Holy Priest Overhealing

[Galaar]

So I'm a raid leader and I am unsure how to read healing logs. I noted that on Star Auger our holy priest has 51% overheal and her HPS when you take out overheal is around 250k.

Are those kind of overheal numbers to be expected by a holy priest? Are there any main tips from holy priests that you guys can give me so I can compare her logs?

Thanks!

[xingchen]

Overheal between 20-30% is usual for a holy priest. 51% overheal is only a problem if you can't kill the boss. Then he/she should pace her heals better. If you can kill the boss it's not a problem and you just have too many healers for this specific fight.

[Galaar]

Overheal between 20-30% is usual for a holy priest. 51% overheal is only a problem if you can't kill the boss. Then he/she should pace her heals better. If you can kill the boss it's not a problem and you just have too many healers for this specific fight.

Well we're having issues on Star Auger as we have not killed him yet. Are there specific abilities that they should focus on? We run 4 healers (Druid, Shaman, Paladin and Priest).

Thanks for the tips!

[xingchen]

Mmm.. I'm suspecting he is probably hardcasting renew because of the high overheal.
edit: I looked up the logs and his most casted spell is renew, this should almost always be flash heal.

[Deleted]

Tell them to keep renew just on the tanks and have Prayer of Mending take care of the rest of renews. Doing the rest of the healing with Flash Heal and Holy Word: Serenity they shouldn't have problems with overhealing.

[Nephthysis]

Well we're having issues on Star Auger as we have not killed him yet. Are there specific abilities that they should focus on? We run 4 healers (Druid, Shaman, Paladin and Priest).

Thanks for the tips!

I looked up your logs and her casts are sometimes just inexplicable. She's dropping big bomb heals on groups of full health players for no apparent reason? (HW: Sanctify is an instant cast). She does run out of mana even with a Blessing of Wisdom so that kind of play is pretty inexcusable. HPriest should never need Wisdom; that could be a Might on one of your dps.

General advice:

Stick to casting PoM on CD and spot healing with Flash Heal with Trail of Light. This is what Holy Priests are good at and should be 90% of the job. Let the shaman and druid take care of blanket healing.

Reserve HW: Sanctify for when there's a group who takes a big chunk of damage (i.e. the Shatter damage in ice phase) ESPECIALLY since she's using the Al'maiesh legendary. Sanctify should instantly bring 6 people back from the brink due to PoM/Piety.

ONLY cast Prayer of Healing immediately after using Sanctify, and again only when there's a stacked/semi-stacked group of melee or ranged who just took a chunk of damage.

Make every effort to get an Amalgam's Seventh Spine from BRH, even if it's an 840 (maybe even Darkmoon Deck: Promises in the meantime). That will instantly fix her mana issues so she won't need Wisdom and won't need Symbol of Hope, letting her pick up Light of the Naaru which is a much better talent.

[Shoat]

HPriest should never need Wisdom; that could be a Might on one of your dps.

Blessing of Might was removed a while ago, but you are right in that the Wisdom should usually go to other healers.

[Nephthysis]

Blessing of Might was removed a while ago, but you are right in that the Wisdom should usually go to other healers.

Really? Learn something new every day. Both of our paladins quit months ago.

They have 3 Rets so I guess there are plenty of Blessings to go around, but the rest still stands.

[Galaar]

I looked up your logs and her casts are sometimes just inexplicable. She's dropping big bomb heals on groups of full health players for no apparent reason? (HW: Sanctify is an instant cast). She does run out of mana even with a Blessing of Wisdom so that kind of play is pretty inexcusable. HPriest should never need Wisdom; that could be a Might on one of your dps.

General advice:

Stick to casting PoM on CD and spot healing with Flash Heal with Trail of Light. This is what Holy Priests are good at and should be 90% of the job. Let the shaman and druid take care of blanket healing.

