Anyone really dislike this state of Frost?

[Cempa]

WoD Frost was hands the down the most fun ... Legion is OK just feels more 'mechanical' ...

[Deleted]

I feel like I can't switch to BoS.

I have Bracers, Aggramars and Prydaz for Frost. Bracers also for Blood.

I was actually going for my next Blood legendary looking for Shoulders or Belt but now with the BoS change it seems I have to change back to Frost lootspec because with my current setup I am simming 20k dps lower with a BoS built. So I guess I need Helm, Belt or Ring before I can switch to BoS...

[boz0]

So my 871 DK alt has only the helm at this point. I used to play Icy Talons/FsC because mostly doing mid-level M+ (<=9), should I switch to BoS or GS for that kind of content?

[Schizoide]

Generally speaking unless you're playing with a set group that needs you to focus on single-target damage, you should be using FsC.

I haven't simmed it out but with the helm GS should be very competitive. It's a nice middle-ground between RA and FsC even helmless.

[Hoeth]

So my 871 DK alt has only the helm at this point. I used to play Icy Talons/FsC because mostly doing mid-level M+ (<=9), should I switch to BoS or GS for that kind of content?

BoS will do much higher boss damage, but if you aren't comfortable with it or want more consistent trash damage a 3/1/1/x/x/3/1 works very well for both trash and bosses, particularly so if you have the legendary helm and 2/4 piece tier.

FSc needs a buff to remain relevant in anything other than 5+ target situations. It is a shame because it felt like a nice addition to the toolkit and actually requires some tiny amount of decision making.

[Schizoide]

It is up to 5 targets now? Have you actually simmed it, or is that your guess?

[Claymore]

I completely and utterly despise Frost as it is now.

To me, 2hand Frost was perfect. For one, it used a 2hander (I've never, since the class was announced, thought DW'ing was a good fit). Second, the rotation just felt "good". You had those massive hits with Obliterate and Frost Strike, but Howling Blast still gave you some utility at a change or when dealing with AoE.

Frankly, 2hand Frost was just *fun*.

DW Frost was never my thing, and as much as I've tried to enjoy it, I just can't bring myself to enjoy it now, either.

[Hoeth]

It is up to 5 targets now? Have you actually simmed it, or is that your guess?

The difference between GS and FSc at 4 targets was 1.4k dps in favor of FSc. 5+ put it solidly ahead.

[Schizoide]

2H frost had a major problem in that most of its damage was concentrated in Obliterate, which doesn't scale with mastery. So it was always fighting to remain competitive, and usually failed. The playstyle was supposed to be similar, with KM spent on OB rather than FS, but that failed when Blizzard accepted the emergent Masterfrost playstyle, which basically spammed HB as much as possible. Frost also had a major problem with wait times in the beginning of WoD. And of course KM was the key spec mechanic and it was best ignored for its entire lifetime.

All that stuff is either removed from the game or addressed in 7.x. IMO, frost is the best it's ever been. Doesn't mean it's perfect-- talents in particular are an incredible mess, which the vast majority vastly undertuned and some conceptually/mechanically unusable/noncompetitive. But frost's core gameplay has never been better.

[Hoeth]

I completely and utterly despise Frost as it is now.

To me, 2hand Frost was perfect. For one, it used a 2hander (I've never, since the class was announced, thought DW'ing was a good fit). Second, the rotation just felt "good". You had those massive hits with Obliterate and Frost Strike, but Howling Blast still gave you some utility at a change or when dealing with AoE.

Frankly, 2hand Frost was just *fun*.

DW Frost was never my thing, and as much as I've tried to enjoy it, I just can't bring myself to enjoy it now, either.

I liked the focus on big obliterates too, but the spec was a complete mess. Horrid synergy between stats and abilities lead to historically awful gear scaling, and the miserable AOE damage was not compensated enough by is ST damage. It was never designed or balanced right, and even though I wish they had decided to put in the effort to make it work, we are better off now.

[Numero]

I always liked DW (thematically) better than 2H Frost, but I see no real good reason why they can't just make it a cosmetic difference. We have been down that road before though. blah.

