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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    I am happy you agree. So your idea about turning a racing game and a first person shooter was a void argument. Dont compare apples with oranges.



    No, i want to play a RPG as an RPG. Just that it allows group play, but moves away from group play to be mandatory to get anywhere close to endgame character progression.

    A nice example is The Elder Scrolls Online, where you are able to craft your best gear. And where you progress no matter what you actually play.



    I dont believe that it would take away any players just because the progression system would make grouping up optional.



    Rise, Lord Miserable.
    There you go you said it yourself you like ESO system, sounds like your problem is solved. Have fun.
    "Privilege is invisible to those who have it."

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrven View Post
    There you go you said it yourself you like ESO system, sounds like your problem is solved. Have fun.
    Is ESO playing in the world of warcraft? Is it an azeroth RPG?

    I love it when it is so easy to refute arguments.

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Balager View Post
    Old models

    This one is obvious. The game is old. The graphics are old. An engine update is long overdue. But that can't happen in a simple expansion. What can be done is to update all the NPC , gear and monster models that haven't been updated in the recent expansions. You might not think it is a big deal that kids still look like the way they did in Vanilla for example, but it totally is. Also, throw out the cataclysm leveling gear. Ditching all the unique looking equipment in favour of generic stuff that don't fit any racial or class aesthetics was a mistake. Let's take the engine as far as possible.

    The current talent system

    AKA the only thing I really disliked about MoP. Hey, we threw out the old talent system because there was a "correct way" to allocate talent points and we want to avoid that. Well news flash. That's still a thing. Also we don't get talents at the same intervals. For non hero classes it's mostly every 15 levels with the last comming after 10. But for Death Knights it is a total clusterfuck. 56, 57, 58, 60, 75, 90, 100. Let's try again, shall we? Or if they really don't want correct and incorrect ways, let's just forget about talents.

    Weapon requirements for abilities

    No, I don't want to decapitate mobs with arrows, but when every warrior skill needs a two handed weapon, but all quest rewards are one handed I start to get irritated. Let's forget about this nonsense and just go with melee weapon, ranged weapon, dual wield and shield.

    Class trainers

    You know. All the NPCs that are still present but have absolutely no use. It would be nice to give them class quest that reward core abilities or gear. If not, remove them.

    Bloodless, limbless, featherless quest mobs

    You know these types of quests. Get ten wolf paws. Okay. But only every third wolf has a paw and even they have only one. I know this extends game time and maintains the illusion of content, but it is still super irritating. And Final Fantasy XIV does not do it.

    Quest lines that should be one quest in reality

    The typical: we have tons of new quests lie. Well that's cool. Provided there aren't quests like: go talk to this guy right next to me. The flight path introduction quest goes like this. 1. go to the flight master. 2. fly to the capital and talk to the merchant. 3. go to the capital flight master. 4. talk to the original quest giver. Four quests that should be one.

    Dungeon and raid difficulties

    Pitchfork time, I know. But seriously. Do we need four difficulties for dungeons and raids? Nah. That's just the illusion of having more content, when in fact we don't. Having normal and mythic + is more than enough for one dungeon. When Final Fantasy XIV does a hard mode of a dungeon it is continues the story of the regular one and uses a different layout, with new bosses. Like old and new deadmines. Also, ditch LFR ASAP. I am perfectly fine with raiding being too difficult for me. No need to dumb it down to a level where you can kill Archimonde at level 100 without paying attention to what you are doing. Raids aren't meant to be facerolled.


    Gimmicks that are only relevant for one expansion


    A no brainer really. Garrisons are only used between 90 and 100. We already know that artifact weapons won't stick around after 110. I know nothing can be done retroactively, but I really really really hope that the next expansion won't bring a new system that is only used for 10 levels out of 120.


    Random drop legendaries


    Nope. Bad idea. Nothing legendary about them now. Let's go back to insanely long difficult questlines.
    With these I can agree, specially about the old models, RNG legendaries and garrisons.

  4. #124
    Titanforging/sockets
    Multiple difficulties
    Welfare Legendaries
    Artifact Weapons

    All has to be removed if they want the game to grow.

  5. #125
    Imagine a line between 2 points. Point A is the world (immersion, rp) and point B is game(just they gamey part). And somewhere in the middle are the MMO games depending how much they lean towards immersion or gamey..

    generally, sandbox games are close to point A while themepark games are close to point B. But this doesnt mean that they need to be exactly on A or B.. they can just be somewhere in the middle..

    Over the years wow has pushed the line a lot towards point B removing more and more immersion and rpg elements in favor of convenience... it used to be somewhere in the middle..

    What OP asks in some of his requests is to move further towards the B point... I personally disagree. I read some arguments like "but you mine without a pickaxe" or "you receive a dragon mount on your mailbox"..

    true and i am not happy about it. But that doesnt mean that the game must move more to point B.. on the contrary, i believe that it need to start moving back to the other side before it stops being titled as RPG
    The trick of selling a FFA-PvP MMO is creating the illusion among gankers that they are respectable fighters while protecting them from respectable fights, as their less skilled half would be massacred and quit instead of “HTFU” as they claim.

