[Help] Legion budget build

[Dvs08]

Hello everyone!

First time writer, long time reader here. I desperately need help making a budget build for Legion now that my old pc is good for dumpster. I don't need a machine for ultra settings gaming nor do I play anything but WoW. I already have monitor so exclude that (Philips 23" 236v). I also need no hard drives. Finally my budget is around 550€.
I feel like I have to underline that max settings is not my priority as I barely do any raiding and that I'm more interested in a decent budget build that can be upgraded in the future when the income allows.

Thanks in advance!

[Fascinate]

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-7500 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (€205.77 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-B250M-D2V Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (€74.95 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Memory: Crucial 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory (€54.63 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Video Card: Zotac GeForce GTX 1050 2GB Mini Video Card (€121.99 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Case: Zalman Z3 ATX Mid Tower Case (€35.67 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Power Supply: XFX XT 400W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (€44.39 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Total: €537.40
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-23 21:01 CET+0100

[Kagthul]

For a "WoW only" build, you dont really need an i5 and wont see much benefit from it. Nor for day-to-day computing tasks, either.

In a tradeoff, you can get a much better GPU. So, you can end up with a high-settings capable rig anyway.

PCPartPicker part list: https://de.pcpartpicker.com/list/p94Kd6
Price breakdown by merchant: https://de.pcpartpicker.com/list/p94Kd6/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel Core i3-7100 3.9GHz Dual-Core Processor (€119.84 @ Mindfactory)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-B250M-DS3H Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (€80.98 @ Mindfactory)
Memory: Crucial 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory (€54.63 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 480 4GB G1 Gaming Video Card (€206.74 @ Mindfactory)
Case: Zalman ZM-T4 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (€26.99 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Power Supply: XFX XT 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (€48.83 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Total: €538.01
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-23 21:35 CET+0100

[Fascinate]

Pretty sure wow runs better on an i5 than it does an i3, thats why i went that route. Also if you are debating i3 just get a pentium g4560 and a gtx 1060.

I personally with go with the lower end gpu + i5 tho.

[Kagthul]

Pretty sure wow runs better on an i5 than it does an i3, thats why i went that route. Also if you are debating i3 just get a pentium g4560 and a gtx 1060.

I personally with go with the lower end gpu + i5 tho.

.. what would cause you to believe WoW runs better on an i5? All the Kaby Lake chips are the exact same silicon, just with different features enabled/disabled/expanded.

The difference between an i3 and an i5 is.... 2 cores + HT vs 4 real cores. The i5 can turbo, but has a (much) lower base clock, the i3 cannot turbo.

WoW is brutally single-thread CPU performance limited. The single-thread performance between two Kaby Lake chips at identical clocks is identical unless there are other features that impact the issue (like i7s having more cache).

The i3 is clocked higher (3.9Ghz vs 3.4), though the i5 will Turbo to 3.8 on a single core.

[Dvs08]

This is super helpful guys, providing some nice insight for me here. I'm really not an expert but I could also make a use of my old psu, no? It's Gigabyte Odin 800w. I also had ati radeon hd4870x2 which I have no idea how bad it is now compared to newer graphics cards. Rest of the old pc I knoe i can't use because it's some old ddr2 ram dimms and shizzle. So please do let me know where I shoul invest more if I get a spare buck.

[Fascinate]

.. what would cause you to believe WoW runs better on an i5? All the Kaby Lake chips are the exact same silicon, just with different features enabled/disabled/expanded.

The difference between an i3 and an i5 is.... 2 cores + HT vs 4 real cores. The i5 can turbo, but has a (much) lower base clock, the i3 cannot turbo.

WoW is brutally single-thread CPU performance limited. The single-thread performance between two Kaby Lake chips at identical clocks is identical unless there are other features that impact the issue (like i7s having more cache).

The i3 is clocked higher (3.9Ghz vs 3.4), though the i5 will Turbo to 3.8 on a single core.

WoW does use more than 2 cores, and real cores are much better than logical cores. I have WoW open right now and its using all 8 cores of my 1700. I just think dual core CPU's are gonna be a thing of a the past sooner than later, and considering how little graphics horsepower WoW needs putting more of his budget into CPU is the right choice.

