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  1. #281
    I dont really want to spill the beans on the AP trick.... but its the command center order hall quests

    you can saddle whitemane (since shes garbage) and Meatball with 20-25-30% mission duration time reduction and leave them inactive until the command center is up, then also save a 20-25% time duration reduction for Koltira.

    This allows you to get the commander center "super" AP token qquest down to 4hr 16 minutes and you can do it 4-5 times a day along with just 200%ing the normal AP order hall missions.

    can be done completely from your phone and its the equivalent of running 20 mythic+s daily, then deactivate meatball/whitemane when the building is down and re-slot Koltira for normal use.

    That is the secret to stocking pilling AP without even trying

    currently my Unholy weapon is 75 Blood 72 Frost 70 and i was running three M+ a week, you can insult people for having high lvled weapons or you can figure out how its done

    choice is yours...
    Last edited by Baddok21; 2017-11-09 at 10:01 PM.

  2. #282
    Quote Originally Posted by Piz813 View Post
    I agree with a lot of this. But within the past few weeks I see others topping me and reason being is they have all 3 traits on all 3 relics while I have 2 2 2 ... if they roll a good crucible , say a VP relic and 3rd trait is darkest crusade, they will excel naturally

    - - - Updated - - -

    Every incarnation of this game for 12 years one could do both specs. Not in Legion as I learned the hard way. Can't focus on both or you'll be behind like me
    How much behind are we talking about ? 1% ? 2% ? If you get benched because of that, tough luck. If I were you, I'd either be glad that I can do as much dps as your other "friend" or I'd just quit that guild.

    You know what ? It's silly that 1 more trait could make a big difference. There's simply no way this guy got a better DPS because of this. There's no way you're playing unholy perfectly. But hey, what do I know ?...

    Hopefully you're still having fun with this game because, for me, that's making it too far, or like I said before, it's silly.

  3. #283
    Quote Originally Posted by Baddok21 View Post
    I dont really want to spill the beans on the AP trick.... but its the command center order hall quests

    you can saddle whitemane (since shes garbage) and Meatball with 20-25-30% mission duration time reduction and leave them inactive until the command center is up, then also save a 20-25% time duration reduction for Koltira.

    This allows you to get the commander center "super" AP token qquest down to 4hr 16 minutes and you can do it 4-5 times a day along with just 200%ing the normal AP order hall missions.

    can be done completely from your phone and its the equivalent of running 20 mythic+s daily, then deactivate meatball/whitemane when the building is down and re-slot Koltira for normal use.

    That is the secret to stocking pilling AP without even trying

    currently my Unholy weapon is 75 Blood 72 Frost 70 and i was running three M+ a week, you can insult people for having high lvled weapons or you can figure out how its done

    choice is yours...
    You put Whitemane, Meatball, and you get 100%?

  4. #284
    yup also have 5/5 of meatball 20% buff and 5/5 of Thassarian 20% buff

    but rarely ever need them

    you basically have 4 days to prepare inbetween buildings comming up, but meatball also has 75% bonus to all regular boss types (unholy/blood/frost)

  5. #285
    Bloodsail Admiral Piz813's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiz View Post
    How much behind are we talking about ? 1% ? 2% ? If you get benched because of that, tough luck. If I were you, I'd either be glad that I can do as much dps as your other "friend" or I'd just quit that guild.

    You know what ? It's silly that 1 more trait could make a big difference. There's simply no way this guy got a better DPS because of this. There's no way you're playing unholy perfectly. But hey, what do I know ?...

    Hopefully you're still having fun with this game because, for me, that's making it too far, or like I said before, it's silly.
    I'm frost. You need a kotex? Sure sounds like it

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Baddok21 View Post
    I dont really want to spill the beans on the AP trick.... but its the command center order hall quests

    you can saddle whitemane (since shes garbage) and Meatball with 20-25-30% mission duration time reduction and leave them inactive until the command center is up, then also save a 20-25% time duration reduction for Koltira.

    This allows you to get the commander center "super" AP token qquest down to 4hr 16 minutes and you can do it 4-5 times a day along with just 200%ing the normal AP order hall missions.

    can be done completely from your phone and its the equivalent of running 20 mythic+s daily, then deactivate meatball/whitemane when the building is down and re-slot Koltira for normal use.

    That is the secret to stocking pilling AP without even trying

    currently my Unholy weapon is 75 Blood 72 Frost 70 and i was running three M+ a week, you can insult people for having high lvled weapons or you can figure out how its done

    choice is yours...
    Haven't used her since 7.0 thank you for sharing!

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by Baddok21 View Post
    I dont really want to spill the beans on the AP trick.... but its the command center order hall quests

    you can saddle whitemane (since shes garbage) and Meatball with 20-25-30% mission duration time reduction and leave them inactive until the command center is up, then also save a 20-25% time duration reduction for Koltira.

    This allows you to get the commander center "super" AP token qquest down to 4hr 16 minutes and you can do it 4-5 times a day along with just 200%ing the normal AP order hall missions.

    can be done completely from your phone and its the equivalent of running 20 mythic+s daily, then deactivate meatball/whitemane when the building is down and re-slot Koltira for normal use.