Reserve HW: Sanctify for when there's a group who takes a big chunk of damage (i.e. the Shatter damage in ice phase) ESPECIALLY since she's using the Al'maiesh legendary. Sanctify should instantly bring 6 people back from the brink due to PoM/Piety.

ONLY cast Prayer of Healing immediately after using Sanctify, and again only when there's a stacked/semi-stacked group of melee or ranged who just took a chunk of damage.

Make every effort to get an Amalgam's Seventh Spine from BRH, even if it's an 840 (maybe even Darkmoon Deck: Promises in the meantime). That will instantly fix her mana issues so she won't need Wisdom and won't need Symbol of Hope, letting her pick up Light of the Naaru which is a much better talent.

See this is the kind of stuff I don't know. I can do tank stuff and dps stuff all day. Thanks for the help.

- - - Updated - - -

Really? Learn something new every day. Both of our paladins quit months ago.

They have 3 Rets so I guess there are plenty of Blessings to go around, but the rest still stands.

Yeah not thrilled with the raid comp but that's the hand we were dealt as we don't force people to reroll classes.

- - - Updated - - -

Tell them to keep renew just on the tanks and have Prayer of Mending take care of the rest of renews. Doing the rest of the healing with Flash Heal and Holy Word: Serenity they shouldn't have problems with overhealing.

I'll check the logs and see if I can spot that. Thanks!

[Deleted]

I don't agree that a priest shouldn't get a wisdom. Holy priests are great targets for wisdom, even with an amalgams you easily run out of mana on intense bosses. According to sims, I run out of mana after 2:02 minutes, and while sims can't be compared to the real world, it's kind of accurate. Paladins don't run out of mana, monks have mana tea, druids have innervate, shamans have passive mana return if they crit.

Wisdoms are great on both holy and disc priests. Don't let anyone make you believe otherwise.

On the topic though, if someone above is to be believed, your holy priest probably plays very incorrectly. Make sure her filler is flash heal, which really shouldn't overheal more than 25%, preferably less. And only use holy words when they actually heal something.

[Venara]

Have to echo Starmind there. Holy Priests are good targets for Wisdom, absolutely. Holy is a mana-whore because our most efficient playstyle is to spam the expensive heals. Any Holy Priest will thank you for getting Wisdom.

Now, could other healers use it too / more? Any healer can use it, no doubt about it. Is it worth more on other healers? That's highly debatable.

If you look at the log stats here https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...y=4&metric=hps you can see that there is no "best" healer. A different class outshines the others in every fight, Holy Priests shine in at least 3 out of 10 and, if you set it to "All Bosses", you see that everyone is sort of at the same level. The healers are very balanced this tier, actually.

Sure, more skilled players will always outshine others but that's just that. In my raid I regularly outshine all other healers, including a Druid and Holy Paladin, simply because I'm the better player. Doesn't matter that Druid is supposedly "the best" healer this tier.

@Galaar: If you want to take a look at what your priest should be casting, feel free to have a look through my logs from yesterday. We cleared 10/10 Normal Nighthold and 4/10 Heroic and I'm ranked pretty highly on most of them. Should be a fair indicator.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/v1JkN7zQBGRVW3cX

[Galaar]

Have to echo Starmind there. Holy Priests are good targets for Wisdom, absolutely. Holy is a mana-whore because our most efficient playstyle is to spam the expensive heals. Any Holy Priest will thank you for getting Wisdom.

Now, could other healers use it too / more? Any healer can use it, no doubt about it. Is it worth more on other healers? That's highly debatable.

If you look at the log stats here https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...y=4&metric=hps you can see that there is no "best" healer. A different class outshines the others in every fight, Holy Priests shine in at least 3 out of 10 and, if you set it to "All Bosses", you see that everyone is sort of at the same level. The healers are very balanced this tier, actually.

Sure, more skilled players will always outshine others but that's just that. In my raid I regularly outshine all other healers, including a Druid and Holy Paladin, simply because I'm the better player. Doesn't matter that Druid is supposedly "the best" healer this tier.

