State of Healers in Legion

[Deleted]

Prepare for a somewhat long wall of text

I decided to play a Resto Druid in Legion, having avoided playing healers for the entirety of the 12 years that I've been playing this game. Played a Warrior all this time, went pro in WOTLK, got R1, stopped playing in Cata due to mongoloid gameplay, came back in Legion.

I was excited, it was new to me and I sort of imagined it to be quite chill and laid back.

Remember that Planet of the Apes movie? Where that astronaut leaves Earth and comes back to see the entire planet taken over by apes? Yeah, this is what it feels like, I left in Cataclysm thinking that this is about as bad as it could get and oh boy, oh boy was I proven wrong.


The Arena Experience:


Having played this spec for 3 seasons straight, I've noticed something about PvP. It is horrendous towards healers, I dread queuing in anything PvP related because every single time I show my head from behind a corner or appear somewhere, there's always the same bunch of mongoloid melees going absolutely apeshit with white foam frothing from their mouth chasing me down with no pause to their attacks.

In arenas, there's no pause to their attacks, they can press any ability that is not on CD and that'll do damage to me so they don't have to actually think "what spells should I use against him?", they just "SMASH ALL THE SHINY BUTTONS".

So I try to juke their casts, note that I ALWAYS successfully juke because the majority of these apparent 2.2k melee players haven't heard of fake casting before. And every single time, there is a pseudo interrupt, pushback, stun or fear. There is ALWAYS something they can use, and if you're up against TWO melees, jesus christ, I'm so sorry. But the amount of forgiveness these players get is astounding, it's like as if Blizzard is sitting next to them holding their hands and telling them: "It's okay to fuck up, don't worry. Just press that stun and use your swofty macro".

So I've discovered that juking doesn't really work like it's supposed to and sitting in caster form is a death sentence, 900k - 1.2 million white hits, no thank you. So I HOT up, sit bear form, dull gameplay.

This somewhat keeps me alive for possibly 10 seconds longer, I notice my partners health going down, I come out for a grand total of 3 seconds to apply 2 rejuvs to my partners and I shit you not, I lost half my health. So I jump back into bear form, try to vortex + displacer away, nope, not on this melee's watch. I watch him do his mongoloid leap towards me and continue his mindless rampage. "Oh well, I thought. It was worth a try".

The sense of being defeated despite pulling off a cool move to "outplay" them, is crushing because they didn't put any effort into it, they just kept on mongoing and they win. What is the point of that? Why are you rewarding them for doing PvE in a PvP oriented game mode? I struggle to understand this.


Skill and Outplaying your Opponents:


That's the thing about playing a healer in this expansion, it makes me SO angry, I am always angrier than I was before I logged in. I hit 2k for each season to get my elite set and I stop queuing. I absolutely refuse to go on any further, I am afraid of arenas. I always mutter to myself "fucking mongoloids" every single time they do some ridiculous swofty damage and leap around like a goddamn monkey and still win, absolutely no strategy, no thinking. I'm serious, they probably stare at their screens pressing the same keys, their eyes starting to close from tiredness and boredom.

The fact that there is no way of outplaying these people makes me seethe with rage, as I watch them spam their same mongoloid 3 button rotation and not get punished at all for making the biggest mistakes ever, overlapping def CDs? LUL no problem, uses burst into my defensives? LUL no problem, he'll die anyway. Gets juked? LUL no problem, just stun him, fear him and then interrupt him when it's back up after pumping him with 3 million damage total while he casted absolutely nothing.

I played with a Destro Lock a few weeks back to 2k and every single time we queued into a Warrior comp all the Warrior did was train my partner for the ENTIRE game and still killed him. He didn't even stormbolt me, his MW Monk healer didn't even try to CC me, it didn't seem apparent that he knew how to either. That's right, the Warrior LITERALLY kept spamming his rotation into the Warlock like how a PvE player spams his rotation into a training dummy until he died from dampening. No amount of cyclones or outplaying worked, I couldn't believe my eyes. Nothing we did worked, NOTHING.


As for the Resto Druid rage threads...


I've noticed people rage at Rdruids due to how OP they seem, but it's like as if they don't even understand why they're OP in the first place. They're only OP when they're sitting in bear form, ever seen what happens to a Rdruid not in bear form? Dead. And their partners peel for them, which keeps them alive. The Rdruid is LITERALLY useless when he's in bear form, ever tried switching to his partners? It's effective. I'd understand Rdruid hate if they could cast heals on their partners sitting in bear form as well, but they can't. They have to leave bear form to keep their partners alive and you can just stun them and swofty macro.

Rdruids are only good with a good team that knows how to peel. Don't be a mongoloid and hate on me just because you can't mongo me down in bear form like you can to a Disc Priest

Where are the developers?

