of one becomes well... "too much"? Asking because I'm capable of pushing +14K haste with no real Ilvl drops in my current gear, but it does drop my mastery awfully low (and mana actually starts to be an issue when you can cast as fast and much as you can with 14K haste). I'm deffo wearing a high crit, high haste set for dungeons where you actually occasionally cast non-atonement heals, but curious if I should be concerned with staying near the ~45-50% mastery most people tend to go with, or if dropping to say ~35% in favor of DPS stats is "okay".
    Haste in raids should be somewhat less valuable in the Burning Throne than it is right now, since the Tier 21 bonuses tie Power Word: Radiance to Penance casts, and neither cooldown is affected by haste. So definitely keep that borderline crit/mastery/vers gear that you're currently considering to be worse than haste.

    As far as high haste goes in 7.3, I haven't noticed any diminishing returns.

  18. #418
    Stood in the Fire BadguyNotBadGuy's Avatar
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    recently jumped on my priest and found that the revamped disc is immense amounts of fun.

    Just wanted to ask:
    1. is clarity of will the only viable talent in the lvl75 row?
    2. whats the best sitations to use each of the level 100 talents? cos they all feel relatively useful to me

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by BadguyNotBadGuy View Post
    recently jumped on my priest and found that the revamped disc is immense amounts of fun.

    Just wanted to ask:
    1. is clarity of will the only viable talent in the lvl75 row?
    Sanctuary is much better for raids. Shadow Covenant is *sometimes* useful in M+ dungeons (like for grievous affix IIRC)

    2. whats the best sitations to use each of the level 100 talents? cos they all feel relatively useful to me
    Grace for dungeons, Evangelism for raids. Basically you will only use Power Infusion in order to increase your DPS, i.e. questing, soloing, etc.
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  20. #420
    Stood in the Fire BadguyNotBadGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
    Sanctuary is much better for raids. Shadow Covenant is *sometimes* useful in M+ dungeons (like for grievous affix IIRC)



    Grace for dungeons, Evangelism for raids. Basically you will only use Power Infusion in order to increase your DPS, i.e. questing, soloing, etc.
    Awesome man, tyvm for the info.

    Does Grace affect SC? and does it affect both the absorb and the drawback?

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