@Galaar: If you want to take a look at what your priest should be casting, feel free to have a look through my logs from yesterday. We cleared 10/10 Normal Nighthold and 4/10 Heroic and I'm ranked pretty highly on most of them. Should be a fair indicator.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/v1JkN7zQBGRVW3cX

Thanks for the logs and the feedback.

[TeleriaX]

I don't agree that a priest shouldn't get a wisdom. Holy priests are great targets for wisdom, even with an amalgams you easily run out of mana on intense bosses. According to sims, I run out of mana after 2:02 minutes, and while sims can't be compared to the real world, it's kind of accurate. Paladins don't run out of mana, monks have mana tea, druids have innervate, shamans have passive mana return if they crit.

Wisdoms are great on both holy and disc priests. Don't let anyone make you believe otherwise.

On the topic though, if someone above is to be believed, your holy priest probably plays very incorrectly. Make sure her filler is flash heal, which really shouldn't overheal more than 25%, preferably less. And only use holy words when they actually heal something.

Holy Priests have Enlightenment which is one of the best Mana-reggen skills for healers. If you come with that "but trail of light adds a lot of hps", you shouldnt count Mana Tea for monks too, because using it is a big HPS lose too. And saying that Holy Palas dont run out of mana is pure bullshit anyway.

[Deleted]

Holy Priests have Enlightenment which is one of the best Mana-reggen skills for healers. If you come with that "but trail of light adds a lot of hps", you shouldnt count Mana Tea for monks too, because using it is a big HPS lose too. And saying that Holy Palas dont run out of mana is pure bullshit anyway.

The only time you can pick enlightenment is if you're sure you'll be spamming PoH and no flash heals. Otherwise, you won't even be competitive and any other healer would be a better choice. Mana Tea isn't the only mana efficient thing monks have though, and no, holy paladins do not easily run out of mana.

[TeleriaX]

The only time you can pick enlightenment is if you're sure you'll be spamming PoH and no flash heals. Otherwise, you won't even be competitive and any other healer would be a better choice. Mana Tea isn't the only mana efficient thing monks have though, and no, holy paladins do not easily run out of mana.

Yeah Monks have soothing mist haha. Seriously do you believe that nonsense that you are saying? Just look through the logs and see how Palas dont go oom - oh wait they do. You know that Pala and Priest feels very similiar? Priest - Flash Heal spam, Pala - Flash of Light spam, only that Flash of Light does cost around 10k more mana on a single cast?

And yes you just proved my point. "Wäh Holy Priest isnt competive with Enlightenment because we lose HPS", but at the same time you dont care that the more mana starved Monk got the same issue. No the issue is probably even more obvious on Monk. You are one of those "I play the current best healer in a raid setting - but i have to cry about something anyway" players even when it isnt true. Disgusting.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...ps&dataset=100

[SafariDiscoLion]

Yeah Monks have soothing mist haha. Seriously do you believe that nonsense that you are saying? Just look through the logs and see how Palas dont go oom - oh wait they do. You know that Pala and Priest feels very similiar? Priest - Flash Heal spam, Pala - Flash of Light spam, only that Flash of Light does cost around 10k more mana on a single cast?

And yes you just proved my point. "Wäh Holy Priest isnt competive with Enlightenment because we lose HPS", but at the same time you dont care that the more mana starved Monk got the same issue. No the issue is probably even more obvious on Monk. You are one of those "I play the current best healer in a raid setting - but i have to cry about something anyway" players even when it isnt true. Disgusting.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...ps&dataset=100

Except Holy Priest has actually good talents in line with Enlightement that you'd want to take in almost every situation over it. Monks don't.

[TeleriaX]

Except Holy Priest has actually good talents in line with Enlightement that you'd want to take in almost every situation over it. Monks don't.

