WTF is wrong with MW

[Saverem]

Don't want to start a big argument, but Brewmaster was the best it's ever been through Highmaul after they nerfed Paladins and gave Brm a stagger buff, which nobody at the start realized to be op, up and until through Blackrock Foundry when they were put a bit back in line with others before HFC. You basically outtanked everyone without eveng bothering with cooldown usage.

Enough with history. Brewmaster being the 2nd best tank role is not supbar. Windwalkers parsing third high for mythic NH is not supbar. As a whole, we're not the best class in game, but as a whole we are not subpar (which means below the average) even if one of specs is.

I never said BrMs are the best they've ever been, I said MONKS are the best they've ever been. Monks consist of 3 specs, not just BrM.

Also I didn't call BrMs subpar. Maybe read the post you are quoting before replying?

[Floopa]

I never said BrMs are the best they've ever been, I said MONKS are the best they've ever been. Monks consist of 3 specs, not just BrM.

Also I didn't call BrMs subpar. Maybe read the post you are quoting before replying?

okay well you're wrong because monks were best in ToT. all specs in ToT were great.

[Saverem]

okay well you're wrong because monks were best in ToT. all specs in ToT were great.

Thats, like, your opinion, man. MW spec was never great, I'd say they are the greatest they've ever been now and they're still not great.

WWs are best they've ever been now, especially with how their new Mastery and rotation works. They are also actually good in PvP for once.

BrMs AREN'T the best they've ever been, but they are in a good place. Second place out of 6 tanks isn't too bad.

[redfella]

I never said BrMs are the best they've ever been, I said MONKS are the best they've ever been. Monks consist of 3 specs, not just BrM.

Also I didn't call BrMs subpar. Maybe read the post you are quoting before replying?

I did read your post before I replied, but it's blatantly obvious that you did not as I distinctly stated that TWO out of THREE specs are doing WAY ABOVE the average, so you don't get to call Monks subpar.

I bolded parts of my message just to avoid any further confusion about the matter.

As a whole, we're not the best class in game, but as a whole we are not subpar (which means below the average) even if one of specs is.

[Saverem]

I did read your post before I replied, but it's blatantly obvious that you did not as I distinctly stated that TWO out of THREE specs are doing WAY ABOVE the average, so you don't get to call Monks subpar.

I bolded parts of my message just to avoid any further confusion about the matter.

Have you seen the warcraftlogs of WWs? If you're just looking at all bosses for Mythic then you're doing it wrong. They ARE middle of the road in Mythics.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/11#boss=1842

Go through every boss. They are average on the first 3 bosses that actually have sufficient parses. Where they cheese their ranking is on Tich where they have 91 parses and Spellblade where they have like 200. Even on Skorp where you'd think WWs would do excellent on due to the amount of AoEing they are middle of the road, and that's with a decent amount of parses which is in the thousands.


If we take your logic, then Survival Hunters are even better than WWs! Look at all the people rerolling Survival Hunters!

[avx81]

I have been seriously considering rolling a resto druid. After the latest blue post on the EU forums it just seems like Blizzard does not care. There was a mistweaver on EU forums that wrote out a full page on the class and the issues they face. A dev came in and basically ignored everything only stating that they are considering putting a cd on essence font and that they "MIGHT" buff other heals to compensate. Seriously WTF!? We are gonna put a cooldown on your most useful raid heal and we "MIGHT" buff other heals to compensate? Nevermind the fact that you bring no utility to a raid and require a paladins blessing of wisdom and druid innervates to remain competitive. At least last expansion mistweavers were good for their revival but its not half of what it use to be.

The least played class and spec in the game. I feel so stupid. I should have known better. I have been playing mistweaver since they came out in mop. In MoP they were good fun. Last expansion mistweavers sucked which was mostly due to how op holy paladins and disc priests were. Mistweavers did not get good until the broken 4pc HFC set that accounted for usually the 2nd or 3rd top heal on most fights. In some cases it was top. I honestly don't even want to put up with rerolling and having to grind out AP and legendaries. Blizzard basically spit on mistweavers with that dev post. "MIGHT" is not a word when it comes to buffing other spells if they are considering putting our most useful raid heal on cooldown. No immediate shakeups is basically code word for mistweavers are not seeing changes next patch either. I really think I'm done if there is no good info during the dev Q&A. There's a mistweaver with a question that has +100 upvotes on q&a thread. The most useless artifact heal in the game has come up dozens of times on the forums. A lot of mistweavers just take it off their bars. It sees some usage in dungeons but thats about it.

https://eu.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/17615033718

[Deleted]

Did main MW at the start but quit after a while. Came back and have been playing as a DPS and now Im trying my MW again. Overall it seems like pretty much every other class can top off people faster or just heal better.

I dont know but with my ilvl 868 MW it just feels really heavy to heal people. I probably might wanna reroll to another healer for 5man mythics. I dont want druid so it will probably be either pala or priest.

[Fulminous]

MW's have competitive HPS but the main issue is that raw HPS isn't always enough, What unique utility or quirk do MWs bring to a raid that no other Healer can? When I consider my resto Shaman He can bring Speed totem/rez totem through talents, Healing tide totem, SLT and gets a considerable healing bonus on Progress from mastery. Druids have their Brez and paladins have their auras. What does a MW bring other than Revival and LC??

That's what I feel MW is lacking; something in their toolkit that tells a Raid leader "hmm a MW would be nice"

[AwkwardSquirtle]

No immediate shakeups is basically code word for mistweavers are not seeing changes next patch either.

