Page 11 of 11 FirstFirst ...
9
10
11
  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Of course you are, I'm very consistent in what I say, read again from the beginning. My statements are facts.

    You listed two raids of different size from a single expansion and then say raids were 1 size and those raids invalidate my statement that raids weren't 1 size as you demonstrated by listing two raids of different sizes.

    And while you're at it you moved the goal post again. Now it's about the SAME raid having different versions of different sizes. Do you ever tire?
    There we are. That is YOU moving goal posts. Your statement was factually wrong. You never mentioned expansions, you only mentioned raids. You are lumping them together.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Raids never were 1 size
    This is factually not true. Don't try to weasel your way out.

    As i proved there were raids with 1 size and 1 difficulty. You are the one that needs to move the goal post or learn to understand what you are saying.
    What is even the point of lumping all raids together and say they never had only one size, like making an average of some sort? You must've been knee deep on something to come to that thought. Raids exist as single raids. Single raids have had single sizes. Different raids have had the same size (kharazan and zul'aman for example) and different sizes. There is just no defense or logic to that statement you made... unless you move the goalpost... wich you must to make it have any sense.
    Last edited by Nemmar; 2017-06-20 at 09:58 AM.

  2. #202
    Both 10 and 25 HC. They was better than Mythic.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    Both 10 and 25 HC. They was better than Mythic.
    No they weren't... 10HC was always either easier or harder than 25HC. You can't have a well-tuned raid when you have only 10 people (i.e., 10 classes max) in a raid. I'd be OK-ish with bringing 25 back for Mythic, but even that will be difficult because of current roster sizes.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Socronoss View Post
    No they weren't... 10HC was always either easier or harder than 25HC. You can't have a well-tuned raid when you have only 10 people (i.e., 10 classes max) in a raid. I'd be OK-ish with bringing 25 back for Mythic, but even that will be difficult because of current roster sizes.
    This has never caused problems during 5 years, you have to stop telling shit.

    If you love the current Mythic its your problem, that does not mean that its necessarily the best difficulty ever.

    That the 10 is more or less easy compared to the 25, its annecdotic, especially when the management of the raid is not at all the same. In the end its especially that all the guilds could do HC, at present how much cannot because of the fact that its strictly 20 fucking man ?

    How many 10HC Guild have closed doors because of 20M raid size and management?
    How many 25HC Guild have closed doors because of 20M difficulty ?

    The Mythic is cool, but its far from the old HC which were globally more interesting.
    The fact that it is more difficult that both 10/25HC doesnt make it better.

    This changes are just the more stupid from blizzard, with the suppression of the reforge.
    Last edited by SinarisMW; 2017-06-20 at 10:33 AM.

  5. #205
    The Lightbringer Otiswhitaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    3,363
    I'd rather they let non-mythic raids scale down to 8 players and let dungeons scale up to 8-10 players.

  6. #206
    My guild would loooooove 10 man mythic. We're fairly casual, and have only about 15 people who are up to mythic standards and are tired of recruiting assholes who just gear up with us in HC, only to bail after. With M10 we could do mythic and even have backups. With that being said , i do want m20 to stay for those for whom it's a better fit.

    Thx to Winter Blossom for the awesome sig

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    This has never caused problems during 5 years, you have to stop telling shit.
    Yeah, this was just the most-often posted issue of "10-mans don't count as WF", "25HC is the only WF difficulty that counts", etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    If you love the current Mythic its your problem, that does not mean that its necessarily the best difficulty ever.
    Technically, that is YOUR problem, as Blizzard has decided to make that the current version of raiding. You want it differently, so not really MY problem

    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    That the 10 is more or less easy compared to the 25, its annecdotic, especially when the management of the raid is not at all the same. In the end its especially that all the guilds could do HC, at present how much cannot because of the fact that its strictly 20 fucking man ?
    That's more because of falsely put guild-pride. There is enough raiders out there to organize 20-person raid groups, you just have to merge with others. We did that at the end of MoP and it worked out quite nicely.

    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    How many 10HC Guild have closed doors because of 20M raid size and management?
    How many 25HC Guild have closed doors because of 20M difficulty ?
    Does it matter? A bit like in real life: Adapt or die All that did was allocating those that still wanted to raid to other guilds that were actually able to do the organization and roster of the required 20-man raid.

    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    The Mythic is cool, but its far from the old HC which were globally more interesting.
    The fact that it is more difficult that both 10/25HC doesnt make it better.
    It's personal preference. For me, the fact that current Mythic is more difficult than the previous 10/25HC (which is debatable also) does make it better. I like the challenge. If it is too difficult for you, then why not stick to heroic. There you can easily do a 10-man raid.

    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    This changes are just the more stupid from blizzard, with the suppression of the reforge.
    Reforge wouldn't work with the current loot system where you actually discard 99% of your drops anyway. They went away from "reforging few drops" and towards "getting a lot of drops and select those that are best for you".

