Four Guantanamo detainees transferring to Saudi Arabia, as part of final wave

[Darsithis]

But I wont use one to justify the other.

I also need to point out that the price of freedom is possibly letting dangerous people go. You can't have both. We either have freedom - for all - or we have complete government control. I'll take freedom any day.

[TrumpIsPresident]

I also need to point out that the price of freedom is possibly letting dangerous people go. You can't have both. We either have freedom - for all - or we have complete government control. I'll take freedom any day.

We can have both because an innocent person can be let go as well.

[Edge-]

We can have both because an innocent person can be let go as well.

So you think it's alright to imprison people without giving any reason, for an indefinite amount of time, and without any trial, simply if you go "Oops!" and let them go years down the road?

[Stormspark]

So you think it's alright to imprison people without giving any reason, for an indefinite amount of time, and without any trial, simply if you go "Oops!" and let them go years down the road?

They'll think it's fine, until the police state comes, and they're accused of some random crime and held without charges or trial. Then it will suddenly be not fine.

I don't care who they are, or where they come from, or what they did. Even if they did something very heinous, *charge them with a crime and try them in court, and give them whatever sentence the court gives them*. I have no doubt that there are innocent people there, whose only crime was from being from "that" part of the world and have an Arabic sounding name.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I see a very absurd pattern here. OP you are very predictable, scary but predictable.

[Machismo]

We can have both because an innocent person can be let go as well.

Then prove that those we've incarcerated are guilty. I'm still waiting for that.

[stabetha]

Then treat them accordingly under the Geneva Conventions.

actually we are, they are classified as Unlawful combatants and an unlawful combatant may be detained or prosecuted

[Machismo]

actually we are, they are classified as Unlawful combatants and an unlawful combatant may be detained or prosecuted

No, we chose to create a new word under the American legal system (AG Gonzalez did it) in order to avoid them being considered enemy combatants. The term does not even actually appear in the Geneva Conventions. Since we deemed that they did not belong to a sovereign state, we could justifiably incarcerate them. Of course, that means anyone could simply say a person did not belong to a sovereign state, and ignore the Geneva Conventions. On top of that, when we did take them, they would fall under the jurisdiction of the American government, which means they would have right to due process. We did not do that, we tried to conjure gray area in order to avoid it. AG Gonzalez waved a magic wand, and deemed it to be perfectly acceptable to do so. On top of that, it was deemed that there is no legal recourse, as it would not fall under something that could be stopped by the federal court system. It was a gross overstep of executive power, and proved the hypocrisy of millions of conservatives in this country. They don't give a shit about freedom, law, order, or due process.

[The Penguin]

This is why you just execute the prisoners. Send the heads back to the family as a warning. Right? Right?
Or maybe, just maybe, have a Military Tribunal act on it rather than confining them at our expense indefinitely.

[Deleted]

So you think it's alright to imprison people without giving any reason, for an indefinite amount of time, and without any trial, simply if you go "Oops!" and let them go years down the road?

It's quite obvious that he does think that. I'm interested in why anyone is even humouring him. His delusions are dangerous to your sanity.

[Blade Wolf]

You totally missed the point I was trying to make. Saudi Arabia have free education "up to bachelor" & free healthcare. Not to mention that if you don't find a job you are taken care of with minimum wage for 2 years or until you find a job.

Ironic to consider Saudi Arabia a 3rd world country with all those perks.

Once you stop imprisoning people for not believing in a certain religion or doing "witchcraft" then we can talk about stepping out of the 3rd world status.

[Ahovv]

George Washington would be considered a terrorist by the British government.

[God Save The King]

3rd world shit holes?

God damn Irish, Austrian, Swiss, Swedish, Finnish third world shit holes.

They should join glorious countries like Turkey, Iran, Thailand, The Philippines, Zimbabwe, and Mozambique in the might of the First world.

[Deleted]

We can have both because an innocent person can be let go as well.

Sixth Amendment to the United States Constitution

the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury

You cant have a person locked up in years widout begin the trial.

[Skroe]

They're fkin terrorists.

The US court system doesn't even apply.

Why did you think they were in Gitmo in the first place?

Man you're not just wrong, you're actually, mattery of factly, dead wrong.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boumediene_v._Bush

Boumediene v. Bush, 2008.

On June 12, 2008, Justice Kennedy delivered the opinion for the 5–4 majority, holding that the prisoners had a right to the writ of habeas corpus under the United States Constitution and that the Military Commissions Act of 2006 was an unconstitutional suspension of that right. The Court applied the Insular Cases, by the fact that the United States, by virtue of its complete jurisdiction and control, maintains de facto sovereignty over this territory, while Cuba retained ultimate sovereignty over the territory, to hold that the aliens detained as enemy combatants on that territory were entitled to the writ of habeas corpus protected in Article I, Section 9 of the U.S. Constitution.

So yes, the US Court System directly applies.

Don't get me wrong. I think international outrage over Guantanamo has been largely hystrionic, stupid and overblown since the start. It is certainly not the "Gulag of our Times" as the former UK head of Amnesty called it. Many opponents of America have used it as an excuse to illegitimately undermine our position in the world (some of it of course, is legitimate misbehavior on our part).

But I also think it was moronic on the part of the Bush Administration to create such a high profile target for dealing with terrorists. It's done nothing but taint the detainees beyond the ability to prosecute them fairly. The fact that Bagram in Afghanistan and domestic locations were used later illustrates that the mistake of Guantanamo has been a lesson learned by the government.

Years ago I didn't think that GITMO detainees should be accorded civilian legal protections. But that view had its day in court. Repeatedly. It lost fair and square.

The fact that Guantanamo is open to this day is a farce. The fact is, nobody knows what to do with them. Any prosecution and execution coming out of there will be seen as tainted in the eyes of the world (and that does matter) and about half of Americans. Any releases are a security risk to us. It's a no-win scenario.

Meanwhile Khalid Sheik Mohammed is about a third of his life older than than from the day he was taken into custody, as the world's only superpower has completely screwed the pooch in figuring out how to arrange the meeting between him and his creator. It's 2017 and we can't even execute him... because of Guantanamo and torture. You realize he's never lived in his whole life a place as long as Guantanamo? It's an absurdity.

The best thing to do is just cut our losses, draw a line under it all, send most of them them to foreign countries. Also throw KSM (and just KSM) into Supermax until the end of time and eat the two weeks of Human Rights Watch outrage, and don't screw up in such a ridiculous and self defeating manner going forward.

Guantanamo was post-9/11 America losing it's shit and trying to do something that brought it short term satisfaction ("An island prison for the worst terrorists in our new Global War on Terror!") at the expense of our long term interests.

[Wells]

I mean we know what to do with the people at Gitmo, its just that the political will and cost all stack towards doing nothing until they die.

[Skroe]

I mean we know what to do with the people at Gitmo, its just that the political will and cost all stack towards doing nothing until they die.

We're going to be waiting a long, long, long time.

[Independent voter]

people that support unlawfully putting people in prison without any kind of due process needs to move to a country where the government does that, united states isnt for you

Unlawful? They're kind of like POWs only they don't have a government to come and get them. They were enemy captured in a war zone, POWs.

We've been giving them away to any country who'll take them. We'll give these last 30 or so mad dogs to your country if your country asks for them.

[Noxx79]

Unlawful? They're kind of like POWs only they don't have a government to come and get them. They were enemy captured in a war zone, POWs.

We've been giving them away to any country who'll take them. We'll give these last 30 or so mad dogs to your country if your country asks for them.

So you have no problem with what Obama is doing then.