Canada's defence spending hits new lows under P.M Trudeau

[Tennis]

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/04/13...-under-trudeau

The government has decreased defence spending to a new low of just 0.88% of GDP, the Senate Committee on National Security and Defence report released Thursday reveals.

This news come only a day after U.S. President Donald Trump said NATO is “no longer obsolete” and reiterated his call for members of the alliance to pay their “fair share.”

All NATO countries have committed to spending 2% of their GDP on defence but Canada has consistently fallen short. While only 5 of the 28 member countries fufill this commitment, Canada ranks near the bottom of the list.

“Government after government has talked a good game about the military while providing less and less support,” Conservative Senator Daniel Lang, chair of the committee, said in a statement.

The committee is recommending the government come up with a plan within six months on how Canada will meet its NATO commitment of 2% by 2028.

“Defending our vast Arctic region requires significant resources, while helping our international partners ensure the rule of law is respected in trouble countries overseas is a humanitarian commitment from which we cannot shrink,” said Liberal Senator Mobina Jaffer, the co-chair of the committee.

In 1960, the first year the committee study looked at, Canada spent 4.2% of GDP, a peak that’s never been revisited. The number first fell below 2% under Pierre Elliott Trudeau in 1973 and then dropped below 1% under Stephen Harper in 2013. The last year it was at 2.0% was in 1990 under Brian Mulroney's Progressive Conservative government.

Both the current and previous governments have argued that the focus should not solely be on the quantity of Canada’s contribution to defence but also the quality of it.

“There are many ways of evaluating one’s contribution to NATO,” Trudeau told media at a joint press conference with Germany chancellor Angela Merkel in February.

Great to see! In a time where some are spending more on military, Canada is leading the way in another direction. This is what Canada is about. Diplomacy and peace. Not war and violence. I hope PM Trudeau continues spending on Canada as opposed to on a military we don't need.

[Molis]

I do not know why Canada would bother spending any money on defense.
They have their southern border big brother to protect them.

[Tyrianth]

Woo, who needs arctic sovereignty. We may as well just hand our territories to Russia now.

While 2% is a bit much I would be happy to see at least 1.5% of our budget going towards defense.

[Exeris]

Great to see! In a time where some are spending more on military, Canada is leading the way in another direction. This is what Canada is about. Diplomacy and peace. Not war and violence. I hope PM Trudeau continues spending on Canada as opposed to on a military we don't need.

Few countries have your location and can let their neighbor take the bill.

[Independent voter]

$1 Canadian only buys 75¢ US.

Trudeau can't afford to spend on defense.

[Zmaniac17]

Few countries have your location and can let their neighbor take the bill.

This reasoning doesn't seem very sound to me. Can you describe a threat that would involve the United States defending Canada? Other than aliens from space who hate Canadians. In fact, recent history has see the United States asking Canada to help it attack other countries. The idea that more money spent on the military equals a safer world has largely been disproved. Just look at the trillions spent on the Iraq War. At a certain point you're just buying things with little or no strategic value to justify your enormous budget.

[Tyrianth]

This reasoning doesn't seem very sound to me. Can you describe a threat that would involve the United States defending Canada? Other than aliens from space who hate Canadians. In fact, recent history has see the United States asking Canada to help it attack other countries. The idea that more money spent on the military equals a safer world has largely been disproved. Just look at the trillions spent on the Iraq War. At a certain point you're just buying things with little or no strategic value to justify your enormous budget.

Any attack on Canada would result in the US defending Canada.

Canada should be spending more on military not less. We have a massive border surrounded by oceans that we are already not able to defend. As the climate gets warmer our northern coasts become more and more open.

[Krigaren]

Woo, who needs arctic sovereignty. We may as well just hand our territories to Russia now.

While 2% is a bit much I would be happy to see at least 1.5% of our budget going towards defense.

Is the threat of Russia annexing northern Canadian territory even that much of a threat? The closest border that part of North America has with Russia is in Alaska.

[Mistame]

Mounties are cheap! Also, no one cares.

[Tyrianth]

Is the threat of Russia annexing northern Canadian territory even that much of a threat? The closest border that part of North America has with Russia is in Alaska.

Yes, while it's not a huge worry right now, Russia has in the (not so distant) past tried to undermine Canadian arctic sovereignty.

With the climate warming, the arctic region is going to become extremely valuable real estate. With new shipping lanes opening, the permafrost thawing to provide nutrient rich soil, and most likely oil, Russia will have much more incentive to try and claim Canada's arctic territory.

I'm of the opinion that Canada should be able to defend itself. We're surrounded by oceans on 3 sides, and our 4th side is protected by one of our longest and trusted allies. We do not need much of an army. We need a navy and an air force. We do not need to be sending our troops overseas to fight in offensive wars, but we do need to have a means to defend ourselves.

[Sandraudiga]

Trudeau is a disgrace.

[Damajin]

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/04/13...-under-trudeau

Great to see! In a time where some are spending more on military, Canada is leading the way in another direction. This is what Canada is about. Diplomacy and peace. Not war and violence. I hope PM Trudeau continues spending on Canada as opposed to on a military we don't need.

Take the spending to 0 then, and when shit hits the fan don't call us because we won't be answering.

You're the epitome of a freeloader.

[Zmaniac17]

Any attack on Canada would result in the US defending Canada.

Canada should be spending more on military not less. We have a massive border surrounded by oceans that we are already not able to defend. As the climate gets warmer our northern coasts become more and more open.

I don't think you read what I asked. I asked to describe a threat that would involve the United States defending Canada. In-other-words a plausible situation. Who should Canada be preparing to go to war with?

If you want to defend the polar bears it would be better to invest in fighting climate change.

[Tyrianth]

I don't think you read what I asked. I asked to describe a threat that would involve the United States defending Canada. In-other-words a plausible situation. Who should Canada be preparing to go to war with?

If you want to defend the polar bears it would be better to invest in fighting climate change.

An effective military isn't something you can just prop up whenever you need them. An effective military should be ready and on standby at all times. For any potential threat that may occur down the road.

Climate change is the very reason why we need a well funded navy. Arctic territory will be extremely valuable territory once the ice melts.

[Ghostpanther]

I do not know why Canada would bother spending any money on defense.
They have their southern border big brother to protect them.

So true. And they know we would.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think you read what I asked. I asked to describe a threat that would involve the United States defending Canada. In-other-words a plausible situation. Who should Canada be preparing to go to war with?

If you want to defend the polar bears it would be better to invest in fighting climate change.

Any foreign hostile attack on Canada would automatically create for them a enemy of the US against the aggressor. Same goes for Mexico.

[Zmaniac17]

An effective military isn't something you can just prop up whenever you need them. An effective military should be ready and on standby at all times. For any potential threat that may occur down the road.

Climate change is the very reason why we need a well funded navy. Arctic territory will be extremely valuable territory once the ice melts.

I don't disagree with anything you're saying, but you're still not answering the question. You're just saying in general they should be prepared for anything. That is a very inefficient way to prepare. Identifying specific threats is a better way to do it. So please identify some specific military threats to Canada.

[Zan15]

well according to most people here, you have to spend more money to be more secure.
lol. guess you are not secure enough till you spend a few trillion on killing people instead of healthcare or education.

guess you are not secure enough till you give billions in corporate welfare by paying 100x the value of these "defensive" contracts.

[Berengil]

Yes, while it's not a huge worry right now, Russia has in the (not so distant) past tried to undermine Canadian arctic sovereignty.

With the climate warming, the arctic region is going to become extremely valuable real estate. With new shipping lanes opening, the permafrost thawing to provide nutrient rich soil, and most likely oil, Russia will have much more incentive to try and claim Canada's arctic territory.

I'm of the opinion that Canada should be able to defend itself. We're surrounded by oceans on 3 sides, and our 4th side is protected by one of our longest and trusted allies. We do not need much of an army. We need a navy and an air force. We do not need to be sending our troops overseas to fight in offensive wars, but we do need to have a means to defend ourselves.

Putin would be out of his gddmn mind to try to grab territory in North America, let alone territory belonging to a NATO member (like Canada).

Article 5 gets invoked, and the Russian Federation gets rekt.


I summon @Skroe. What is thy opinion on this hypothetical, o wise one?

[Tyrianth]

I don't disagree with anything you're saying, but you're still not answering the question. You're just saying in general they should be prepared for anything. That is a very inefficient way to prepare. Identifying specific threats is a better way to do it. So please identify some specific military threats to Canada.

I've already pointed one out to someone else.

Russia has already tried to test Canada's arctic sovereignty. With the arctic ice melting, the Northwest Passage will become some of the most valuable shipping lanes in the world. Essentially eliminating the need for the Panama Canal. Canada needs to be able to defend it's claim to that land.

Countries do not live short lives. Sometimes countries can't be the most efficient. Just because something doesn't seem likely to happen today doesn't mean it's not going to happen 10, 15, or even 100 years down the line. A proper military takes years to build up and train. A military is like insurance. A waste of money until you actually need it. Then you're damn glad you have it.

[Tennis]

It's called having zero balls. Why spend money on strengthening your country when you can just cry to the US for help militarily if things go bad for you?

What's going bad for us bud? Who's invading?