- - - Updated - - -

This is super helpful guys, providing some nice insight for me here. I'm really not an expert but I could also make a use of my old psu, no? It's Gigabyte Odin 800w. I also had ati radeon hd4870x2 which I have no idea how bad it is now compared to newer graphics cards. Rest of the old pc I knoe i can't use because it's some old ddr2 ram dimms and shizzle. So please do let me know where I shoul invest more if I get a spare buck.

While that unit was well reviewed back in the day it is over 10 years old, i would personally get a new one. You can reuse your hard drives tho

[Kagthul]

WoW does use more than 2 cores, and real cores are much better than logical cores. I have WoW open right now and its using all 8 cores of my 1700. I just think dual core CPU's are gonna be a thing of a the past sooner than later, and considering how little graphics horsepower WoW needs putting more of his budget into CPU is the right choice.

- - - Updated - - -

Which is why people on Dual-core (with no HT) Pentium Anniversary chips overclocked to 5Ghz get the same performance in WoW as people with i7s overclocked to 5Ghz?

Yes, WoW will use many threads, but the other threads outside of the main one can all run on a second core and inflict zero performance penalty.

Dual-cores aren't going anywhere. Game developers are not stupid. More than half the market is still running on dual core chips. HALF of those are dual cores WITHOUT HT. And i3s are just fine for gaming. Yes, they produce "lower framerates" in a lot of games other than WoW, but we're talking the difference between 120+fps on an i7 or other high end chip and 60-80fps on an i3. For a budget rig, you're not going to be caring about FPS over 60.

When you start to care about framerates over 60, you have more than 500 to spend on your system.

While that unit was well reviewed back in the day it is over 10 years old, i would personally get a new one. You can reuse your hard drives tho

Agree here. That old.. don't chance it. It could run another 10 years or it could pack it in tomorrow.

[Fascinate]

I just think for a WoW rig putting more money into CPU than GPU is the right choice. i5's also have double the cache of pentiums or i3, that does and can play a role in online games.

[Nellah]

It can, but I'm not convinced it matters for WoW from a playability standpoint. The game is designed to run on a wide range of hardware. The i3-6100 which was for a while the budget build lynchpin has 3MB cache, the same as Kaby Lake Pentium CPUs. You'll see fewer instantaneous performance drops with a larger cache, but they probably won't be too noticeable in this game engine on either CPU.

While I would agree that for a general purpose PC or a PC that is going to play a wide variety of games you'll want the i5, the Pentium/i3 processors are perfectly viable alternatives even for raiding. The GTX 1050 will have a harder time maxing detail levels at 1080p (given my testing with the RX 460 started to see drop-offs in performance after about 7 on the detail slider) so I'm throwing in my vote for the Pentium/i3 + RX 480 setups.

Don't expect to upgrade the LGA1151 setup a few years down the road, though. I haven't upgraded just a CPU in the last ten years, personally. It's always ended up being a fresh system because the benefit from just upgrading the processor isn't worth it. If you get a Pentium G4560 and then move to a secondhand i7-7700K you will gain about 30% on the clock speed but unless they rebuild WoW's engine you probably won't see much gain from the extra threads.

[Dvs08]

So atm its i3-7100 & RX480 4Gb Vs. i5-7500 & GTX1050 2Gb two votes versus one for this "wow only" build. If anyone else wants to chip in, please, be my guest. I am very interested in what people think is ok config because most of us here play the game anyway.

[Nellah]

I have an i3-4130 (3.4GHz, 3MB cache) and an i5-4570S (stays around 3.2-3.4GHz, 6MB cache), and can test with an RX 480 4GB and an RX 460 2GB (a bit faster than the 1050). Tomorrow when I have time I'll do a Nighthold Raid Finder run on each and some world stuff and get some frame times. That'll give you some hard numbers to look at. They're older chips than what you're looking at but they have a similar performance gap.

The i5 system is SSD-based and the i3 has a mechanical drive, albeit a very fast one, so the i3 will be a worst-case scenario compared to the i5. Might help you make a decision.