The point of this thread is not solely about Rdruids but about all healers, we are getting raped upside down with no way of stopping these melees in their tracks, they ALWAYS have something to use to continue their damage spamming.

PvP participation is at it's lowest at like 35k right now, 60k in S2 and 150k in S1. Healers are quitting left and right and that means DPs are quitting as well due to not being able to find any healers as well.

And we've got Holinka and Celestablet posting cat pictures on Twitter, while turning this magical knob called "nerf/buff" up and down then going back to posting about alcohol and some other irrelevant stuff because they're too scared to come to the official Blizzard forums to listen to feedback.


So I'm gonna end the whining and provide you with some fixes that you can implement to make the experience better for healers, and for everybody else.



- Add a freaking DR to interrupts, seriously. This is long overdue and why this hasn't happened yet is beyond me.

- Completely change the top honor talent row to reward juking, so if you juke someone and they waste their interrupt on you, that should proc some interrupt immunity for 5 seconds. Another talent could give you damage reduction, another one could give you an immunity to stuns as well. Those are just examples. Just let us use our PvP trinkets in instanced PvP instead of an entire honor talent row.

- Increase healing output of every single healer class, reintroduce baseline CC/stuns for every class and make healers killable via CC and stunlocks. Not through brute mongoloid damage.

- Reduce health pools, reduce damage back to WOTLK levels. Maybe this isn't possible so I would be okay with maybe MOP/WOD health and damage, I can't see a thing with all those huge millions popping up everywhere.

- Revert the goddamn pruning, give us our spells from WOTLK, give us our old talents system. They WORKED. If developers feel like they have to "leave their mark" then just change the names or something I don't care. Hell, you can change the icons if it makes you feel like you're "leaving your mark" in this game. Just stop trying to fix what isn't broken. Once you unprune our stuff, you can work from there without deleting any abilities. You can instead add more talents on top of it all, maybe make hybrid specs a thing again.

- Remove PvP templates, add resilience back in the game again. It won't only fix the ridiculous instagib damage in arenas right now due to the 50 traits being activated but it'll also fix the disgusting state of WPvP tremendously as the PvE players won't be able to oneshot based on item level.

- Activate trinkets in instanced PvP, like seriously. Why do we have trinkets again?

- Delete DH class.

- Bring back glyphs so we can further customize our gameplay style, and no, before you say it, those glyphs are cosmetic. I mean the REAL glyphs that allowed you to reduce CD on certain abilities or add a second charge to X ability etc etc.


And well, I've got more ideas but I don't wanna keep you guys reading any longer.

Goddamn, what a wall of text.

/mic drop.

[Stormspellz]

here's my tldr: game mechanics all across the board are mind numbing boring, still to much cd based gameplay, lack of moment by moment decision making: most games are predictable dance.

things to improve the game play?

-more spell choices in healing spells: right spell for right situation and less "rotate hots/totems, into filler heal spell" repeat.
-remove mana regen and bring back mana cds, but make sure they follow the old hym or plea structure, need to use them at the right time or they get wasted/have consequences

then you get into more geneneral all classes stuff, like stop the mobility arms race, cc+nuke in one ability, ect

[Deleted]

Imo, pvp would be way more enjoyable without healers (and tanks) at all.

Especially in non-rated, but I find them annoying in rated too. Too often did I have loooong arena matches because of them and it's tiresome.

[Stormspellz]

Imo, pvp would be way more enjoyable without healers (and tanks) at all.

Especially in non-rated, but I find them annoying in rated too. Too often did I have loooong arena matches because of them and it's tiresome.

thats a balance and mechanic issue not healer issue.

[xindralol]

/agreed
Legion healing is frustrating and the playstyle is just boring. I like the new animations for warriors but graphics only get you so far.

There is no 'reward' for outplaying your opponent because matches usually aren't decided by 'minute' details. Winning a game just means my teammates spammed their pve rotations with more furor than our opponents.

In prior expansions you could outplay your opponents and they did close to zero damage. In WoD you could minimize meaningful damage if you were much higher skilled.
Hell people did naked arenas in TBC and wrath. You could get your elite gear in last seasons' gear if you were good enough even late in the season.

[ONCHEhap]

PvP overall nowadays is just to who has the best spec,and who pops their burst CDs first;there's no much thought to PvP anymore

[Aryah]

Admittedly it would be nice to be rewarded for juking interrupts. The problem is that juking an interrupt costs you time and the melee know at some point you're just going to have to hard cast. So it costs you time and ultimately it costs them nothing to take turns interrupting you.

In threes against two melee it's quite a pain when you juke one only to be interrupted by the second because you absolutely had to cast.

In battlegrounds I do it all the time and even juke multiple melees to try interrupt me but it gets to a point where you just have to hard cast and you can be sure that melee number three and four will interrupt you.

When I say melee I suppose I'm including anything with an interrupt ability.

In saying this, it's not like your own team isn't able to do the same thing to their healers, so it's not like it's a balance issue. It just would make healing less frustrating and feel like there is some reward for juking.

[Deleted]

we have known since the launch of legion that pvp has been mainly based on how good your class dps burst is.

nothing has changed since Legion launch. why make thread after thread saying the same things in different ways.

[Jwowwxoxo]

If you are struggling as a resto druid in legion, you are doing something very wrong

[Aryah]

So something like giving all casters (all at least healers) a honor talent that grants them some kind of effect when they are hit by an interrupt ability while they are not casting? I mean it wouldn't even have to be an immunity to interrupts, it could even be varied (one class could get an immunity, one could get some kind of damage burst on whoever fucked up, maybe an OP heal that is only available after that trigger.

Well, let's say you're up against a single other class and you juke the interrupt. They've already been punished because you can now free cast for 15s. I wouldn't want them to be double punished by getting something over and above that.

The problem for me is that you have to juke up to three interrupts in arena and even more in battlegrounds. If someone misses an interrupt on you, I think you should have at least 5 or 10s of free casting regardless. Even just 5s free cast would be great.

[Banard]

, I've noticed something about PvP. It is horrendous towards healers

Once upon a time...people use to q up for random bg and come across this immortal healer that would not die....now its almost every healer in every random bg....so no......pvp isnt horrendous towards healers.

[Aryah]

Once upon a time...people use to q up for random bg and come across this immortal healer that would not die....now its almost every healer in every random bg....so no......pvp isnt horrendous towards healers.

People have always said this and I've always managed to solo healers. I've also always felt immortal as a healer. I'm not suggesting that I'm amazing, but rather that people just have to think about what they're doing when attacking healers.

Incidentally, stacking interrupts with multiple dps is a great way to kill a healer.

[Stormspellz]

Once upon a time...people use to q up for random bg and come across this immortal healer that would not die....now its almost every healer in every random bg....so no......pvp isnt horrendous towards healers.

always thought this mindset was so confusing, go into a bg undergeared and get two shot "oh well im just undergeared", can't pve a healer down, "omg healers so op". Back in the day you couldn't mindlessly pve on healer and kill them, now you can

[Banard]

always thought this mindset was so confusing, go into a bg undergeared and get two shot "oh well im just undergeared", can't pve a healer down, "omg healers so op". Back in the day you couldn't mindlessly pve on healer and kill them, now you can

back in the day you could not mindlessly kill a pve healer until they ran out of mana...which they did. Healers rarely run out mana these days.

Mindlessly kill a healer? now? What are you smoking? Rarely do i see a healer go down fast..if i do its that weird holy priest :S...as a BM hunter it is pointless to even attack a healer until a melee or two is on him.

It is one of the reasons why i hate random bgs...that and all the stuns and roots. random bgs are a shit show..prefer every other carnation of wow for random bgs then todays game.

[Deleted]

I decided to play a Resto Druid in Legion

You decided to get carry by your spec.

[GKLeatherCraft]

I have to ask, why do you feel compelled to keep insulting other players every sentence for what is clearly a design decision? The fact that melee is focusing down a healer means they are doing their job properly; they are supposed to shut you down after all. If they are too effective at it with little skill involved that does not mean they are less intelligent as people, it just means the design team failed.
Stop being angry at the players for being given better options than you and get angry at the designers for not supporting your preferred gameplay.

That's what I thought, This kid is obviously the one "frothing at the mouth" Trying to belittle and insult players for just doing what they're supposed to, Of course the healer gets targeted, Chill out bro

[socialmaker]

You should see how frustrating is to play disc + frost mage in 2's at around 1750-1800 rating. Every two game there's a DH/Resto, Warrior/resto, Warrior/sham, BM/resto that globales a mage and you can't put pressure, oom way harder because of the mongo dps.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Isn't it kind of established at this point they have pretty much given up on PVP. I mean you get like one map every 2 or 3 expansions and this time around just a grind system that just kinda happens. I can't be mad about it now. Years ago sure. But that time is so over.

[Deshi]

Isn't it kind of established at this point they have pretty much given up on PVP. I mean you get like one map every 2 or 3 expansions and this time around just a grind system that just kinda happens. I can't be mad about it now. Years ago sure. But that time is so over.

Who cares about pvp maps? I play pvp the have an enjoyable skillbased fight against another player. where it is doesnt matter!

[Bearilla]

I think it mainly depends on the healer. I have come across healers that are very hard to kill if I get the kill at all. A lot of the time they can stay alive long enough for reinforcements to arrive. That being said..... I blew up a shaman and priest last night. Poor guys didn't know what hit them.