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  1. #21
    Bloodsail Admiral Kalador's Avatar
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    I was a bit fan of exsang but it's true that in NH it's a bit to far behind, Alacrity is a decent option for some boss or in m+ tho, especially for botanist, i play 111xx21 for it and it might not be as good, idk, but it feels fucking great and it's a real change of pace.

  2. #22
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by DakonBlackblade View Post
    I don't know whats wrong with that, not every spec needs to be incredibly complex.
    There is a problem if the spec is simple _and_ slow. We have some talents which are more fun than the current ones, but Blizzard isn't in the mood of pushing them into viability right now. It's passives all over the place.

    Quote Originally Posted by DakonBlackblade View Post
    if you guys want rotations with thousands of skills and button presses go play FF XIV Dragoon.
    Nah sorry, I don't want to fall asleep in between GCDs. Also the combat system is clunky as hell. After one year I couldn't stand it anymore. Before the existence of FFLogs there wasn't even a reason to play this game competitively. Hell you even needed 3rd party hacks to see how much damage you do. What a waste.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by harlynx View Post
    There is a problem if the spec is simple _and_ slow. We have some talents which are more fun than the current ones, but Blizzard isn't in the mood of pushing them into viability right now. It's passives all over the place.


    Nah sorry, I don't want to fall asleep in between GCDs. Also the combat system is clunky as hell. After one year I couldn't stand it anymore. Before the existence of FFLogs there wasn't even a reason to play this game competitively. Hell you even needed 3rd party hacks to see how much damage you do. What a waste.
    Fun is relative, there isn't a problem, many ppl like the spec as it is but elitists seen to think that if there isn't some insane complexity on the spec its not worth it. Besides slow deliberate specs can be much harder to play on real raid scenarios than fast non stop casting ones, since you actually need to keep track of timers, resources and time your skill usages to the windows of opportunity you have on the fight itself rather than just using stuff whenever they are off cd, but elitists will still complain the spec doesn't have 300 skills.

    And you either never played a Dragoon or didn't realy know what the fuck you were doing, the class is insanely complex with a rotation of over 20 skills, where you interweave instant casts in all your gcds while keeping track of 6 different buffs and debuffs. Also there is no point in playing any game competitively, these are games they are made to be fun, just that.
    Last edited by DakonBlackblade; 2017-02-03 at 05:05 PM.

  4. #24
    I love Exsang and I'm not overly fond of the dumbed down feeling that comes with AP, but I don't really see how it can be changed without making exsang too good or AP completely reworked.

  5. #25
    I personally hated Exsang.

  6. #26
    Deleted
    Im pretty sure there are fights where exsang does more dps but yea it's bad. i play exsang and i prefer it i wish ap was reworked completely. People say that it's just one more button and it blows my mind. First you keep deadly poison I just find it becomes useless to my eyes that if you play with AP you still need to use dp for aoe. Second tracking EP cp cds and bleed timers it just adds a lot more fun. What i don't get is why there is no decent chest for exsang build in NH and in some other slots that i forget. And with the set bonuses our tier has exsang will always be behind. I also feel they should revert EP nerf. skill oriented talents should be better when played right rather than these passive that are stronger currently. I also hate poison bomb. Assa aoe is just pure RNG i wonder if there is anyone who likes its current state. and then we have fan of knives doing 0 damage like seriously they could just double its damage and it would still be bad. fok tooltip sais it does 54k dmg and mutilate 200k. 4 times more than fok. Then you have damage reductions when used on more targets than three unless this was removed at some point in wow, im not sure. I would also love the idea mastery doing something for bleeds. Going from vers~crit>mastery>haste to mastery>>vers>crit>haste isn't something i like. Then you have alacrity which is viable for some AOE fights but why would i want an aoe that builds up. Assa needs aoe to clear mobs in dungeons and alacrity isnt helping there. Subterfuge is great if tanks wait to go out of combat before pulling next pack but they don't and they shouldn't. Honestly if someone asked me if they should roll to rogue i'd just say no. Insanely hard to find raiding guild and mythic+ groups until you reach a high ilvl and suddenly become godlike thanks to utility.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by georulez View Post
    Im pretty sure there are fights where exsang does more dps but yea it's bad. i play exsang and i prefer it i wish ap was reworked completely. People say that it's just one more button and it blows my mind. First you keep deadly poison I just find it becomes useless to my eyes that if you play with AP you still need to use dp for aoe. Second tracking EP cp cds and bleed timers it just adds a lot more fun. What i don't get is why there is no decent chest for exsang build in NH and in some other slots that i forget. And with the set bonuses our tier has exsang will always be behind. I also feel they should revert EP nerf. skill oriented talents should be better when played right rather than these passive that are stronger currently. I also hate poison bomb. Assa aoe is just pure RNG i wonder if there is anyone who likes its current state. and then we have fan of knives doing 0 damage like seriously they could just double its damage and it would still be bad. fok tooltip sais it does 54k dmg and mutilate 200k. 4 times more than fok. Then you have damage reductions when used on more targets than three unless this was removed at some point in wow, im not sure. I would also love the idea mastery doing something for bleeds. Going from vers~crit>mastery>haste to mastery>>vers>crit>haste isn't something i like. Then you have alacrity which is viable for some AOE fights but why would i want an aoe that builds up. Assa needs aoe to clear mobs in dungeons and alacrity isnt helping there. Subterfuge is great if tanks wait to go out of combat before pulling next pack but they don't and they shouldn't. Honestly if someone asked me if they should roll to rogue i'd just say no. Insanely hard to find raiding guild and mythic+ groups until you reach a high ilvl and suddenly become godlike thanks to utility.
    Honestly there are no fights where Exsang does more...UNLESS the fight is two minutes long and every single rupture procs BOTA...Then...maybe it would be close. I have around 65% mastery, 40% crit, 11% vers and 5% haste I believe. If someone is pure AP build, they are usually at 30% crit, 150%+ mastery. So their poisons are already doing 100% more than me, plus master poisoner is another 30% on top of that, so if they get a poison bomb proc, with all the scaling of AP and such they are doing 200% more damage per poison bomb and Kingsbane.