  6. #126
    nothing to do with garrison misson table or followers should return. titanforging and warforge should be removed as well as fuking legendary galore. AP and artifacts plz for the love of god remove this shit.

  7. #127
    The reduction or removal of RNG gearing. Titanforging and Warforged is a fine concept if the player can ALWAYS upgrade their gear (Barring special cases) with some kind of currency (Badges). Having it exclusively through drops is pants on head retarded, no question. Just as well, being unable to go after specific legendary gear is really dumb - it should just be epic gear with unique affixes or something. But beyond the color of the gear, it shouldn't be RNG at all or it should also allow the ability to eventually get one.

    I don't mind the Garrison mission table or the followers, but every iteration thus far is a chore and requires you to 'click' to 'engage' yourself. Nothing is engaging about what we are given, it's a steady stream of random rewards that we have no control over, which is infuriating in and of itself. And, of course, it would be engaging if you had more control of where you went for what kind of rewards - and actually participated within the missions you put forth with your followers.

    Maybe we'll get that iteration in 8.0, allowing clearing of missions with much more meaningful rewards (Because they aren't right now, despite being promised that).

    Once more, we need basic and advanced badges to return. Infinite generation (to a cap) and a weekly cap gain (to a maximum overall cap) is the best. I don't understand why this system was removed in favor of complete RNG gearing but it clearly was not for the better.
    "Your name was stolen? I see... Well, I guess that happens from time to time..."


  8. #128
    Bloodsail Admiral Balager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papajohn4 View Post
    Imagine a line between 2 points. Point A is the world (immersion, rp) and point B is game(just they gamey part). And somewhere in the middle are the MMO games depending how much they lean towards immersion or gamey..

    generally, sandbox games are close to point A while themepark games are close to point B. But this doesnt mean that they need to be exactly on A or B.. they can just be somewhere in the middle..

    Over the years wow has pushed the line a lot towards point B removing more and more immersion and rpg elements in favor of convenience... it used to be somewhere in the middle..

    What OP asks in some of his requests is to move further towards the B point... I personally disagree. I read some arguments like "but you mine without a pickaxe" or "you receive a dragon mount on your mailbox"..

    true and i am not happy about it. But that doesnt mean that the game must move more to point B.. on the contrary, i believe that it need to start moving back to the other side before it stops being titled as RPG
    Actually I would be totally happy with point A. Remove or Rework. Point is to make a decision to fully embrace one of the roads, and stick with it. Removal is more about the current way they are.

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Balager View Post
    Actually I would be totally happy with point A. Remove or Rework. Point is to make a decision to fully embrace one of the roads, and stick with it. Removal is more about the current way they are.
    But it doesnt need to be more to one way or another it can be in the middle. It can keep a balance of simulation/gameplay and even favor more gameplay but not completely disregard simulation.
    Last edited by papajohn4; 2017-05-20 at 07:38 AM.
    The trick of selling a FFA-PvP MMO is creating the illusion among gankers that they are respectable fighters while protecting them from respectable fights, as their less skilled half would be massacred and quit instead of “HTFU” as they claim.

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    Is ESO playing in the world of warcraft? Is it an azeroth RPG?

    I love it when it is so easy to refute arguments.
    You want the game to be something it has never been on a whim of what you think you want it to be. You side step the fact it is built around interaction with others and hope it will become your own little world that sometimes allows you to peek out and do something old and familiar. You can keep trying to spin this narrative all you want, it doesn't matter then game isn't going to become this solo player haven you are hoping for. I do have a suggestion, with your ability to ignore your own statements and effort to spin other's you might give Fox and call and see if you can get O'Reilly's old show.
    "Privilege is invisible to those who have it."

  11. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrven View Post
    You want the game to be something it has never been on a whim of what you think you want it to be.
    Oh please, the game adresses solo players from start. Every content up to endgame is soloable. The weak part is endgame, and that is where the game should improve.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrven View Post
    You can keep trying to spin this narrative all you want, it doesn't matter then game isn't going to become this solo player haven you are hoping for.
    Well, thats not up to you. And not up to me. So lets not talk about things that "never happen".

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrven View Post
    I do have a suggestion, with your ability to ignore your own statements and effort to spin other's you might give Fox and call and see if you can get O'Reilly's old show.
    I see you dislike the idea. You are welcome to.

  12. #132
    Bloodsail Admiral Balager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papajohn4 View Post
    But it doesnt need to be more to one way or another it can be in the middle. It can keep a balance of simulation/gameplay and even favor more gameplay but not completely disregard simulation.
    It can be, but not with half assed measures. Like chose option B for one and option A for another. But don't stick with this A-ish whatever we have now.

    Like: Make campfires a general social ability that give a bonus to cooking and alchemy, make forges and anvils optional that give a bonus to relevant professions when near them, make inking sets just as optional as mining picks skinning knives fishing rods and the like and simply ad a bonus. Make a quick return spell that gets a shorter cooldown and/or cast time, if you keep a hearthstone with you.

    A system that works the same way for everything. And it happens to make things easier.

    BUT on the other there are some abilities you only get from your trainer, there is no faceroll raid difficulty, epic mounts are all boss drops and maybe a little bit faster.
    Last edited by Balager; 2017-05-20 at 01:02 PM.

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