Why are the very top guilds all EU?

[Pickynerd]

Your last point is pretty spot on. In EU there is a bigger middle class and the working class are richer than in US. With higher minimum wages and strong uninions, people are having more freedom in terms of longer and flexible vecations etc.

Or maybe i'm just illinformed and talking bs, dno.

Don't they get more time off of work in general compared to Americans?

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No, we can take 2 weeks off work if we want do. We don't have North Korean labour laws like the US.

That's what I was thinking - yeah we get shit for time off, I've worked for a company that wouldn't even let you take a vacation no matter how much time you had.

[Xexurra]

[*]EU benefit from 24 hours of bug fixes and hotfixes.

You forgot NA has +1 day of raid time

[Magnagarde]

Because European players are better at it.

There doesn't always need to be a special reason for something to be as it is and in this case, the answer is as simple as that.

[Jinpachi]

I apologise as I do realise a topic like this is pretty inflammatory, but I'm genuinely interested and not in any way motivated by trolling.
Just wondering if there's some established knowledge as to why there's such a distinct separation. My ideas:

• Is it just a genuine skill gap? Seems implausible, listed first to get it out of the way.
• EU benefit from having a day to anaylyse US comps, perhaps even strategies.
• EU benefit from 24 hours of bug fixes and hotfixes.
• EU people have better internet connections maybe?
• US culture stereotypically is more individualistic in its ideologies, so don't team-play so well?
• EU people are stereotypically more reserved, and thus more compliant/manipulated by a single strong leader/co-ordinator?
• EU's more flexible working hours simply allow for more devotion to a clear?

The last one would seem the most believable factor to me, but I don't see how there wouldn't be quite a few people in the US able to no-life the game for a couple of weeks, to at least be in and around the top.

I've etched out my theories above, and hope some people can respond with some genuine thoughts, or even better insight+knowledge. This is the 1st 'world first race' I've paid attention to, and it has really captured my imagination, so hoping to be educated some without it turning into a troll-fest, please and thank you!

It's basically the last one, and the last one only. They have a shorter work week, and less mandatory overtime, lending itself to more play time. I'd love 4 weeks off a year paid vacation, and a 35 hour work week. shit, you guys have any openings for car audio techs?

[Deleted]

Socialism, ho!

[Jinpachi]

Because European players are better at it.

There doesn't always need to be a special reason for something to be as it is and in this case, the answer is as simple as that.

The answer is simple, but it's not that they are better. Work schedules and priorities are the more likely reasons.

[Deleted]

Top guilds often take a week or two weeks off work (both EU/US), in fact, one of the requirements for these guilds are usually 100% attendance during mythic progression so this point is definitely not the reason and a complete moot point.

Even if it was the reason it doesn't explain why US guilds can barley even get ranks in world 300. In HFC only 70 US guilds hit top 300. I can tell you now you don't need to raid every day for 2 weeks to hit top 300.

[Deleted]

They have a better welfare system which means they can stay home and play WoW all day.

and then you realize they are mostly Students / Working People. The so called bad welfare 24/7 Nerds are a Minority

[Emerald Archer]

They have a better welfare system which means they can stay home and play WoW all day.

That doesn't explain anything. The top US guilds take atleast the first week off work for this, so for the first week the top US guilds have no excuse to be so behind, aside from just being less skilled.

[TotemJoker]

Because EU are not sub-human

[Teri]

It's nice to see a RU, US, OC and KR in the top 8 right now but it can change at any moment still with 2-3 bosses to kill.

[mageman69]

But comparing International European guilds isnt the same, i doubt they recruit with "MAKE SURE YOU HAVE BACKUP FREE DAYS FROM WORK GUYZ".

They actually do, if you look on the recruitment posts from Method and Serenity (two of the top guilds EU) they actually require their raiders to have at least two-three weeks of free time so they can compete whenever a new tier is released.

Serenity: 'For each raid tier, the ability to take off up to two or three weeks off of your work, school or daily routine to commit 100% of this time to Mythic progression' (source: serenity's website)

Method: 'Attendance: During progress raids our schedule is really demanding: we raid 12-15 h/day and it's really important you understand this before even thinking about applying or poaching an officer in-game in order for us not to waste yours/ours time.' (source: Method's page on wowprogress)

So i'm sure the rest of the top guilds have similar requirements as well. Although there are some guilds that are not as hardcore and only raid 2-3 days a week but still manage to be in top 20. Therefore i believe it to be a combination between having more free time to play + being more skilled that makes EU>US in the world first race.

I think the US people play games to have fun/socialize, they don't really have that drive to be competitive to br best of the best and do everything to achieve it. The EU people play games to be those best of the best and competitive and thus play/train more than the US. I dunno, its just my opinion.

[Raiju]

It's not really time related, it's just gaming culture in the EU leads to the EU being generally better at video games. If US were different about the whole thing, the 2.5 hours difference in work week would have near 0 impact on such things. It's also why Asia tends to beat the EU.

[S7orm]

Players from top guilds are all coming from the same countries on top of the FPS scene of late 90s/early 2000. Europe is just more into PC gaming

Working hours are a poor excuse, especially when top guilds require 12-15 hours attendance during progress

[Rehija]

They have a shorter work week, and less mandatory overtime

Wich makes it easyer to get free days on short term if you pull overtime wich a lot of europeans do. In fact, in the physical labor intensive Jobs, the overtime and general work hours are pretty much the same compared to the US. The real difference is that we have laws regarding overtime whose are in most cases strictly controlled. So if you pull lets say 50 hrs Overtime your Boss will ask you if you want the hours off or payed. The free time is preffered bcs. cashed out overtime is in most cases double pay, sometimes when on weekends or nighttime even triple.

[Magnagarde]

The answer is simple, but it's not that they are better. Work schedules and priorities are the more likely reasons.

So you are saying that there are no people in the US who don't have to work much, who also don't put WoW as their priority? There certainly are and all those that do so are not nearly as good as the Europeans that are also doing it.

[Etselion]

Because Europoors.

They only have to stop from time to time for their Allah praying.

Infracted

[ImpTaimer]

Players from top guilds are all coming from the same countries on top of the FPS scene of late 90s/early 2000. Europe is just more into PC gaming

Working hours are a poor excuse, especially when top guilds require 12-15 hours attendance during progress

Move to US. Form a guild full of 20+ average working American person that can take 1-2weeks paid vacation at the drop of a hat.

You can't.

[huehuehue]

Because EU are not sub-human

great post

looking at other online games including e-sports, EU seems to almost always have better teamwork and strategies. Time off from work won't suddenly make people mesh. I think it's just societal.

[Raiju]

Move to US. Form a guild full of 20+ average working American person that can take 1-2weeks paid vacation at the drop of a hat.

You can't.

As in pick 25 people and hope they can all make raid times? Yeah that's standard in nearly any country.

Pick enough people till you have enough to make the time? Well it explains itself.