Jaws of Shadow Nerf

[casterbator]

I really wonder if Blizz Devs think about what they are doing beforehand. Affliction is stronger than demo at every aspect even after their nerfs (Single Target, Aoe, 2 Target spread cleave, Add fights). And yet they nerf Demonology Silver Trait:

Jaws of Shadow’s (Artifact trait) bonus is now 10% (was 20%).

Making it worse than a regular Infernal Furnace Trait.

I don't know what was the reason behind this nerf but I am sure this is not the proper way to adress the issue.

[deflomick]

Yep actually Infernal furnace is much better than jaws of shadow's...I feel disgusted by these changes...

[Demonidze]

why did they nerf it anyway? demo is still middle of the pack spec. it doesnt need nerfs..

[Deleted]

Hmm, a blind guess:
Imp damage was already around 50-60% of total Demo damage. Doggies are normal part of the rotation anyway, and especially with Tier set, likelihood of them having 100% uptime of the buff is high.

20% of 60% damage is 12% damage increase, which is way out of line of any silver trait.

Fixing a spec with a weapon trait is the wrong way to go. I'd rather have balanced traits and then have the overall damage of the spec looked at.

[Bullettime]

It's understandable to an extent because it did shift too much power into the imps, too much power for a single perk, and was going to be doing some odd things with our rotation and talents going into ToS such as the IDS-PT-SC combo overtaking everything as gear scaled.

I don't like that they did the nerf without buffing something else though when Demo isn't exactly crazy.

[Shadowswann]

Hmm, a blind guess:
Imp damage was already around 50-60% of total Demo damage. Doggies are normal part of the rotation anyway, and especially with Tier set, likelihood of them having 100% uptime of the buff is high.

20% of 60% damage is 12% damage increase, which is way out of line of any silver trait.

Fixing a spec with a weapon trait is the wrong way to go. I'd rather have balanced traits and then have the overall damage of the spec looked at.

Dont bring random numbers , imps are 30-45% maximum , depending on talents relics ....

But still yeah it was too much damage for a non golden

[dmon83]

Well, i'll go IF for my next trait and leave Jaws after that.

[casterbator]

I agree imp damage is around 28% of demo single target damage but that is normal since it's the ability we spam to waste shards. Even if they do not want that much power being shifted into imps they had a chance to prevent it they could give power to our Felguard instead which would enable us to have more control on our damage, burst and aoe. I have played during the PTR and back then Jaws of Shadow trait wasn't even specific to imp damage. It was worded as "increases damage done by your pets". So instead of 20% imp damage they could have made it 5 or 10% for all demons etc.

But the real problem is they do not adress any of the real issues of demonology like the spec only performing like a normal spec in long, low movement boss ST/Cleave fights. For anything else its utter crap and the things demo is good at, affli does it way better by casting UA and draining or Seed and soul flame.

But yeah nerf demo, with the destro changes I don't think there will be many left anyways. It's such a burden to do anything with demo but yeah nerf them.

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Well, i'll go IF for my next trait and leave Jaws after that.

Don't do that, Gold trait is very good on single target you would want to take it early.

[xuros]

Hmm, a blind guess:
Imp damage was already around 50-60% of total Demo damage. Doggies are normal part of the rotation anyway, and especially with Tier set, likelihood of them having 100% uptime of the buff is high.

20% of 60% damage is 12% damage increase, which is way out of line of any silver trait.

Fixing a spec with a weapon trait is the wrong way to go. I'd rather have balanced traits and then have the overall damage of the spec looked at.

You are doing something wrong if your imps are 50-60% of your damage. They generally are 30-40% (going 40 as a VERY high side), but my imps are around 35% at the high end.

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It's understandable to an extent because it did shift too much power into the imps, too much power for a single perk, and was going to be doing some odd things with our rotation and talents going into ToS such as the IDS-PT-SC combo overtaking everything as gear scaled.

I don't like that they did the nerf without buffing something else though when Demo isn't exactly crazy.

How is it understandable? Every class has something thats the high side of their damage!
"Well we dont want the imps to be that for you!"...Ok then buff something else since you nerfed imps and make the other the high side for us. That would be my reply to it.

[Inshabel]

This might be a prelude for proposed demo 7.2.5 changes for all you know,

Delivered in typical awkward Blizzard fashion :P

[Bullettime]

You are doing something wrong if your imps are 50-60% of your damage. They generally are 30-40% (going 40 as a VERY high side), but my imps are around 35% at the high end.

