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  1. #21
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Raiju View Post
    Except the way loot systems work now that isn't relevant to the fact it was mailed to the shaman.

    Even in a mythic raid now if you do a boss with less than 20 you may get less loot (and at 15 you will get less). The shaman shouldn't get mailed that piece even if it was assigned to his place in the group, he should just not get loot for leaving.

    I can see *an argument* for being kicked, but even then with how the loot system works regardless of the fact those few who will kick others just to waste their time are extremely few that we shouldn't be rewarding the rest who get kicked legitimately.
    Rather unquires should be had against those specific people and their ability to do dungeons for lets say a 3 month period

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    Quote Originally Posted by xcess View Post
    Well dont continue next time and redo the key. Why did he leav ? random DC? you guys were bad and he rage quit? I dont do mythic+ for loot anymore, mainly just for the weekly chest so would be happy just to get it done. I been pugging and usually never have ppl leave. I can easily find another grp anyway
    The key would drop a level though. Not an ideal situation if you where hoping to do a +15 for example

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Raiju View Post
    Except the way loot systems work now that isn't relevant to the fact it was mailed to the shaman.
    Everyone is just assuming that the loot was mailed to the shaman,. which is simply not true. Loot was not mailed to the shaman.

    The loot system assigns 5 slots for loot to drop (regardless of the number of players in group) and if you don't have a person in that slot then that piece of loot simply does not drop.

    This has been shown/confirmed by multiple people solo-ing dungeons. Solo clearing dungeons does not guarantee that you get both pieces of loot, which would be the case if loot had to be assigned to an eligible group member.

  3. #23
    The Lightbringer msdos's Avatar
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    I think the ilvl of the loot that drops from a +15 is kinda low considering how disastrous some of the runs can be.
    The ilvl from heroic raid and +15 doesn't make sense to me at all actually. Heroic raiding is easier than these keystones yet I'm getting better gear from it, other than the weekly.

    I think they made the gap between Mythic raid and Heroic rewards much larger to try and appease Mythic raiders.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparklelord View Post
    Very constructive. Thanks. But seriously it was a 4 man group of friends and we pugged a 5th. Honestly don't care that he left, I'm just pissed that he got loot.




    No, he definitely got credit. He's on my +15 completion for the week. and as Seidhe said, he surely got it in the mailbox.



    He straight up left the group. No one to uninvite.

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    I'm going to bed. This whole experience has left a bad taste in my mouth. The mythic+ system is such trash...
    How is it not constructive? It is the best and most effective solution to your problem. Yes blizzard can change everything you don't like, but until they do, what are you going to do? Complain on forums or be sure that you have successful runs?

  5. #25
    You got 1 loot because you depleted the key.
    Not true, you alwasy get at least 2 pieces of loot from a 15

  6. #26
    The Patient SherriMayim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparklelord View Post
    Just had to 4 man a +15 BRH cause one of the dps left after 2nd boss. So we spent an hour+ 4 manning this shit hole and we finally beat it and low and behold, only one piece of loot. So, this means the 2nd piece of loot went to the shaman who abandoned or group.

    So not only does this fuck head get a +15 weekly chest credit for doing basically nothing, he also gets a piece of loot out of the chest? Great system blizzard. Really great.

    Git gud at pugging?

    Chances are you guys wiped enough that he bailed out of frustration. Sucks but thats what happens when your group tries to tackle content out of its league.

    Should have reset the key

  7. #27
    Please wait Temp name's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Svisalith View Post
    Not true, you alwasy get at least 2 pieces of loot from a 15
    Unless one of the pieces of loot was assigned to the group member not present in the run, which means it just simply didn't generate a 2nd piece of loot.
    Try and solo anything with personal loot, you're not guaranteed an item from every boss, even though if you were a full group, 1 item would drop per boss.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Emancptr View Post
    Everyone is just assuming that the loot was mailed to the shaman,. which is simply not true. Loot was not mailed to the shaman.
    My wife was in a + with some of our friends, at the very start, when our internet went out. They finished, and when she was able to get back in she had loot in the mail, credit, AND her key upgraded. If you're there when the key starts, you're eligible for loot.

    The loot system assigns 5 slots for loot to drop (regardless of the number of players in group) and if you don't have a person in that slot then that piece of loot simply does not drop.

    This has been shown/confirmed by multiple people solo-ing dungeons. Solo clearing dungeons does not guarantee that you get both pieces of loot, which would be the case if loot had to be assigned to an eligible group member.
    None of this has anything to do, at all, with proving or disproving that you are eligible for loot if you're there for the key start. I mean I don't think this was an intentional thing by Blizzard, it's just something kinda messed up that happens as a consequence to protections put in to make sure you can't boot people at the very end to keep all the loot. But the rate at which you guys are bending over backward and just making things up to "prove" that something unfair can't happen in the game is hilarious.

    Blizzard is not infallible.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by TSThrillwell View Post
    My wife was in a + with some of our friends, at the very start, when our internet went out. They finished, and when she was able to get back in she had loot in the mail, credit, AND her key upgraded. If you're there when the key starts, you're eligible for loot.
    This is completely different than being kicked. She was probably still in the group and "in the dungeon" according to Blizzard. And the keystone is different than loot. That will upgrade/downgrade only based on the completion of the dungeon, nothing else.



    Quote Originally Posted by TSThrillwell View Post
    None of this has anything to do, at all, with proving or disproving that you are eligible for loot if you're there for the key start. I mean I don't think this was an intentional thing by Blizzard, it's just something kinda messed up that happens as a consequence to protections put in to make sure you can't boot people at the very end to keep all the loot. But the rate at which you guys are bending over backward and just making things up to "prove" that something unfair can't happen in the game is hilarious.
    We're not making excuses. I can go run a dungeon right now and prove to you that this is not the way that it works.

    Loot eligibility is 100% determined at the end of the dungeon and has no connection to the number of players at the start of the dungeon. Where some people get confused is kicking people on the last boss, but before the 1 minute "get out of wrong instance timer" has completed. A person in that situation (not in group, but still in dungeon) is eligible for loot.

    In every other situation of 1-4 manning a dungeon the loot is rolled as if 5 people were in the dungeon on personal loot. Meaning the roll can hit an empty slot and not drop loot at all.
    Last edited by Emancptr; 2017-08-12 at 03:23 PM.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by msdos View Post
    I think the ilvl of the loot that drops from a +15 is kinda low considering how disastrous some of the runs can be.
    The ilvl from heroic raid and +15 doesn't make sense to me at all actually. Heroic raiding is easier than these keystones yet I'm getting better gear from it, other than the weekly.

    I think they made the gap between Mythic raid and Heroic rewards much larger to try and appease Mythic raiders.
    It does cos you can have unlimited chance at mythic+ loot where as you only get one chance at raid loot per week. Should be doing like close to +20 now anyway with the extra gear

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Emancptr View Post
    Everyone is just assuming that the loot was mailed to the shaman,. which is simply not true. Loot was not mailed to the shaman.

    The loot system assigns 5 slots for loot to drop (regardless of the number of players in group) and if you don't have a person in that slot then that piece of loot simply does not drop.

    This has been shown/confirmed by multiple people solo-ing dungeons. Solo clearing dungeons does not guarantee that you get both pieces of loot, which would be the case if loot had to be assigned to an eligible group member.
    I explained that myself, but likewise I can confirm that someone outside the M+ will get mailed loot.

    Both things are correct here.

    They made 'mailing' loot a lot more generous since .2.5, we've had people who left a raid (different example I know) after avatar, showing double offline and their character no longer in the instance, be mailed loot after the KJ kill (personal loot). As mentioned every system now works off this so even a guild master loot mythic raid will scale loot based on available people. I am unsure whether an outside eligible 20th can receive via personal when a loot is taken off the main ML pool though (so only 3 in a mythic raid)
    Last edited by Raiju; 2017-08-12 at 04:14 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    which is kind of like saying "of COURSE you can't see the unicorns, unicorns are invisible, silly."

