7.2.5 Fury Guide & FAQ

[Juggernaught93]

To the people saying we're going to have to stick with the helm because the tier one has shitty stats, you know if we put the ring we don't have to wear the tier head

[Deleted]

To the people saying we're going to have to stick with the helm because the tier one has shitty stats, you know if we put the ring we don't have to wear the tier head

That is correct, but my point is that when you swap the helm for the ring you are not only giving up the legendary bonus (which is not an issue in this case), but also need a good replacement for the helm piece. The non-set helm from Antorus has Mastery/Versatility which are not really bad stats, but still mediocre. So in place of BIS-statted 1000 ilvl legendary you will need to get that helm or a very good titanforge on a helm from m+ dungeons.

Bottom line, I believe most of the time helm will outweigh other legendaries unless you are lucky with your tf non-set loot, and we should always sim and use the ring carefully.

[Deleted]

To the people saying we're going to have to stick with the helm because the tier one has shitty stats, you know if we put the ring we don't have to wear the tier head

That is correct, but my point is that when you swap the helm for the ring you are not only giving up the legendary bonus (which is not an issue in this case), but also need a good replacement for the helm piece. The non-set helm from Antorus has Mastery/Versatility which are not really bad stats, but still mediocre. So in place of BIS-statted 1000 ilvl legendary you will need to get that helm or a very good titanforge on a helm from m+ dungeons.

Bottom line: I believe most of the time helm will outweigh other legendaries unless you are lucky with your tf non-set loot, and we should always sim and use the ring carefully.

[Deleted]

Wondering what peoples opinions are on combination of Leg for AoE?

Naj + Ceann
Naj + Valarjar
or Naj + Kaz?

Thank you.

Edit: I just simmed Naj + Ceann vs Naj+Valarjar and Ceann was far behind even though replacing other items was a stat upgrade. Sound right?

[Archimtiros]

With stat allocation changes, will the legendary helmet still be useful seeing as the tier helmet got its mastery and haste swapped for crit and versa?
(I'm asking cause I STILL dont have the pants....)

Just won't use tier pants or helm, and will use a legendary + offpiece (or both legendaries without ring).

[Vertigo83]

Dear Archimtiros, i cannot define, which spec should I prepare for Anthorus. DPS is prioritised for me.
Is that true, that fury will be better for dps?
Set bonuses looks slightly better.
Or maybe there is any logs from PTR already exist?

[Specialka]

Do not forget Blizzard might do some tuning before the raid or slightly after.

[Archimtiros]

Dear Archimtiros, i cannot define, which spec should I prepare for Anthorus. DPS is prioritised for me.
Is that true, that fury will be better for dps?
Set bonuses looks slightly better.
Or maybe there is any logs from PTR already exist?

Tuning will change everything; as usual, making a determination before the fact is just a crapshoot. If you only care about playing the "best spec", the only thing you can do is be prepared to play both and swap at a moment's notice.

[AleksaMaster]

But fury will still have broken execute phase, so I guess arms is the way to go.

[Roiids]

Yeah I was pretty sad to see the helm stat changes. I have been using the helm for every tier. Was looking forward to a change.

Guess well see how everything shakes out soon.

[Archimtiros]

But fury will still have broken execute phase, so I guess arms is the way to go.

Not sure what you mean by that, Fury's execute phase gets even stronger with the inclusion of T21. The only time it's "broken" is when raid mechanics force Juggernaut to drop, which we haven't really been able to evaluate yet in Antorus.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah I was pretty sad to see the helm stat changes. I have been using the helm for every tier. Was looking forward to a change.

Guess well see how everything shakes out soon.

Also not sure what this means. T21 will use Shoulders, Cloak, Chest, Glove, with legendary Ring/Legs/Helm/Belt.

[Roiids]

Not sure what you mean by that, Fury's execute phase gets even stronger with the inclusion of T21. The only time it's "broken" is when raid mechanics force Juggernaut to drop, which we haven't really been able to evaluate yet in Antorus.

- - - Updated - - -



Also not sure what this means. T21 will use Shoulders, Cloak, Chest, Glove, with legendary Ring/Legs/Helm/Belt.

For a while it appeared legendary legs/ring would be BIS setup. Now with the helm being poop stats, the legendary helm is back in conversation. However also stating i have not simmed stuff yet for T21.

[Aivenarion]

Is it high time to start investing into Fury, learning the spec and farm legendaries? I'm quite new to the Warrior and have played only Arms so far

[Archimtiros]

For a while it appeared legendary legs/ring would be BIS setup. Now with the helm being poop stats, the legendary helm is back in conversation. However also stating i have not simmed stuff yet for T21.

Like I said, it doesn't really matter, since you won't use tier legs or helm regardless of legendary choice.

Legendary helm and legs have always been roughly equivalent; while the helm has better stats, its effect is also weaker. The only important distinction between the two is which allows you to equip better off-pieces.

[Jastall]

Is it high time to start investing into Fury, learning the spec and farm legendaries? I'm quite new to the Warrior and have played only Arms so far

It's impossible to know which spec will be better at this point. Number tuning, trinkets, T21 set bonuses, nerfs to T20 set bonuses, Legendary interaction, boss types, there are way too many variables to call. So for now I'd say try both (the required stats and gear aren't very different), see which one you prefer, and stick with it until Antorus releases. If you then want to switch, you'd best to do so at the beginning of a tier.

[Deleted]

Anyone else is sick of CoF? I mean, the trinket itself is awesome, but having one gear slot locked for 3 patches kind of blows. Just watched the latest Kelade's video - if his sims are correct, then even post-nerf CoF is still pretty much BiS except for the new "legendary" trinket.

[Jastall]

Anyone else is sick of CoF? I mean, the trinket itself is awesome, but having one gear slot locked for 3 patches kind of blows. Just watched the latest Kelade's video - if his sims are correct, then even post-nerf CoF is still pretty much BiS except for the new "legendary" trinket.

Yeah I'm annoyed that the raid trinkets are so incredibly terrible and the best ones are 1) a drop from two tiers ago and 2) a glorified stat stick that literally everyone is going to want, only dropping from the final boss.

Plus the effects aren't terrible interesting. I remember the cooldown-reducing ones from SoO, or the Worldbreaker's Shard/Drinking Horn from HFC. A stat stick feels so boring compared to these. I'd have liked for stuff like Gorsalach's Legacy to actually be good.

I mean obviously it's subject to change but underwhelming raid trinkets has been a clear trend this expansion, and Blizzard doubled down on overpowered stat sticks even.

[Archimtiros]

Yeah I'm annoyed that the raid trinkets are so incredibly terrible and the best ones are 1) a drop from two tiers ago and 2) a glorified stat stick that literally everyone is going to want, only dropping from the final boss.

Plus the effects aren't terrible interesting. I remember the cooldown-reducing ones from SoO, or the Worldbreaker's Shard/Drinking Horn from HFC. A stat stick feels so boring compared to these. I'd have liked for stuff like Gorsalach's Legacy to actually be good.

I mean obviously it's subject to change but underwhelming raid trinkets has been a clear trend this expansion, and Blizzard doubled down on overpowered stat sticks even.

I don't agree.

First off, Khaz'goroth poops on Aman'thuls for Fury, and while there's no clearly overpowered on-use trinket, the others aren't really terrible either.

Second, I don't think raid trinkets have been underwhelming this expansion by any means, between Draught, CoF, Moonglaives, and now Pantheon trinkets (just to name the good ones) are all a match for EDH (which I'd actually call a fairly boring trinket, mechanically speaking) or Archimonde trinkets. If you include the ones that aren't good specifically for Fury, there are plenty more interesting or unique trinkets this expansion, and in fact all Tomb trinkets all have fairly unique gimmicks attached to them.