That said, I like where Frost is right now, gameplay-wise, but I abhor the Breath-style gameplay, and simply cannot stand moving at 100% movement speed. Pretty much killed the DK for me and drove me to my enhancement shaman.

[Schizoide]

Oh god yes, I switched mains due to 100% runspeed too. To be clear, I absolutely DESPISE playing my DK due to 100% runspeed. I was specifically talking about how the spec plays mechanically in combat.

[DagrDK]

I feel like I can't switch to BoS.

I have Bracers, Aggramars and Prydaz for Frost. Bracers also for Blood.

I was actually going for my next Blood legendary looking for Shoulders or Belt but now with the BoS change it seems I have to change back to Frost lootspec because with my current setup I am simming 20k dps lower with a BoS built. So I guess I need Helm, Belt or Ring before I can switch to BoS...

You do not need belt/helm/ring before you switch. I'm running bracers/helm and doing fine. You just need to learn the timings of the fight, how to play breath efficiently, and how to frontload as much damage into breath as possible during it's duration. Legendary items may provide a quality of life through increase resource generation, but they are not mandatory to be competitive/excel at the spec.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh god yes, I switched mains due to 100% runspeed too. To be clear, I absolutely DESPISE playing my DK due to 100% runspeed. I was specifically talking about how the spec plays mechanically in combat.

I guess I don't mind it as much. You get used to it after awhile and I never have an issue with dying to mechanics. Actually, I usually use it as a jibe to my guildmates.."Sheesh guys, if I can get out that mechanic, you can too!"

[Schizoide]

The poor mobility doesn't render FDK non-competitive. Frost is doing fine. It's not about that, I just don't find it fun.

[Deleted]

I love the state of DK's right now. The DPS is spot on, where every class should be.

If you don't suck ass, you get the prize. The better you perform, the better DK you make. Now, BoS is fun - if you can figure it out(if you know what I mean). In fact every class/spec is fun, if you don't hide behind your casual excuses and actually try to work hard to become a better player.

And if you don't like the movementspeed, well go monk or DH.

[Nemesquish]

WoD Frost was hands the down the most fun ... Legion is OK just feels more 'mechanical' ...

Its all based on opinion, but I personally wouldnt even put it in top 3.

[exeetor]

well for one thing I like the DMG output we have right now. Its nothing wrong with it at all... but I do NOT like our resource problems. We sit without runes way to often now since the stealth nerf and well its just not ok. And to have to wait until 7.2 to get it fixed via new traits just feels bad

[Deleted]

well for one thing I like the DMG output we have right now. Its nothing wrong with it at all... but I do NOT like our resource problems. We sit without runes way to often now since the stealth nerf and well its just not ok. And to have to wait until 7.2 to get it fixed via new traits just feels bad

oh well.

It was not a stealth nerf, it was an announced bug fix, everyone knew it was coming and it was on the PTR.
We do not have to wait for 7.2, Tier set already helps with this by a huge amount
We have options even without tier to not miss runes

I rarely have to wait for runes / RP with horn and a decent amount of haste you are ok.

[exeetor]

well true that the set helps alot but it was a Stealth Fix. Nothing in the patchnotes and ppl didnt play the PTR enough to see the change there. It has still not been announced as an actual change.

[Deleted]

You do not need belt/helm/ring before you switch. I'm running bracers/helm and doing fine. You just need to learn the timings of the fight, how to play breath efficiently, and how to frontload as much damage into breath as possible during it's duration. Legendary items may provide a quality of life through increase resource generation, but they are not mandatory to be competitive/excel at the spec.

Well another problem is that I have only Ambidextry and Nothing but the Boots relics in my weapon and low crit. As I said I sim my character lower with the BoS built than Machine Gun.

I dont have on-use burst trinkets, sadly passed on a 875 HoV 2 weeks ago.

My trinkets are
Convergence of Fate 890
Nightmare Egg Shell 890
Eye of Command 870
Urn 880
Chrono Shard 865