Focused Thunder.
Do i have to actually say more? Everyone who played a max level monk once knows that FT is the best talent in that row. The issue is that we have to gimp our HPS so we dont run out of mana after 1 minute. That is why most monks are using Mana Tea for Mythic Raiding.
So yeah... You dont know anything about monks - obviously

[Deleted]

Yeah Monks have soothing mist haha. Seriously do you believe that nonsense that you are saying? Just look through the logs and see how Palas dont go oom - oh wait they do. You know that Pala and Priest feels very similiar? Priest - Flash Heal spam, Pala - Flash of Light spam, only that Flash of Light does cost around 10k more mana on a single cast?

And yes you just proved my point. "Wäh Holy Priest isnt competive with Enlightenment because we lose HPS", but at the same time you dont care that the more mana starved Monk got the same issue. No the issue is probably even more obvious on Monk. You are one of those "I play the current best healer in a raid setting - but i have to cry about something anyway" players even when it isnt true. Disgusting.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...ps&dataset=100

I don't think you play a priest, so what are you doing on these forums? I've been playing holy priest for as long as I can remember, during all the times that we were the worst healers in the game. I know the class extremely well and could probably heal a raid in my sleep. What you fail to understand in the trail of light vs enlightenment discussion is how important trail of light is. If you go enlightenment, your healing output will suffer immensely and suddenly you don't bring anything to a raid - no utility, a sub par healing CD and weak healing in general. With trail of light at least we can stay competitive in our output.

Do you claim that holy priests are the best healers nowadays? I admit we are in a better state than we've been many times in the past, but for any progress raid where you're not padding meters or killing the bosses super quickly, a resto druid, holy paladin and resto shammy are all prefered choices over holy priests. Resto for their output, paladins for their instant spot heals, tank healing and great CDs (devotion aura is still one of the strongest CDs in the game), and resto shammys for their amazing utility CDs. How many bosses haven't been made 100 times easier this expansion thanks to spirit link totem? A strong output is the ONLY thing that a holy priest brings nowadays, but we also need to spec for it, and since we're very heavy on mana, innervate on a holy priest is not a bad decision, which is what this thread is about.

Then again, I doubt you play neither a priest nor in a mythic setting so I'm done. Oh and about the logs you provide, there's a reason there are so many more parses from shamans, druids, and paladins than holy priests.

EDIT: And before you go all crazy about how bad monks are (it looks like you play a monk), I know they're having it pretty rough right now. I still think holy priests are a better target for innervate than monks, though.

[Deleted]

Focused Thunder.
Do i have to actually say more? Everyone who played a max level monk once knows that FT is the best talent in that row. The issue is that we have to gimp our HPS so we dont run out of mana after 1 minute. That is why most monks are using Mana Tea for Mythic Raiding.
So yeah... You dont know anything about monks - obviously

it's tottally different thing if spells cost 50% less mana or you regenerate 10% faster.
if holy priest had talent what reduce spell cost 50% 10sec in any spot in talent tree .... (as holy priest i wouldnt see it even as mana saving skill but healing cooldown)

[TeleriaX]

I don't think you play a priest, so what are you doing on these forums?.

I am playing Holy Priest. But i also have a holy Pala and Mistweaver.
I´m just sick of crybabies. Holy Priest is HPS wise the best healer currently on mythic nighthold. That is a simple fact. If you dont see it - hey, i´m not blaming you for not being able to read logs. And again. I know how good trail of light is. But again - that is nothing Holy Priest have to suffer more than any other Healers. Healers are mana starving at Legion. Every Healer. Yes some more - some less. But Holy Priest isnt mana wise on a really bad spot. Not even close. I will say it once more. You COULD take enlightenment and still could deliver competitive HPS. Monks are FORCED to take Mana-Tea even if their HPS suffer a lot from it. That is the difference you are failing to understand. You have the option - if you dont take it - dont cry about.