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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Louisa Bannon View Post
    Capitalism could be good, but I really don't know because we've never had that.

    What we have is a protectionist plutocracy where the laws are created to benefit the 1% at the expense of the 99%.

    Some bright spot will no doubt take offense at what I've asserted, but to that I simply ask: if I am wrong, then what is the purpose of Title 12 of the U.S. Federal Codes?
    Contrary to popular perception everyone on this forum isn't living in the US.
    I can see that there are similar issues in many countries - but to say that all western countries are protectionist plutocracies is overstating it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dukenukemx View Post
    Capitalism and socialism can work together, at least for a while. We live in a hybrid capitalism/socialism system already.
    This seems like a common misconception: the hybrid or "mixed economy" isn't necessarily a mix between capitalism and socialism - but a mix between capitalism and government interventions in terms of regulations, redistribution, and public ownership. Only the latter is socialism.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Forogil View Post
    I have read a few, that that's why I'm stating that capitalism hasn't caused hundred of millions of deaths of humans.

    And googling the above reminded me that it wasn't capitalism - but the corn laws that caused the Irish famine; they were later repealed - and the famines stopped in Ireland. Coincidence?
    That's somehow a really weird argument. When people starve under communism it is clearly the fault of communism but when people die/starve under capitalism the reasons for that are somehow more complex and have nothing to do with the system itself?
    Imperialism during the 19th century was all about the acquisition of new markets which was a consequence of industrial capitalism that emerged in Great Britain and later in other western countries. If you truly think that capitalism, a system that creates one crisis after the next, isn't responsible for hundreds of millions of deaths then you might want to read some history books (predominately social history).

  3. #123
    Its funny how the terms capitalism, socialism, and communism have become nonsense words. We cannot discuss any of them because people begin to argue the very definition of the words, and then others point how that we've never tried any of them and that we all have "mixed economies". Communism has never been tried, capitalism has never been tried, socialism has never truly been tried. I think it reflects the fact that people are terrified of taking a controversial stand on anything, so they divorce themselves from criticism by claiming the definition of words is wrong. In the end, it becomes impossible to discuss.

    I see it all as an eternal cycle, like life and death.

    You have a free market until corporations stop caring about the little guy. Then people decide the answer is to get rid of the free market and so they switch to government control. This new arrangement is ok until the government stops caring about the little guy. That leads to black markets popping up to fill in the gaps left by an uncaring government. Eventually the government falls and the black market emerges from the shadows and you get a free market economy again. The cycle then repeats.

    The problem is twofold:

    1. Corporations don't care about the little guy
    2. Government doesn't care about the little guy.
    Last edited by Kokolums; 2017-05-26 at 09:59 AM.
    TO FIX WOW:1. smaller server sizes & server-only LFG awarding satchels, so elite players help others. 2. "helper builds" with loom powers - talent trees so elite players cast buffs on low level players XP gain, HP/mana, regen, damage, etc. 3. "helper ilvl" scoring how much you help others. 4. observer games like in SC to watch/chat (like twitch but with MORE DETAILS & inside the wow UI) 5. guild leagues to compete with rival guilds for progression (with observer mode).6. jackpot world mobs.

  4. #124
    Capitalism is directly responsible for two wars in the XX century alone, and countless civil wars around the world. Capitalism cannot sustain itself without anarchy and pillaging on its outskirts. Capitalism has to die for the humanity and its civilization to survive.

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    That's somehow a really weird argument. When people starve under communism it is clearly the fault of communism but when people die/starve under capitalism the reasons for that are somehow more complex and have nothing to do with the system itself?
    When people starve under mercantilism - due to government interventions; and the people in favor of capitalism want to remove those laws.

    Yes it is hard to blame that on capitalism - when capitalist thinkers favored what was later the solution to the problem.


    When people starve and are killed under communism rulers - and many communist (and socialists) in other countries praise them (as was done with Soviet Russia and China under Mao), or Venezuela socialize most industries and are praised by socialists abroad (as in recent times) - and that leads to lots of problems - including alarming rates of infant mortality a few years later.

    Yes, it is natural to blame the communist and socialists for that - especially since the failures can be traced to be misguided and incorrect theories of Marx and others.

    However, it is not natural to blame anarchist or social democrats for those deaths - since they had already rejected some of the parts that led to the deaths. (Not saying that either of those ideologies are desirable - merely that neither they, nor capitalism, have been responsible for mass democides.)
    Last edited by Forogil; 2017-05-26 at 08:49 PM. Reason: Added

  6. #126
    It sucks. asdasd

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