They've gone on record saying that no class is getting any major changes until 7.2.5, they want class tuning to come in the mini patches.

[taek]

Updated logs of top 100 healing parses per boss in Mythic NH.

Skorpyron: 1/100
Chromatic: 0/100
Trilliax: 1/100
Spellblade: 0/100
Tichondrius: 0/100
Star Augur: 3/100
Krosus: 0/100
High Botanist: 2/100
Grand Magistrix: 1/100
Guldan: 0/25

(NOTE: This isn't really a rarity problem. The rarity of MW is exaggerated, MW is only half as rare as Holy Priest in Mythic NH (5,748 MW vs 11,871 Holy).

[Spotnick]

I can't be the only one who gets completely destroyed by holy paladins on my mistweaver.

Even putting Enveloping Mist almost permanent on tanks it seems beacon healing has priority, I just don't get it.. and when I say destroyed, I mean destroyed like that:



And I used to be on par with that paladin in HFC. That's heroic btw, of course that's not

[affinity]

And I used to be on par with that paladin in HFC.

That's because the only time MW has been relevant was with a broken tier set xd

[arisoh]

okay well you're wrong because monks were best in ToT. all specs in ToT were great.

Agree with this. LOOVED monk tanking back then.

Also the LULZ when MW used to SCK heal stacked groups for ridiculous amounts.

[Deleted]

i have a MW monk as my main alt this expac, chose him for fun and cus i liked the possibility of the ww offspec but after playing some normal and heroics(my guild doesnt do mythic) i saw a bunch of issues.
for one we have our mana costs designed around a stupid spell that is 99% of the time in pve usless(soothing) so we always have mana problems
then we are kinda the jack of all traits in terms of healing, like a hpala can heal 3 targets really well, a resto druid can aoe heal really well(i think?), we can aoe-we can single-but if we try to do both we just go oom and also we dont have a very well designed toolkit to really support everything, mainly an issue i see is we have to cast too much-compare the efford it takes for a hpala to heal 3 ppl taking big dmg vs a mw, its a joke

- - - Updated - - -

The "least played class" argument doesn't fly. Players will play the classes that are performing well. If a class is less played, it means there is a problem with them either mechanically (boring rotations, etc) or performance-wise.

I agree with you on that for sure, was just thinking about this. Also i remember for example in mop when warlocks(especially destro) were really fun to play and relative simple AND op as fuck number wise people including me rerolled in droves to them. A few other examples of mass rerolls dating as back as much as tbc i'd say, and happening more and more as in later expansion leveling became very easy.

[Saverem]

I can't be the only one who gets completely destroyed by holy paladins on my mistweaver.

Even putting Enveloping Mist almost permanent on tanks it seems beacon healing has priority, I just don't get it.. and when I say destroyed, I mean destroyed like that:



And I used to be on par with that paladin in HFC. That's heroic btw, of course that's not

Well, it's showing you were only doing 62% of fellow MWers with same ilvl where as that Pally was killing it in the 98th percentile.

[DontMessWitYook]

Don't mean to completely debunk your theory, but all the good mistweavers will be in mythic progression guilds that put they logs on private. I personally know 4 monks with between 4-7m progression, all with private logs. MWs are definitely under-funded when it comes to utility, and under utilized when it comes to healing potential, but it doesnt mean there none existent. There hiding in the shadows.
But they're the heros azeroth deserves, but not the one it needs right now, so we'll hunt them. Because they can take it, because they're not heroes. They're silent guardians, watchful protectors, Dark Knights.

[Spotnick]

Well, it's showing you were only doing 62% of fellow MWers with same ilvl where as that Pally was killing it in the 98th percentile.

The percentile ranking of ilvl means fuck all in heroic, you never optimize healing in heroic, especially in a pug like that. Some weeks I'm in 98+ other weeks in 60+, completely depends if I have good healers or not, but no other class can destroy the ranks like a holy paladin and that's my point.

Usually I'm the one destroying those meters, but it's just impossible to be competitive with a holy paladin in the raid, it seems they snipe all the healing. Then again, that is with GOOD holy paladins.

[Saverem]

The percentile ranking of ilvl means fuck all in heroic, you never optimize healing in heroic, especially in a pug like that. Some weeks I'm in 98+ other weeks in 60+, completely depends if I have good healers or not, but no other class can destroy the ranks like a holy paladin and that's my point.

Usually I'm the one destroying those meters, but it's just impossible to be competitive with a holy paladin in the raid, it seems they snipe all the healing. Then again, that is with GOOD holy paladins.

They just need to nerf or remove Aura of Sacrifice and they'll be fixed. That talent is the sole reason why they snipe heals. Makes them basically the Legion version of WoD Discs since they reduce the damage before anyone can heal it and it counts towards their HPS. Also AoS + Aura Mastery = OP as shit for most NH fights.

[Deleted]

nah and nah

[trm90]

The percentile ranking of ilvl means fuck all in heroic, you never optimize healing in heroic, especially in a pug like that. Some weeks I'm in 98+ other weeks in 60+, completely depends if I have good healers or not, but no other class can destroy the ranks like a holy paladin and that's my point.

Usually I'm the one destroying those meters, but it's just impossible to be competitive with a holy paladin in the raid, it seems they snipe all the healing. Then again, that is with GOOD holy paladins.

??? What fight did you even link, this log has so little context it's mind boggling, don't even know what the fight length was like or what legendaries the hpal has for example, or if you had other healers who were also "out-sniped" by a holy paladin

moreover, paladins can easily cheese farm parses with Sacrifice