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  1. #181
    Pit Lord RH92's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    You dare wrong. Being able to see the hero is not an issue even on the lowest settings, it's only when stealthed it becomes an issue. Stealthed heroes are plain as sunlight when revealed, even on the lowest settings.
    No, what I meant is: You think a Zeratul should probably be here so you use Oracle, but he is not in range yet and you basically "miss" it. While normally when you can spot the shimmer, that is the moment when you try to use Oracle as you want him to be revealed for the longest time possible to disrupt his engage. Does it make a sense?

    Sorry for misunderstanding.

  2. #182
    LOL ...what a disappointment about hots community, initial win % is 41.3.

  3. #183
    Deleted
    I love her. She is so much fun, i dont know, maybe the msot fun i had in hots. Cant even tell you why exactly. The mix of the sneaky "will i get my opener" gameplay, and the fact she has different openers for different targets makes her quite evrsatile and the mobility via sinister strike is pretty cool.

    She is deleting her targets pretty good and is some sort of noob basher...but damn she is easily countered. All those enemy teams with Tassadar/Oracle or that scouting drone...i am having quite a hard time with her. hose few games i played with and agaisnt her, she does not seem OP. Scary if you cant handle her. If you can, she is more of a nuisance.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Ballistic View Post
    LOL ...what a disappointment about hots community, initial win % is 41.3.
    Still don't have Internet so I've only been able to do basic testing but I have a couple of thoughts on this:

    1) her role is similar to zeratul, it's niche and she shouldn't fit into any team, she can't lane effectively and has to gank. People are playing her like a melee assassin similar to thrall which she just isn't.

    2) she's complex and has a lot of decision making going on all the time. Whilst I maintain she's mechanically easier to pick up than Alarak she feels like she has more depth than any assassin we've seen so far.

    3) Her talents, whilst seemingly simple, actually have nuance. I think she's the first character we've seen where talents can potentially work against each other resulting in net 0 gains.

    I've no idea where she'll end up win rate wise, but I think at the very least she's going to cause a lot of emotions at the pro level. Looking forward to her being open at hgc.
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  5. #185
    Pit Lord RH92's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ballistic View Post
    LOL ...what a disappointment about hots community, initial win % is 41.3.
    As expected to be honest. As I said, she isn't a good Hero. Sure she is fun to play, but she does nothing better then current melee Assassins and has a lot of depth.

    Her strengths:
    • Scouting, but Zeratul does it better as he can mount while being cloaked.
    • Damage, but Zeratul does same burst in two abilities and one or two AAs in comparison to Valeera's complex ability rotation.
    • Mobility, but both Zeratul and Illidan can cover greater distances and they can't be screwed up by body blocks as she can be because of Sinister Strike mechanics and when it comes to chasing, Illidan is still the king.
    • Slippery, being able to activate stealth whenever you want in combat is really good and Cloak of Shadows is very useful tool.

    Her weaknesses:
    • No sustain despite having quite an large health pool.
    • Reliant on opener, once it is survived or denied you have to retreat and wait for cooldowns as you can't win any damage trade AND you no longer bring any utility to a fight unless you invest into Wound Poison.
    • Not very good heroics, dunno why people take Smoke Bomb when you can just walk out of it. On the other hand self-cleanse on low cooldown is really helpful, still no Void Prison though. Nor they give her a chance to continue in a fight, they are basically retreat tools.
    • No map impact, can't solo camps (While Zeratul with Mending Strikes can), low Immortal DPS and no sustain to hold any position.
    • Hard to understand, easy to play.

  6. #186
    The Lightbringer De Lupe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RH92 View Post
    [*]Not very good heroics, dunno why people take Smoke Bomb when you can just walk out of it. On the other hand self-cleanse on low cooldown is really helpful, still no Void Prison though. Nor they give her a chance to continue in a fight, they are basically retreat tools.
    Her Heroics are for escape/survival, not damage or utility. You pick the Heroic based on the enemy team comp.

    Smoke Bomb is for escaping heroes like Tracer or Illidan. Heroes with no/limited crowd control that can chase/kill you before Vanish is back.

    Cloak of Shadows is for crowd control escapes like Thralls wolf or Chromies Temporal Loop or other heroes with CC the will fuck you up if caught at the wrong time.

  7. #187
    Pit Lord RH92's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by De Lupe View Post
    Her Heroics are for escape/survival, not damage or utility. You pick the Heroic based on the enemy team comp.

    Smoke Bomb is for escaping heroes like Tracer or Illidan. Heroes with no/limited crowd control that can chase/kill you before Vanish is back.