    Lastly, you're a bit late with your feedback on raid size given that these changes have already been done in the end of MoP/beginning of WoD. Basically I could use your argument from the beginning: It has worked for 3+ years now.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    There we are. That is YOU moving goal posts. Your statement was factually wrong. You never mentioned expansions, you only mentioned raids. You are lumping them together.
    How am I moving goal posts if I say the SAME thing over and over again?
    It is YOU who does the whole "no true Scotsman" routine, because apparently you cannot be mistaken.
    I was not talking about different sizes for the same raid as you tried to shift the goal post. I was talking about RAIDS, that were of different sizes in each expansion and vanilla. There was never a case of "all raids same size" - as was implied by the poster I was replying too, why did you even feel the need to barge into that - that's beyond my understanding. But here we are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    Don't try to weasel your way out.
    Says the weasel.
    All right, gentlemen, let's review. The year is 2017 - that's two-zero-one-seven, as in the 21st Century - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of robed sissies.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    How am I moving goal posts if I say the SAME thing over and over again?
    It is YOU who does the whole "no true Scotsman" routine, because apparently you cannot be mistaken.
    I was not talking about different sizes for the same raid as you tried to shift the goal post. I was talking about RAIDS, that were of different sizes in each expansion and vanilla. There was never a case of "all raids same size" - as was implied by the poster I was replying too, why did you even feel the need to barge into that - that's beyond my understanding. But here we are.


    Says the weasel.
    Even if that was the case, every raid in vanilla and in tbc had a fixed raid size. So what you said is wrong in so many ways that there really isn't much to say. You went for shock value with that statement but it is simply incorrect no matter how you look at it because you didnt specify.
    But alas, given you went as far as to make such a ridiculous statement in an effort to win an argument, i don't expect you to recognise your mistake. I pointed it out, it's done.

  10. #210
    I enjoyed 10 man raiding at the highest level.

    That said, I don't really raid at the highest level (mythic), I top out at Heroic at most and the Flex system works better for the more casual playstyle that me and my buddies play with.
    Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler
    Q: But who are the forum QQers going to QQ at now?
    A: They'll find another name and still miss the point that Blizzard designs as a collective.

  11. #211
    The Lightbringer Lilija's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Częstochowa Poland
    Posts
    3,878
    Quote Originally Posted by SinarisMW View Post
    Both 10 and 25 HC. They was better than Mythic.
    No, they weren't.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDeeGee View Post
    Used to Raid 10 Man Progression, it was a lot more fun than 25 and felt more like a little family. Also due to being just 10 everyone knew eachothers actions. I also liked that there was no room for error unlike in 25 Man where you could play half sleeping.

    Do i want it back? I honestly don't care anymore as i quit raiding in 2014 after 7 years non-stop ^^
    Yeah, back in WOTLK when I raided 25 and 10, I liked the 10man group a lot more...we ended up progressing far more than the 25 group, because the 25 group was carrying a good deal of under-performers, and eventually broke up due to drama, while the 10man group stayed strong.
    Guide for setting up VuhDo to track shields/absorbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Haekke View Post
    LFR is not really easy. I would say it's a lot harder thant Mythic Dungeons
    get_a_load_of_this_guy_cam.jpg

  13. #213
    Legendary! SL1200's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Chicago Illinois.
    Posts
    6,781
    One of the things In wow that I hope they never change again. Mythic should be 20 man only. All other difficulties should flex. It is perfect as it is.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    Yeah, back in WOTLK when I raided 25 and 10, I liked the 10man group a lot more...we ended up progressing far more than the 25 group, because the 25 group was carrying a good deal of under-performers, and eventually broke up due to drama, while the 10man group stayed strong.
    Perfect example of player looking for easy mode mythic. Don't do it blizzard.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by SL1200 View Post
    Perfect example of player looking for easy mode mythic. Don't do it blizzard.
    .........?

    How the fuck is my post "looking for easy mode" ?

    10man was HARDER because there was less room for error, less room for carrying, and a single person dying would be a wipe most of the time.
    Guide for setting up VuhDo to track shields/absorbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Haekke View Post
    LFR is not really easy. I would say it's a lot harder thant Mythic Dungeons
    get_a_load_of_this_guy_cam.jpg

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Socronoss View Post
    No they weren't... 10HC was always either easier or harder than 25HC. You can't have a well-tuned raid when you have only 10 people (i.e., 10 classes max) in a raid. I'd be OK-ish with bringing 25 back for Mythic, but even that will be difficult because of current roster sizes.
    If 10-mans were, variably, more or less difficult than 25-mans... why is the automatic assumption that 10-man is the culprit when it comes to the ability, or lack thereof, to create "well-tuned raid(s)"? This should be a double-edged sword, because it's easily possible for 25-mans to be easier and in many cases (especially, the important ones, like virtually every final boss) this was exactly the case.

    Silly position is silly.

  16. #216
    I wouldn't mind it as it fits my current guild roster atm. However, 10 iterations of previous raids have been historically easier than their 25m counterpart. Chances are 10m mythic will follow the same suit and simply destroy the 20m balance.

    If it's viable, then sure. But mathematically, I'm not seeing it. IMHO, the whole tanking scene could use a small rework beyond the 2 tank staple.
    The wise wolf who's pride is her wisdom isn't so sharp as drunk.

  17. #217
    No, I don't.

  18. #218
    I would actually love having 10 man raid sizes back. Some of the best times I've had in WoW were doing 10 man raids. To me, I felt more connected to my raid-mates when there were only 10 of us, it was also easier for us to see who is doing what wrong (and in turn, work together to fix mistakes and become better from it)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •