It's not an arbitrary opinion. LOL! It's literally drawn from actual reactions to Blizzard's poor decisions. RNG upon RNG upon RNG with massive, open-ended grind never before seen in WoW. The reasons why it's too much or too little have been gone over hundreds, if not thousands, of times.
No, people simply say it is.
Nobody has given a single reason why a certain number is wrong.
If those have been stated specifically, show me that.
No, because each player has their own idea on that.
There is no "too much" or "too little" argument that has ever been more than arbitrary, subjective and personal.
Because anything based on a percentage, a chance, or expected to take a certain amount of time is going to be just that even from the design view.
Taking the progression to Concordance 1 in terms of any specific numerical measurement of repetition at maxed AK, say for example heroic dungeons, world quests, LFR bosses, etc.
How many of that should it take.
Can you tell me an exact number, and give me a good reason why that exact number is right.
If you cannot give me such a reason, then you have no argument beyond an arbitrary number.
Why is X amount of say dungeons too much, or too little.
Why is this number right.
i wonder if its really that hard concept for half of people here are bored to death with ap grind and just want get it done and forget about it for rest of expansion
yes we get it some of people get off from masochistic grinds but other dont - dont try to make grinds look like fun - beyond certain point they are not and never will be thats why people want ak 50 to not think about ap ever in future in this expansion
nope, blizzard said "we however changed it so once you reach 40 Ak, you can buy 40AK books for alts"
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by the time you get to AK 50 you allready have cordanance, i have it without really trying and im about to get 38
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you can easily get concordance with ak 40, it takes maybe a week max?
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yes because we should just tell blizzard to make gold 1000x easier to botain, and everything cost 1000x more gold
no problems right?
except no.
i play about 2-3 hours a day now that i work
during that time i do a weekly pug on a few heroic nighthold bosses
a few M+ to get a 10+
and i am 52,50,48
at AK50 you could get to concordance in less then a day, it was bullshit and uneeded
is it worth it? yes, because we can farm in just 10 more days from now instead of 60, TOS will be out in about 20-30 days, meaning people wouold be "forced" to farm before ToS, when they are at Ak 42 ish.
having Ak 40 instead of AK50 means ToS will be balanced around having AK 40 instead of AK50, meaning the first like 7-8 clears of ToS wont be fucking hell
We have it to provide options on character progression. We can either slowly(i mean SLOWLY) increase the power of our main spec no matter when we play, OR catch up alts/offspecs that are behind our main spec. It is incredibly easy to keep your offspec within ~3-5 artifact levels of your main. Assuming you are post CoL on both these specs (which as a raider you will be come ToS) thats atmost 1500 main stat at 30ish% uptime. So if a fight requires you to play an offspec your dps loss is barely anymore then an augment rune.... gammmmeeee breaking. Many dps specs gain < .3% dps per point in CoL, and the % increase actually degrades the more gear/points you have (you gain a fixed amount of main stat which is a smaller and smaller % of your total main stat resulting in the same flat dps increase but not the same % increase.)
This benefits us players by giving us options on how we play the game. I now can choose between min/maxing my main at a DR'd rate cause its artifact is high level or I can go catch up my alt and keep it competitive with my main.
Blizzard wants the points in CoL to be relevant but not to the extreme the paragon points were on release. Maybe they will decide the points are too strong/weak and they can adjust them again but thats a blizzard choice and you sure can talk to them about that and try to convince them of your stance. As for the AK level nerf... you aren't wrong in that it now takes time to get your reroll/alt to CoL but when in wow's history has it not taken time to get a fresh character up to par with mains in a raiding guild (without significant playtime because you can get CoL in days at AK 40). Sure it almost came to be with AK 50 pre ToS but it never did so you can't really use something that never hit live as an argument.
If you would just forget about the numbers in this game you wouldn't need to farm AP. I haven't ever farmed AP this expansion and I'm 2 points away from Concordance with 5 of my other altss not too far behind. Give AP a rest and go enjoy the game!
"You think more farming is benefiting players."
"No, I'm arguing that more stats from Concordance is benefiting players, and more so a full raid of people farming it, which is a statement that is true based on simple mathematical data."
I'm not confused; you're saying that farming is bad but farming benefits you.
You and your top-end ilk are the only ones farming or who care. The rest of us don't care AK is capped at 40 because Concordance is just something to dump points into, as Bliz intended. I'd go so far to argue that anyone not in the World First race shouldn't care, because what's the honest difference between a top 50 and top 500 guild outside of some bragging rights in a few circles?
Did you think we had forgotten? Did you think we had forgiven? Behold, now, the terrible vengeance of the Forsaken!
What's the problem? Most people already have concordance for their main spec and we're not even at AK40 yet. By the time ToS comes out everyone raiding N or above will have concordance in at least one spec.
I don't even play that much or farm AP and I already have concordance in my main spec.
I see no issue with this change.
Last edited by Saverem; 2017-05-26 at 09:09 PM.
"It's not what we don't know that gets us into trouble; it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." ~ Mark Twain
"The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time" ~ Jesus of Nazareth
"把它放在我的屁股,爸爸" ~ Dalai Lama
The requirements for any mythic raiding guild have always, and continue to be, determined by the benchmark set by other players. Blizzard tune the difficulty to challenge what they believe are the capabilities of the best players in the world. They have even outright stated that the final tuning of mythic raids is done according to where people are with their artifacts, not according to where Blizzard think they should be.
This argument that you *need* these ridiculous amounts of artifact power to complete certain content is fallacious. The game will give you enough gear, both through ilevel and AP, to down the bosses in time. The only question is, whether you'll do it faster than competing guilds.
Ultimately it's up to each guild to decide how much effort they are prepared to put in to compete in the race, and then to decide on the best way to spend that time to maximise their results. Historically I think a lot of the top players overemphasised the importance of getting as much artifact power as possible because every extra trait provided a measurable increase in power. The problem is none of these people seemingly stopped to think about whether the effort was worth the returns, or whether they could spend their time more productively. They all just rushed ahead, spent crazy amounts of time grinding AP to the max and then got bored when their AP was being wasted.
In short, a lot of players never applied their minds properly, managed their time poorly, compromised their own enjoyment of the game, and then decided that the AP system must be at fault.
Last edited by Raelbo; 2017-05-29 at 07:28 AM.