[Fascinate]

So atm its i3-7100 & RX480 4Gb Vs. i5-7500 & GTX1050 2Gb two votes versus one for this "wow only" build. If anyone else wants to chip in, please, be my guest. I am very interested in what people think is ok config because most of us here play the game anyway.

Actually i wouldnt consider the i3, the pentium g4560 is the same chip but clocked 400mhz lower for nearly half the price. The choice is g4560+3gb 1060 or i5 7500 +gtx 1050 imo.

Another thing to consider is its far easier to do a GPU upgrade down the road than a CPU if you decided you wanted to play more GPU intensive titles.

[Dvs08]

Actually i wouldnt consider the i3, the pentium g4560 is the same chip but clocked 400mhz lower for nearly half the price. The choice is g4560+3gb 1060 or i5 7500 +gtx 1050 imo.

Another thing to consider is its far easier to do a GPU upgrade down the road than a CPU if you decided you wanted to play more GPU intensive titles.

Oh, so I should consider g4560 as well then? Seemed like a huge gap between that and i5 for my nabbish knowledge.

So the main question now is stonger cpu vs stonger gpu. But I feel being closer to that g4560 Vs i3-7100 doubt now.
Also GTX1050 2GB Vs RX460 4GB
and GTX1060 3GB Vs RX480 4GB

What's the catch there? They seem to be in same price range but Radeon offers more Gb's.

[Fascinate]

Oh, so I should consider g4560 as well then? Seemed like a huge gap between that and i5 for my nabbish knowledge.

So the main question now is stonger cpu vs stonger gpu. But I feel being closer to that g4560 Vs i3-7100 doubt now.
Also GTX1050 2GB Vs RX460 4GB
and GTX1060 3GB Vs RX480 4GB

What's the catch there? They seem to be in same price range but Radeon offers more Gb's.

Nvidia cards play WoW a lot better than AMD cards:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...ti,4787-5.html
https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/...X_1060/23.html

Also the g4560 is an i3, its just clocked a little lower for a lot less money (for once intel tossed budget builders a bone). Mostly no one should consider the i3 7100, as the g4560 is a far better value.

That said i still think i5 + 1050 is the way to go

Edit: If you can find a rx 470 for closer to the price of a 1050 you could go that route as well, depending on sales ive seen them close to 1050 ti prices.

[Denpepe]

If you are going to upgrade the CPU in the short term say next 12 to 18 months grab the cheaper one if not go for the i5.

[Deleted]

I'd say either save up a little more money like 50-70€ to get a i5 7600 with a gtx1050 ti or wait for amd's ryzen 3/5 next month.
for the intel build this is what i got in mind:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-7600 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor (€229.00 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-B250M-D2V Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (€73.40 @ Mindfactory)
Memory: Kingston Savage 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory (€62.14 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Video Card: Zotac GeForce GTX 1050 Ti 4GB Mini Video Card (€146.89 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Case: Cooler Master N200 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (€49.44 @ Mindfactory)
Power Supply: XFX ProSeries 450W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (€49.78 @ Amazon Deutschland)
Total: €610.65
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-24 14:22 CET+0100

[Dvs08]

Ok, I'm pretty much going for i5 and GTX 1050 but can't decide between mini and the regular one. However I can't find suggested D2V version of mobo but I can get DS3H. Is that one fine too?

Also looking at those choices what RAM speed should I aim for? I found HyperX 2400 for 64€, 2666 for 70€ and even 3000 for 76€. Small difference in prices but I guess there could be some compatibility issues.

[Deleted]

That mobo is similar so should be fine. There is no point paying more money for higher than 2400 ddr4 memory cause thats the max its supported by B250 mobos.

[Dvs08]

GA-B250M-DS3H along with GTX 1050ti may be off because of small mobo? Do I need to buy 1050ti mini just because of that or regular one can fit if I getATX case? I see there is no big difference between the two anyway but I thought big one could block RAM slots maybe. I'm really sorry if I'm asking trivial questions, this is my first build and I'm google-ing a lot about everything but a confirmation to a direct question is always more comforting