1. #1

    Overwatch premium vs FP2

    Saw a thread earlier discussing why WoW should become F2P. Most of the comments on this thread were very against it stating that the WoW community would become garbage if the game was F2P because most communities of F2P games are. I personally, love almost everything about OW minus one huge issue...some of its community. Some people simply dont care about team comps or switching because they just want to play a certain character or just want to boost their KD and ignore objectives. I run into this not only in quick play but comp as well. It's the only thing that generally pisses me off about the game and after running into multiple times a day it gets frustrating Now all that being said, if OW offered some sort of subscription plan that required you to pay monthly do you think that would weed out some of the toxicity. If so how do you think it would work, how much would you be willing to pay, should it offer exclusive items/skins? Thoughts in general?

  2. #2
    I would only make it worse. If people have to pay monthly not only could they have a certain goal, it would have to be reached within a certain time, some of the time. This creates a lot more toxicity.
    OW payment model is fine.

  3. #3
    I probably didn't make this clear earlier but I didnt mean OW strictly being subscription based. I was simply tossing around the idea of having the current F2P platform as well as an option for premium (or subscription).

  4. #4
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    I feel like this would just make people pay for longer queues and subpar matchmaking due to the vastly smaller pool of players.

    Unfortunately, as an online game, there's only so much you can do about toxicity. I don't think a pay tier would eliminate or even minimise that.
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by micwini View Post
    I would only make it worse. If people have to pay monthly not only could they have a certain goal, it would have to be reached within a certain time, some of the time. This creates a lot more toxicity.
    OW payment model is fine.
    And sorry could you clarify on what you mean with the goal? Sorry for not quite understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    I feel like this would just make people pay for longer queues and subpar matchmaking due to the vastly smaller pool of players.

    Unfortunately, as an online game, there's only so much you can do about toxicity. I don't think a pay tier would eliminate or even minimise that.
    Yeah, having a smaller matchmaking pool would definitely be an issue and one of the first things I thought of. Although for me I wouldnt mind longer que's if it meant higher quality matchmaking with people closer to rank/skill.

  6. #6
    Pit Lord Vomlix's Avatar
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    Overwatch is not F2P. It has a purchase price. It's not 'subscription' or 'F2P'. There is a middle ground, and that's where Overwatch exists. Also, how would a subscription model weed out toxicity if there's an option to just be F2P. Are there separate queues? That would only serve to split up the community and that would be shitty for everyone who didn't subscribe since they would have a higher concentration of toxicity.
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  7. #7
    Yea let's not. I hate to be that guy, but if you are so worried about perfect comps and people playing how they want to instead of how you want play with friends.

  8. #8
    I think the idea of F2P games having worse communities than paid titles simply because they're F2P is a complete fallacy. It's the wrong thing to be focusing on if the intent is to combat player toxicity. The amount of money people are willing to spend on a game has little to do with how much of a jerk they're going to be to their fellow players. Yes, it's easier for individuals to "not care" about their account if they can just make a new one, but if the game offers any kind of progression at all (which F2P games often tend to way more than paid titles) then these individuals are likely to be weeded out and move on relatively quickly.

    Toxicity is dealt with via good moderation, appropriate communication tools, and incentivising healthy behaviour among players. If a company isn't doing that, then the financial accessibility of their game isn't likely to make much difference either way.

  9. #9
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    The only thing they need to do to handle toxicity is moderate based on reports. Perhaps give some feedback to the user base on how many people's accounts were suspended for that, so that the users feel they're being heard in those reports (no specifics, obviously). Adding a sub fee, like Tziva said, would just split the community and make queue times longer/worse.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Rutgut View Post
    Saw a thread earlier discussing why WoW should become F2P. Most of the comments on this thread were very against it stating that the WoW community would become garbage if the game was F2P because most communities of F2P games are. I personally, love almost everything about OW minus one huge issue...some of its community. Some people simply dont care about team comps or switching because they just want to play a certain character or just want to boost their KD and ignore objectives. I run into this not only in quick play but comp as well. It's the only thing that generally pisses me off about the game and after running into multiple times a day it gets frustrating Now all that being said, if OW offered some sort of subscription plan that required you to pay monthly do you think that would weed out some of the toxicity. If so how do you think it would work, how much would you be willing to pay, should it offer exclusive items/skins? Thoughts in general?
    The WoW community is garbage lol. Being paid or not doesn't change that sadly.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rutgut View Post
    And sorry could you clarify on what you mean with the goal? Sorry for not quite understanding.
    Reaching any rank to be more specific. You have forever to do that, but if money's tight you might have just a few months worth of subscription and when it looks like you might not be able to reach it you would be toxic.

    of course it wouldn't be the case ALL THE TIME, but on average the toxicity will be higher. Competitive is full of those people now, will be full of people like that then.