    That is the secret to stocking pilling AP without even trying

    currently my Unholy weapon is 75 Blood 72 Frost 70 and i was running three M+ a week, you can insult people for having high lvled weapons or you can figure out how its done

    choice is yours...
    That sounds great until you need to counter slow (x1 or even x2). Sure if it all lines up it gets to 4.25 hours but if the base is 6 or 9 days then at worst it could be 12.8 hours if you don't counter the slow.

    I def will try this out though. Thanks for the info.
    Last edited by Kluian05; 2017-11-10 at 05:34 PM.

  7. #287
    Quote Originally Posted by Kluian05 View Post
    That sounds great until you need to counter slow (x1 or even x2). Sure if it all lines up it gets to 4.25 hours but if the base is 6 or 9 days then at worst it could be 12.8 hours if you don't counter the slow.

    I def will try this out though. Thanks for the info.
    the only double counters require 2x minnion or 2x spell (only hazard counter follower you should have during this period is minnerva)

    that still allows you to get it to 7.4hrs, this has been done for months now, the ins and outs of it has been flesh out awhile ago.

    Koltira, Thassarian, Rottgut, Thoras, Minerva, Meatball and Whitmaine are the only followers you should have active when building goes up (rott/morgraine interchangeable)

    This is ultimately how you want all your followers built

    Thassarian - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Rottgut - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Morgraine - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Thoras - 30% time reduction, 50% minnion counter, 40% minnion counter
    Koltira - 30% time reduction, 50% minnion counter, 40% minnion counter (drop counters for 25+20% time reduction)
    Minerva - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter
    Nazgrim - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter (deactivate when command center is up)
    Amal'Thuzad - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter (deactivate when command center is up)
    Meatball - 30% time reduction, 25% time reduction, 20% time reduction (Inactive till command center is up)
    Whitemaine - 30% time reduction, 25% time reduction, 20% time reduction (Inactive tilll command center is up)

    If you havent been building your guys correctly you probably wont have it set nicely till next command center (one should be going up in 2-4 hours)

  8. #288
    On long fights with BiS legendaries frost is okay. Shit burst though..

  9. #289
    So, something more frost related: What builds do you guys currently use for M+? I tended to use Frost in the fortified weeks with FrostScythe, Gathering Storm (via ring) and BoS, but recently I noticed that it doesn't seem to perform as well anymore. Not sure if there is something better to melt trash with or if it's just the fact that I don't have as many extra relic traits unlocked on my frost weapon :/.

  10. #290
    Deleted
    took a break from frost for a week or 2 but after doing a number of VERY in depth tests, i have to say frost is kinda excellent at the moment.

    i tested in extensive mythic raiding and out performed alot of players who by mmo-champion standards are 'above' frost dks.

    as a very experienced and accomplished end game raider, i really can come to no other conclusion other than it is a skill disparity that is inhibiting alot of players/simmers on here.

  11. #291
    (Guess I should clarify after thinking about this post, When I say "skill" that obviously means accepting that RNG is a baseline factor, and when I say RNG i mean inside the fight. I've had 60 million Dark Arbitors before and Ive also had sub 20 million ones, Thats part of the spec and not what I mean when I say RNG in this post)

    Well, Ranking in ToS is by far the least skillful raid thats ever been in the game...

    Theres probably 3 or 4 fights that are determined by skill and not completely about RNG or the raid allowing you to rank.

    Goroth - skill
    DI - Spawn adds that you dont have to spawn (We spawn none)
    Harj- Sickly spawns, and whoever gets to AoE them gets rank 1, Take turns with 2 people doing it each week.
    Sisters- One of the skill based ones, but it can be cheesed if you raid keep the owl up for a long time (especially that week it was bugged and had double hp)
    DI- AoEfest scumbag fight, take turns to rank
    Maiden - RNG get the first orb after transition and interrupt right away so that the first orb spawned after phasing resets your 10 stack.
    Avatar - Mostly skill, but if your unlucky like me and have shitty range, you have to do the beam which keeps you our of melee range much of time.
    KJ - Mostly skill

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dankdruid View Post
    took a break from frost for a week or 2 but after doing a number of VERY in depth tests, i have to say frost is kinda excellent at the moment.

    i tested in extensive mythic raiding and out performed alot of players who by mmo-champion standards are 'above' frost dks.

    as a very experienced and accomplished end game raider, i really can come to no other conclusion other than it is a skill disparity that is inhibiting alot of players/simmers on here.
    Link logs please.

  12. #292
    Immortal hellhamster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    So, something more frost related: What builds do you guys currently use for M+? I tended to use Frost in the fortified weeks with FrostScythe, Gathering Storm (via ring) and BoS, but recently I noticed that it doesn't seem to perform as well anymore. Not sure if there is something better to melt trash with or if it's just the fact that I don't have as many extra relic traits unlocked on my frost weapon :/.
    Legendaries: Wrists, ring, pants, boots

    Build: typical cleave build: RA (Icy Talons is a good alternative, might even be better when running Teeming/Fortified), ME, Avalanche (Icecap is probably better for high Tyrannical), Winter is Coming, Volatile Shielding, Gathering Storm + Frostscythe, BoS (Obliteration is a good alternative especially if Tyrannical is up and your team's single target sucks).