    Cloak of Shadows is for crowd control escapes like Thralls wolf or Chromies Temporal Loop or other heroes with CC the will fuck you up if caught at the wrong time.
    Really? I had no idea... On serious note. They are one dimensional heroics, look at VP or Sundering. They both have offensive and defensive capabilities. Or Metamorphosis that helps you to live longer and dish out more damage while it can be used to escape or dodge other abilities with good timing.

  8. #188
    The Lightbringer De Lupe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RH92 View Post
    Really? I had no idea... On serious note. They are one dimensional heroics, look at VP or Sundering. They both have offensive and defensive capabilities. Or Metamorphosis that helps you to live longer and dish out more damage while it can be used to escape or dodge other abilities with good timing.
    She has so much utility in her base kit that she didn't need more from her heroics.

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by RH92 View Post
    Really? I had no idea... On serious note. They are one dimensional heroics, look at VP or Sundering. They both have offensive and defensive capabilities. Or Metamorphosis that helps you to live longer and dish out more damage while it can be used to escape or dodge other abilities with good timing.
    OTOH, look at Raynor's Raiders or Hyperion, or both of which let you do damage or...do damage. And unlike Raynor, Valeera's KIT already provides more than enough dimensions that she doesn't need a complex heroic.

    Also, you are wrong anyway, Smoke Bomb is not 1 dimensional. You can use it defensively to escape, or offensively to secure a kill.

  10. #190
    Pit Lord Fallen Angel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    OTOH, look at Raynor's Raiders or Hyperion, or both of which let you do damage or...do damage. And unlike Raynor, Valeera's KIT already provides more than enough dimensions that she doesn't need a complex heroic.

    Also, you are wrong anyway, Smoke Bomb is not 1 dimensional. You can use it defensively to escape, or offensively to secure a kill.
    Single target or AOE AND zoning. I use Valeera's ults as escape tools and really nothing else, except bomb against AA heavy comps.

  11. #191
    Cloak of Shadows is insane against Chromie or similarly-telegraphed crowd control abilities. Anub charging you? Tough luck.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Fallen Angel View Post
    I use Valeera's ults as escape tools and really nothing else,
    If that's all you're using Smoke Bomb for, you're doing it wrong. And by your logic, Raynor's ults provide either AoE or Single Target and that counts as not-one dimensional, well, then Valeera's ults provide either AA immunity or Unstoppable, which means they're just as non-1 dimensional as Raynor's.

  13. #193
    Pit Lord RH92's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    OTOH, look at Raynor's Raiders or Hyperion, or both of which let you do damage or...do damage. And unlike Raynor, Valeera's KIT already provides more than enough dimensions that she doesn't need a complex heroic.

    Also, you are wrong anyway, Smoke Bomb is not 1 dimensional. You can use it defensively to escape, or offensively to secure a kill.
    How can you use Smoke Bomb to secure a kill? All your opponent need to do is to casually walk out of it.

  14. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by RH92 View Post
    How can you use Smoke Bomb to secure a kill? All your opponent need to do is to casually walk out of it.
    With the damage Valeera can do, you're likely to be dead before your manage to walk out of it. I mean, assuming you're not doing something dumb like dropping a Smoke bomb on a Johanna or Muradin or something.

  15. #195
    She's a lot of fun at low levels of play! Just get literally any talents and straight up stab people to death from stealth. It's literally like ganking as a rogue in WoW.

  16. #196
    People play HotS?

    I jest, I tried it and I'm terrible so this makes me feel better about myself
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  17. #197
    Scouting drones needs to be nerfed it is completely shutting down Valeera, at least Zeratul can kill it and warp away and Nova can kill it from range, but Valeera can't do shit about it.

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by Ballistic View Post
    Scouting drones needs to be nerfed it is completely shutting down Valeera, at least Zeratul can kill it and warp away and Nova can kill it from range, but Valeera can't do shit about it.
    god forbid people use the few tools available to counter someone
    "It's 2013 and I still view the internet on a 560x192 resolution monitor!"

  19. #199
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Ballistic View Post
    Scouting drones needs to be nerfed it is completely shutting down Valeera, at least Zeratul can kill it and warp away and Nova can kill it from range, but Valeera can't do shit about it.
    So you want to let her do whatever she wants lol?

  20. #200
    i used her in a brawl and she was pretty fun. talents take some getting used to.

    Not a hero you want to stick with one base set of talents for or go on icy veins to copy over. You need to know which talents go well together and which dont, as well as choose them accordingly to the enemy team.

    Yes this goes for any hero but Valeera is particular sensitive to it. Choose the right one as per the above and she'll wreck their shit. Don't and she's a free kill.

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