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How is it understandable? Every class has something thats the high side of their damage!
"Well we dont want the imps to be that for you!"...Ok then buff something else since you nerfed imps and make the other the high side for us. That would be my reply to it.

Because the imps were becoming too much a source of Demonology's damage and that perk had an enormous amount of power because of it. The power of it was going to even manifest itself worse when ToS rolled around and sims were going to start showing an imp spam build being the best by far because of the combination and making up an enormous percentage of our DPS.

Demonology needs a buff after this absolutely, but let's not pretend that the trait causing such a large amount of power and change wasn't a problem.

[Deleted]

Looking at some info it looks like it's due to it's synergy with the T20 set coming up for tomb. HOWEVER, as an affliction lock I am shocked we haven't been nerfed yet. Ever since MG came in it's just been a joke to play. Just a boring,simple, overpowered RNG fest.

[Kncvasdlsfui]

Because the imps were becoming too much a source of Demonology's damage and that perk had an enormous amount of power because of it. The power of it was going to even manifest itself worse when ToS rolled around and sims were going to start showing an imp spam build being the best by far because of the combination and making up an enormous percentage of our DPS.

Demonology needs a buff after this absolutely, but let's not pretend that the trait causing such a large amount of power and change wasn't a problem.

It's irrelevant what spell the damage comes from. Jaws was a single target oriented trait in a single target oriented spec. Blizzard felt that this was such a problem that they decided to heavily nerf it to compensate for tomb gear but didn't want to wait until 7.25 so they did it right away. I'm not upset about it; that's just reality.

Really all we learned was something that we already knew, blizzard balance is basically done at random and there isn't much thought put into anything. If you don't believe me look at stat weights for different dps classes and how they translate into loot and gameplay. Demonology and affliction in legion have always struck me as classes that were designed half-competently on accident.

[Bullettime]

And I'm not disagreeing that the spec needs buffs. I'm saying that one specific trait shouldn't be such an enormous change in our DPS or change our talent balance the way it was and was going to do so more extremely over time.

[xuros]

Because the imps were becoming too much a source of Demonology's damage and that perk had an enormous amount of power because of it. The power of it was going to even manifest itself worse when ToS rolled around and sims were going to start showing an imp spam build being the best by far because of the combination and making up an enormous percentage of our DPS.

Demonology needs a buff after this absolutely, but let's not pretend that the trait causing such a large amount of power and change wasn't a problem.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&source=265 46.99% of damage is icelance
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=11 60% of the damage done is UA
and the list goes on and on. Every class has an ability that does a majority of its damage. Imps are much lower than most of classes. So how about a nerf to every other classes major damage trait while we are at it.

[Bullettime]

Nevermind that the single golden trait was causing such an immense and disproportionate gain on its own and they've been nerfing every golden trait causing those enormous swings.

But fuck it. You win. The sky is falling. Demo is dead.

[slickwilly]

Demo is just a fantasy nerd spec anyway and has no place in a raid. The nerf is kind of moot.

[BannedForViews]

Demo didn't need nerfed, but the message being sent is that individual traits shouldn't be THAT strong, which this one was. It was like a flat 5-6% damage buff? from a single non golden trait? I'd be nice to see them reallocate some power to other spells to make up for it, but I'm sure demo will be fine. Rend soul got raped even harder and we still have that shitty seed talent.

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Looking at some info it looks like it's due to it's synergy with the T20 set coming up for tomb. HOWEVER, as an affliction lock I am shocked we haven't been nerfed yet. Ever since MG came in it's just been a joke to play. Just a boring,simple, overpowered RNG fest.

We are not overpowered. We are simplistic in play style though.

[Inshabel]

Demo is just a fantasy nerd spec anyway and has no place in a raid. The nerf is kind of moot.

Calling people nerds on the internet message board for a Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.

[Drakile]

Another key focus for this patch is on class design, particularly for a few specs that need some extra attention. We’re likely to end up making adjustments for many specs to some degree, but we’re currently looking primarily at:
Destruction Warlocks
Outlaw and Subtlety Rogues
Brewmaster and Mistweaver Monks
Havoc Demon Hunters
Guardian Druids

Also we feel demo locks are being played too much again, so we will be steadily shitting all over the spec in time. First we will nerf jaw of shadows, then when they think the nerfs are done we'll cut infernal furnace in half! Also not taking any questions for demo locks, no time for QoL changes for you only time to nerf you, maybe next patch.