  12. #32
    M+ is terribly designed. I avoid it for the most part.
    TO FIX WOW:1. smaller server sizes & server-only LFG awarding satchels, so elite players help others. 2. "helper builds" with loom powers - talent trees so elite players cast buffs on low level players XP gain, HP/mana, regen, damage, etc. 3. "helper ilvl" scoring how much you help others. 4. observer games like in SC to watch/chat (like twitch but with MORE DETAILS & inside the wow UI) 5. guild leagues to compete with rival guilds for progression (with observer mode).6. jackpot world mobs.

  13. #33
    There are some great points being made. I'll post a thorough response later. Thanks

  14. #34
    Loot eligibility is 100% determined at the end of the dungeon and has no connection to the number of players at the start of the dungeon. Where some people get confused is kicking people on the last boss, but before the 1 minute "get out of wrong instance timer" has completed. A person in that situation (not in group, but still in dungeon) is eligible for loot.
    That's not true. The loot eligibility, run participants, etc. for keystone dungeons are all locked in at the start of the run. If someone leaves and the dungeon is completed, they are still eligible for loot, and it will get mailed to them.
    Last edited by Topher; 2017-08-14 at 04:33 PM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    M+ is terribly designed. I avoid it for the most part.
    Same here. I really miss the Challenge Modes. The reward system was better. I could target what dungeon i wanted to do with no stupid key depletion. No randomness. If i wanted to play Diablo, i would. Keep it out of WoW.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparklelord View Post
    If you think the system is fine you're off your rocker. It's terrible and it can be really good sometimes. But it's still fucked.
    It is fine, you are just upset because some one left your group. For a vast majority of dungeon completions the system works perfectly.
    The bigger issue is there is no punishment for leavers. Like I said, the loot changes have unintentional side effects concerning smaller groups. Soloing 15s should yield two automatic peices

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hotsforyou View Post
    Same here. I really miss the Challenge Modes. The reward system was better. I could target what dungeon i wanted to do with no stupid key depletion. No randomness. If i wanted to play Diablo, i would. Keep it out of WoW.
    Except that you would have a 0 percent chance to get gear. I'm not in love with the keystones system either but you can't compare cms to m+ in terms of rewards. It's not the same in any way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    M+ is terribly designed. I avoid it for the most part.
    This is not relevant to what is being discussed here. This is a problem with the loot system present in every type of content.
    Owner of ONEAzerothTV
    Tanking, Blood DK Mythic+ Pugging, Soloing and WoW Challenges alongside other discussions about all things in World of Warcraft
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  17. #37
    he left.. doesnt get credit. it happens stop whining

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by xcess View Post
    It does cos you can have unlimited chance at mythic+ loot where as you only get one chance at raid loot per week. Should be doing like close to +20 now anyway with the extra gear
    see this is one huge lie of mythic + - your chances are limited by the time you have to put into game - yes if you are not working basement dweller looser sure you can put 100 hours a week into mythic + - but most people have life and cant put more then 10-12 hours a week into farming them - and this woudl give them if they are lucky 10 runs max

    blizzard did it for one reason - they raiding participation dropped dramatickly so they once again like in WoD screwed eveyrone else to save their faces - because it was painfully obviously hsowing that people do not want to raid in mmorpgs and all those years pushing them into raids by force were wasted.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebalina View Post
    No he doesn't get either the loot nor the credit.

    He left mid run.
    You got 1 loot because you depleted the key.
    Yes in theory the 2nd piece of loot should of gone to the shaman but he will not get it as he wasn't there.
    He actually DOES receive credit and in fact will get a weekly 15 chest now.

  20. #40
    Deleted
    Why not just leave the dungeon, find a new 5th, do the 14 then the 15? Would probably have taken less time if it took you over an hour to 4man the BRH, and you also get 6 items instead of 2(1 since the leaver got 1).

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