Was Hitler after total world domination, or did he just want to control Europe?

[Pannonian]

Its hard to give a definite answer, as the nazi ideology changed in its 20 years of lifetime quite a bit.

Good example would be treatment of jews: The first plan was to get rid of them preferably in their own country (for example madagascar), their ultimative plan to exterminate was "only" drafted in 1941, 2 years after the war has started.

The original war plan was for the third reich to control the people of western europe, which were considered aryan (thats the reason Hitler was so interested in a pact with England prior to WWII, one of the reasons he made Ribbentrop his foreign minister), and to create new "Lebensraum" in eastern europe after getting rid of the slavic people.

So the original plan was "just" europe, but probably this would've changed if the war hasn't ended in 1945 - who knows.

[Jaylock]

He would've been hard-pressed to pull that off though, considering he neither had blonde hair nor blue eyes.

Which is ironic because his rhetoric was geared toward that. Of course, he would be the leader of this "perfect" race (being black haired, brown eyed lol)

- - - Updated - - -

Its hard to give a definite answer, as the nazi ideology changed in its 20 years of lifetime quite a bit.

Good example would be treatment of jews: The first plan was to get rid of them preferably in their own country (for example madagascar), their ultimative plan to exterminate was "only" drafted in 1941, 2 years after the war has started.

The original war plan was for the third reich to control the people of western europe, which were considered aryan (thats the reason Hitler was so interested in a pact with England prior to WWII, one of the reasons he made Ribbentrop his foreign minister), and to create new "Lebensraum" in eastern europe after getting rid of the slavic people.

So the original plan was "just" europe, but probably this would've changed if the war hasn't ended in 1945 - who knows.

I wonder what ordinary German citizens thought about a bill that was drafted for the purpose of exterminating an entire race...

I mean the whole reason Hitler got into power was because of the German national pride and the rhetoric that Hitler blasted that the Jews were taking over their nationalistic identity.

[Deleted]

I don't believe The Third Reich would be able to control the whole world or even the whole of Europe for very long. There was always Fascist movements in Europe that gladly supported the Third Reich during WW2 but they would want to become independent soon after or largely left alone. The racial part in the National Socialism is kind off a mess in the bigger picture. Waffen SS had divisions from all over Europe and they weren't all Aryans, which is a mess in itself because not all Germanic people are Aryan. But that is the whole racial biology swamp of a mess.

If the Axis would have won, Italy would probably have taken control over Greece, Turkey and the middle east. While Japan would control Asia, the biggest bitch would be the US, it's enormous and could pump out shit like no others. Germany would take over the Germanic peoples etc and RIP Slavs.

[lonely zergling]

I wonder what ordinary German citizens thought about a bill that was drafted for the purpose of exterminating an entire race...

I mean the whole reason Hitler got into power was because of the German national pride and the rhetoric that Hitler blasted that the Jews were taking over their nationalistic identity.

The unfairness of the treaty of versailles did cause WW2. Everyone would support a Trump in such unfair times. Even you. Sadly the Trump of the past turned out to be a complete maniac.

[Jaylock]

The unfairness of the treaty of versailles did cause WW2. Everyone would support a Trump in such times unfair times.

Hey lets not make this political. No need to bring current politics into this discussion. Keep Trump, Hillary, Republicans, Democrats out of this.

[lonely zergling]

Hey lets not make this political. No need to bring current politics into this discussion. Keep Trump, Hillary, Republicans, Democrats out of this.

But its true. Populists win in such unfair situations.

The "strong man" that makes your country great again is just appealing.

[Faroth]

Weither this is meant sarcastically or not I can't tell. but if not - then nope.

Why? Because his entire reign and rallying cry to all Germans in his campaign required one key element: An enemy for you to unite against and to blame all your problems on.

If he conquered the world, there would be nobody left to blame for everyday problems. What would've happened was his empire would simply fall apart because everybody will start blaming eachother for new stupid things. Which faction of Christianity do you belong to? Blond hair vs any other color hair? are you vegetarian or a meat-eater? (Remember, Hitler was a VERY moral vegetarian!) ect. You may think these are trivial differences, but isn't being a jewish person pretty trivial of a difference as well?

I think that was the point of the zergling's post... There would be world peace. There just wouldn't be very many people left in the world.

[Tabrotar]

I agree.

To go along with that, had Hitler taken control of Europe, I find it very hard to believe that he would have had the power to take control of the United States like the "Man in the High Castle" show on Amazon, given the fact that we had nuclear weapons and he didn't. I know he was close to having nuclear weapons, but being able to fly them across the atlantic and bomb strategic areas in the United States would have been almost impossible for him.

So if he controlled Europe, I don't think the United States would have allowed that for too long, along with Russia and our other allies.

You know that germany had the means to fly said bombs over the atlantic ocean right?
They had a pair of brothers who invented the first flying stealth jet and they then invented an "Nurflügler" which was almost the same thing but larger (almost entierly made of wings) and capable of flying to america and Göring was the one who said to them that they should invent it they will have the bomb soon.

Fun fact the bombs the americans had could only be build because they brought up a german u-boot which had heavy water and uran along 2 japanese officers with it. Without said uran and heavy water it would have taken much much longer for them to get enough material to build them.

[Puupi]

Hey lets not make this political. No need to bring current politics into this discussion. Keep Trump, Hillary, Republicans, Democrats out of this.

If you want to keep Trump out of this, you could start from your avatar.

[Toppy]

He would've been hard-pressed to pull that off though, considering he neither had blonde hair nor blue eyes.

What you dont realize is that Hitler was the legendary Super Aryan.

[Acidbaron]

In case you all are new here Jaylock is regarded as our local forum troll. Hence the topics created that in itself are controversial paired with replies to bait people further.

OT: All hitler really wanted was that people liked his paintings.

Infracted

[Revik]

The question you guys should really be asking is what would the world had been like if Germans had succeeded in the battle of Stalingrad and the Russians were forever pushed back out of Europe.

Eventually Germany would have fallen but then there would have been no Russia to really speak of. What would the world had been like without a cold war? Would we have landed on the moon at all? Would there have even been any endeavor to go into space? Would there have been any nuclear proliferation like it exists today? Without the Red Scare would we have even gone into Korea of Vietnam? So many questions.

[Pannonian]

Which is ironic because his rhetoric was geared toward that. Of course, he would be the leader of this "perfect" race (being black haired, brown eyed lol)

- - - Updated - - -



I wonder what ordinary German citizens thought about a bill that was drafted for the purpose of exterminating an entire race...

I mean the whole reason Hitler got into power was because of the German national pride and the rhetoric that Hitler blasted that the Jews were taking over their nationalistic identity.

I can tell to the perspective of my grandfathers, but you have to keep in mind that Austria isn't exactly like Germany:

For my Step-Grandfather:
He was a patriotic Austrian who fought in WW-I and believed until his death that the liberals killed the army which would've won otherwise. So after the war when austria was reduced to a small country he joined the then illegal nazis because he liked Hitlers speeches about the shame of versailles (not so muich because of the jews) - he went to prison for a few months because he was a member of the SA and therefore he got a small pension and didn't have to fight in WW2 - he never rose in the ranks, as he wasn't the smartest person on one hand and not ruthless enough on the other hand

My Grandfather: Was much younger when WW-2 started, and it was more like an adventure in the beginning. He was PoW and after he returned he worked in the communist party. He said that they weren't involved in anything with jews (mind you i dont know if he told the truth, he's been dead for 20 years)

Much more interesting - i talked a lot to my grandmother about this, and how she felt:

As you may know, germany annexed austria in 1938 with a general poll that got 98% approval. For my grandmother it was obvious she'd vote for the Nazis because she was unemployed and she saw the rise of germany while austria was still struggling, and see, 2 months later she got a very nice job. She told me that everyone knew the jews were vanishing, but at first they didn't know how and where to. Especially later according to her the existance of KZs* was commonly know, but no one talked about it.

To put it altogether at least for my family: it wasn't hatred of jews, but either hurt pride or economical possibilities. Also you have to keep in mind that "killing jews" wasn't the "core message", because thats kinda hard to sell.

*Talking about KZs meaning extermination-camps. Normal "concentration camps" were quite usual in this period of time and not exclusive to the Nazis.

[Danuru]

What you dont realize is that Hitler was the legendary Super Aryan.

Ok... You win everything.

[Docturphil]

The type of "world peace" that you speak of would mean the complete genocide of the Jews. Thats not peace to me, thats barbarism.

Probably would have extended beyond just Jews too. Africans, and Chinese probably would have been exterminated as well. Quite possibly anyone who wasn't European. Although I would imagine the Japanese might be safe seeing as they were allies. Nazi Germany may have just let them be on their own little island. Of course they very well could have turned against them after everything else was conquered. Who knows?

[Deleted]

If Hitler actually "won" how long would it have lasted? And how long before the rest of the world beat him back?.

Berlin get nuked 1945 so I cant see how he can win, but in your alternative history Hitler did won, so Germany have time to bild there own nuke so it become as the historical cold war but it is US vs Germany.

I don't think such an evil dictator like him would have lasted long even if he seized control of all of Europe.

Stalin disagree with you, he was evil and did take half Europa...

I'd say maaaaybe 5-10 years max before he was taken down.

By who? 5-10 year and Germany will have nukes.....

Maybe Wehrmacht get tired of of fight Hitlers eternal war in the east, Hitlers vision was to let some Russian survive so Germany did have sombady to fight against, so the German peopel remaine sharp and did have fighting spirit and not become soft and lazy then they did have slaves to do all the work.

Wehrmacht oath was to Hitler personally, then Hitler dies there are no restraint on the Generals, so it will be a massive civil war then its all against all or the Wehrmacht pruge their competitors like SS and Gestapo and Germany become a "normal" military dictatorship or a return to the semi-democratic empire.

[God Save The King]

I agree.

To go along with that, had Hitler taken control of Europe, I find it very hard to believe that he would have had the power to take control of the United States like the "Man in the High Castle" show on Amazon, given the fact that we had nuclear weapons and he didn't. I know he was close to having nuclear weapons, but being able to fly them across the atlantic and bomb strategic areas in the United States would have been almost impossible for him.

So if he controlled Europe, I don't think the United States would have allowed that for too long, along with Russia and our other allies.

Honestly, watch the show. It's amazing and covers this idea very well.

The general premise (no spoilers really, this is just backstory you learn in the show, not the plotline) is that Germany successfully developed the Nuclear bomb first, and dropped it on DC, destroying our government. Out of pure fear of the weapon, most of Europe succumbs and America surrenders. America is split in half, the part west of the Rockies going to Japan, and the Eastern part to the Greater Nazi Reich. Then with all the might of Europe and America, The Greater Nazi Reich secures the western part of Russia, all of Africa, the Middle East, and the eastern half of South America. Japan picks up Oceania, Eastern Russia, Eastern Asian, and Western South America.

[URL="http://i.imgur.com/bsMnMdc.png"]Link to Map[/URL] - Red is Nazi, Blue is Japan, Yellow is Neutral Zone (neither empire owns it, and no other nation exists inside of it).

This situation is somewhat plausible - the fear of the Nuclear Weapon is what allowed us to essentially dominate the Japanese, and, if no one else had developed it, we could've dominated most of the globe

[Kuntantee]

WWII Germans had a plan to desiccate Mediterranean. This should tell you about their arrogance and superiority complex. The failed 3rd (4th? whichever it is) Reich was supposed to be an expansive empire. They'd go as far as they could. Considering the above arrogance, I'd doubt if they didn't have "world domination" in mind.

[barackohmama]

He just wanted to hang out and have a good time with all his friends

[Deleted]

He saw Russia as a threat, and Russia is only partly in Europe. In time he surely would had seen rest of Asia and Canada/USA as threats, so he would had eventually attacked them too.