  12. #12
    Legendary! Tharkkun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rutgut View Post
    Saw a thread earlier discussing why WoW should become F2P. Most of the comments on this thread were very against it stating that the WoW community would become garbage if the game was F2P because most communities of F2P games are. I personally, love almost everything about OW minus one huge issue...some of its community. Some people simply dont care about team comps or switching because they just want to play a certain character or just want to boost their KD and ignore objectives. I run into this not only in quick play but comp as well. It's the only thing that generally pisses me off about the game and after running into multiple times a day it gets frustrating Now all that being said, if OW offered some sort of subscription plan that required you to pay monthly do you think that would weed out some of the toxicity. If so how do you think it would work, how much would you be willing to pay, should it offer exclusive items/skins? Thoughts in general?
    What premium features are you looking for that aren't already provided? You can already pay for premium skins using loot boxes. As far as Toxicity goes it will exist in any game. With a premium membership you won't eliminate all the asshats that have full time jobs and then act like 3 year olds during comp play. The only solution to your problem is to find 5 like minded friends and play with them. Just like raiding in WoW, PVPing in WoW, Heroes league in HOTS, etc, etc.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Rutgut View Post
    Yeah, having a smaller matchmaking pool would definitely be an issue and one of the first things I thought of. Although for me I wouldnt mind longer que's if it meant higher quality matchmaking with people closer to rank/skill.
    Quality is subjective though. Would you be happy losing 50% of the time even if the matches were close? Most people expect more unless they are extremely high skill.
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  13. #13
    Here is some advice for any game you play: If you value teamwork, strategy, coordination, and people generally taking winning seriously, then you need to find a group of ppl to play with. You will always be disappointed if you expect the community to value the same things you do in every random match of random ppl. If you are not looking for that level of serious play, then playing with randoms will be fine. Even some of the people who value the same things you do, will likely be trying to hone their individual skills when not playing with their friends rather than consistantly playing a class they've mastered just to win with some randoms.

    You don't need some subscription based pay scheme to achieve the gameplay you are looking for, you just need to make some like-minded friends, and give up the hope that it's possible to achieve the level of gameplay you're looking for in random matches. People are inevitably going to care more about practicing classes and doing what's most fun for them with their time, than worry about winning every random match they play.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vomlix View Post
    Overwatch is not F2P. It has a purchase price. It's not 'subscription' or 'F2P'. There is a middle ground, and that's where Overwatch exists. Also, how would a subscription model weed out toxicity if there's an option to just be F2P. Are there separate queues? That would only serve to split up the community and that would be shitty for everyone who didn't subscribe since they would have a higher concentration of toxicity.
    Just for the record, the term for games like OW is B2P or buy to play.
    Last edited by BananaHandsB; 2017-04-03 at 10:00 PM.

  14. #14
    Path of Exile is F2P and it has possibly the best community of any online game. Thus you can't really argue that changing a game into F2P would mean the community would turn toxic.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Janz View Post
    Path of Exile is F2P and it has possibly the best community of any online game. Thus you can't really argue that changing a game into F2P would mean the community would turn toxic.
    Irrelevant, its a game where 99.9% of the worldwide gaming population can not comprehend now imagine if they cant comprehend how it works, how they would actually play it.

    And PoE has its own problems for being F2P, the community is nice because its mostly composed of older players trying to get that D2 feeling back,or from solo players that dont give a fuck about others, so its not much of a problem to be "Helpful" now and then.

    It has toxicity in the form of "price fixing" "fake listings of trading and afking" and ton of other things that the average player wont experience cause they dont reach that level of play.

    In other words, you dont have to communicate with someone to enjoy the game, but when you eventually end up doing a lot you find there is toxicity there also.

    Overwatch or WoW or any game where there is a sense of "competition" or proper playing involved will have toxicity.

    Now imagine if PoE was only played in party and worked this way, 5 people, each has to do 19-20% of the scaling mobs HP life to make sure you understand me, HAS TO DO 20% OF THE MOBS HP OR IT CANT DIE, so assuming you have 3 players with decent specs, the 3 players take the mobs HP away in 1 hit cause their spec is not garbage, now imagine having to wait for the other 2 with their garbage spec and choices having to take away that rest 40%, all this with the stupid scaling of parties, where mobs get like 324234% more HP when partied.

    Toxicity, instantly, all sorts and forms because they are hindering the other players.
    Last edited by potis; 2017-04-07 at 04:13 PM.

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