[Jastall]

I don't agree.

First off, Khaz'goroth poops on Aman'thuls for Fury, and while there's no clearly overpowered on-use trinket, the others aren't really terrible either.

Second, I don't think raid trinkets have been underwhelming this expansion by any means, between Draught, CoF, Moonglaives, and now Pantheon trinkets (just to name the good ones) are all a match for EDH (which I'd actually call a fairly boring trinket, mechanically speaking) or Archimonde trinkets. If you include the ones that aren't good specifically for Fury, there are plenty more interesting or unique trinkets this expansion, and in fact all Tomb trinkets all have fairly unique gimmicks attached to them.

Well I based my evaluation of the trinkets off the video. If Khaz'goroth is better than the stat stick it's something at least.

But still, Arcanocrystal (860) being better than most raid trinkets at ilvl 930 is ridiculous. I'd rather see a situation where the best trinkets come from the current raid, alongside perhaps high M+ ones. I like the effect of Convergence but our 2nd best trinket in Antorus shouldn't drop from Nighthold too.

And stat sticks shouldn't even be good IMO, they definitely should be inferior to trinkets with effects. All the rest of our gear is stat sticks. Trinkets should be those with on-use effects, or passives that change the way you play a bit. And I don't have much hope for Antorus trinkets save for the Path of the Titans ones since none of them have a solid on-use effect so syncing them with Battle Cry is all but impossible most of the time.

[Archimtiros]

Well I based my evaluation of the trinkets off the video. If Khaz'goroth is better than the stat stick it's something at least.

But still, Arcanocrystal (860) being better than most raid trinkets at ilvl 930 is ridiculous. I'd rather see a situation where the best trinkets come from the current raid, alongside perhaps high M+ ones. I like the effect of Convergence but our 2nd best trinket in Antorus shouldn't drop from Nighthold too.

And stat sticks shouldn't even be good IMO, they definitely should be inferior to trinkets with effects. All the rest of our gear is stat sticks. Trinkets should be those with on-use effects, or passives that change the way you play a bit. And I don't have much hope for Antorus trinkets save for the Path of the Titans ones since none of them have a solid on-use effect so syncing them with Battle Cry is all but impossible most of the time.

I assume you mean Kelade's video, in which case you've got to be joking. The kid is a hack who got his youtube following for plagiarizing my guides, and his "content" has taken a sharp nosedive ever since he was called out on it. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but I will point out that his T21 sims are completely wrong, with the majority of the trinkets not even being used (given that they're not actually implemented in the currently public versions of SimC, I should be an update within the next week to fix that), so the trinkets in his bar graphs aren't actually dealing any damage - that's why you see such a slight increase over no-trinket, because the sim is only evaluating the stat change without any effect!

I'd also point out that a very similar video was made for T20, which said that Cinders and Engine of Eradication were going to be the top two trinkets for Fury, based off woefully inaccurate testing (read: smacking a dummy for about 2m with similarly broken simulations to back up the erroneous claims), and when asked in relation to my findings that Moonglavies was an "AoE only" trinket, a position which wasn't reversed until a good three weeks after the tier released. So... good luck with that source.


Anyway, 860 Arcano is not better than most trinkets at 930, and certainly not better than the ones Fury prioritizes. I'll grant that it is better than a lot of trinkets, but not at that pronounced of an ilvl difference, and getting one at a competitive ilevel is progressively harder as ilevel increases. At any rate, I don't think you'll find anyone argue that Arcanocrystal is in any way balanced or a well-designed trinket; it should have been taken out back and shot ages ago for all the contention it causes.




Lastly, I wouldn't worry about CoF right now; there's still a lot of iteration to be done, especially once the raid tuning happens (as in every tier). Also, Forgefiend's Fabricator (Fire Mines) is sleeper OP right now; it's a bit tricky to use, but if you want a strong on-use trinket in Antorus, that's it.