    If they want to fix Exsang. Make mastery or crit scale bleed damage or something. As of now it's useless to take Exsang simply because Blizzard doesn't understand that if you make the artifact ability and one of the gold traits only do well with one build, then that build will become dominant.

  8. #28
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by DakonBlackblade View Post
    Fun is relative, there isn't a problem, many ppl like the spec as it is but elitists seen to think that if there isn't some insane complexity on the spec its not worth it. Besides slow deliberate specs can be much harder to play on real raid scenarios than fast non stop casting ones, since you actually need to keep track of timers, resources and time your skill usages to the windows of opportunity you have on the fight itself rather than just using stuff whenever they are off cd, but elitists will still complain the spec doesn't have 300 skills.
    Please don't repeat what I've said and at the same time word it like I've said something different & wrong. Though if you honestly think Sin's buff-/dotwatching is complex or hard and gives you issues playing the encounter then there is no reason to continue the discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by DakonBlackblade View Post
    And you either never played a Dragoon or didn't realy know what the fuck you were doing, the class is insanely complex with a rotation of over 20 skills, where you interweave instant casts in all your gcds while keeping track of 6 different buffs and debuffs. Also there is no point in playing any game competitively, these are games they are made to be fun, just that.
    It is the long GCD in general that drove me nuts, plus really weird move / stop casting interactions with random cast interrupts depending on when you started moving and a really, really clunky instant cast mechanic which would abort your previous cast if you pressed the following spell fast enough. Also the game had insane latency issues. If you played a Ninja and accidentally threw Shurikens instead of Katons, because latency fucked up your mudra you will understand. Just to give some examples. The combat system of FF is utter crap compared to WoW. Btw. I quit the game after clearing AS, I don't know if the game got remotely better since then, but I highly doubt it.

    Edit: And who talked about dragoons? I didn't.
    Last edited by mmoc9266682dcc; 2017-02-03 at 10:25 PM. Reason: tone

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by harlynx View Post
    Please don't repeat what I've said and at the same time word it like I've said something different & wrong. Though if you honestly think Sin's buff-/dotwatching is complex or hard and gives you issues playing the encounter then there is no reason to continue the discussion.



    It is the long GCD in general that drove me nuts, plus really weird move / stop casting interactions with random cast interrupts depending on when you started moving and a really, really clunky instant cast mechanic which would abort your previous cast if you pressed the following spell fast enough. Also the game had insane latency issues. If you played a Ninja and accidentally threw Shurikens instead of Katons, because latency fucked up your mudra you will understand. Just to give some examples. The combat system of FF is utter crap compared to WoW. Btw. I quit the game after clearing AS, I don't know if the game got remotely better since then, but I highly doubt it.

    Edit: And who talked about dragoons? I didn't.
    Where did I say it was hard or complex, I said slow and deliberate specs are often harder (as in related to other specs that aren't slow and deliberate) in real raid scenarios. Even tough Sin is easy to play it is realy hard to master, and thats why you have sins with similar ilevels doing widly different dps, the saving grace of the ones who don't realy understand the ins and outs of how to properly maximize the specs DPS in each encounter and those who do is that even when you're just winging it you'll do more damage than most other classes and specs, its only when ppl start comparing multiple different players who all play sin rogues that they notice that those who do know what they are doing do much more dps than those who don't.

    My original quote was literaly "if you guys want rotations with thousands of skills and button presses go play FF XIV Dragoon." reading helps.
    Last edited by DakonBlackblade; 2017-02-04 at 12:58 AM.

  10. #30
    Deleted
    why you post? do you offer anything to this discussion? title sais exsang still underwhelming against AP, which is true and then you come here shitposting calling people names.

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