    Trinkets: Whatever is also bis for single target just toggle Umbral Moonglaives 30 seconds prior to huge packs. Trinkets other than that don't really differ from each other.

    Playstyle: when you run up to a aoe pack, delay pillar of frost maybe 2 seconds after you Remoreselss Winter, that way you can easily stun mobs again during the next RW. Don't put much emphasis on this though, it's mostly for utility. Long story short, just spam runes and use breath when you're 50/60+ RP. Pray you get a non chainpulling tank, and keep toggling those lego pants and Umbrals when out of combat. Never use Sindragosa on bosses unless it's high Tyrannical and your single target sucks. TL;DR frost is not that hard in mythic+, it's basically 3-4 buttons to press. Build huge Remorseless Winter stacks fast and Breath when your rp is halfway full. Preperation and legos however are much more important.
    Last edited by hellhamster; 2017-11-10 at 09:58 PM.

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by Dankdruid View Post
    took a break from frost for a week or 2 but after doing a number of VERY in depth tests, i have to say frost is kinda excellent at the moment.

    i tested in extensive mythic raiding and out performed alot of players who by mmo-champion standards are 'above' frost dks.

    as a very experienced and accomplished end game raider, i really can come to no other conclusion other than it is a skill disparity that is inhibiting alot of players/simmers on here.
    Provide logs or please stop posting your bullshit. This whole I'm just better than everyone else act is honestly getting old. If you're so great and the rest of us are just mediocre at best then please provide the logs to prove it.

  14. #294
    Immortal hellhamster's Avatar
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    My tips for Tos. A bit late, but anyway.


    Goroth: During the first Infernal Burning (big aoe), PoF should be up so the knockback will be nullified. IBF prior to the explosion and AMS immediately afterwards to remove the debuff.
    DI: If you can trust your tanks to keep both bosses in cleave range, by all means go BoS. If you can trust other classes to let you interrupt every 30 secs, by all means go Sephuz instead of Cold Heart. AMS to dispel the Echoing Anguish (dispellable debuff).
    Harjatan: delay Remorseless Winter if timer is between ~10-5 seconds left for adds spawning. Breath is kinda overrated since adds usually get obliterated by warriors and their ilk. AMS if you just came straight from LFR and you let the debuff stack high.
    Mistress: Go Frostscythe with lego ring and BoS, fuck whoever says you should focus on single target is pretty much the gist of it. Save AMS for oh shit Hydras. You can be a hero with lego pants freezing mobs, but I'm sure your overall dps will suffer. Not really tested it though, also depends how many more Sindragosas you can get.
    Sisters: save Sindragosa for the add. AMS to dispel the Moon Burn.
    DH: Same deal as Mistress.
    Maiden: AMS the debuff, save Sindragosa for orb stacking phase, use Cold Heart twice during orb stacking phase. Don't waste Pillar if she teleports 10 seconds later.
    Avatar: AMS the big fucking explosion for RP pooling, don't be a shitter and waste an Obliteration <5 seconds before he casts said big fucking explosion because it just came off cd (I know you fuckers did this more than once). On second phase laugh whenever everyone is off flying to god knows where while you're sitting there happily dpsing with Pillar up. AMS to dispel the tornados, blame your horrible skill on the class' lack of mobility to dodge said tornados.
    KJ: Delay Pillar and stack up Remorseless Winter for whenever an aoe mechanic comes online, use Sindragosa for said aoe mechanic, use Cold heart on intermission, AMS AFTER Bursting Dreadflame but BEFORE soaking Armageddon to avoid the debuff. On big bad boom during last phase you can stay out with AMS or IBF.

    Overall: if your kills are short and you can't fit a subsequent Sindragosa later on, delay her for the second Pillar for like almost double the damage. Generally: join a guild with bad dps because frost burst is shit and you will be fucked in the meters if kills are short. Or play unholy for the farm, you can look really good with shoulders even if you're shit.
    Last edited by hellhamster; 2017-11-10 at 10:08 PM.

  15. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by RuneDK View Post
    Provide logs or please stop posting your bullshit. This whole I'm just better than everyone else act is honestly getting old. If you're so great and the rest of us are just mediocre at best then please provide the logs to prove it.
    Is he a meme guy? I admittedly dont pay much attention to the names of people posting, but I've never heard of him lol

  16. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by Baddok21 View Post
    the only double counters require 2x minnion or 2x spell (only hazard counter follower you should have during this period is minnerva)

    that still allows you to get it to 7.4hrs, this has been done for months now, the ins and outs of it has been flesh out awhile ago.

    Koltira, Thassarian, Rottgut, Thoras, Minerva, Meatball and Whitmaine are the only followers you should have active when building goes up (rott/morgraine interchangeable)

    This is ultimately how you want all your followers built

    Thassarian - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Rottgut - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Morgraine - 30% time reduction, 50% spell counter, 40% spell counter
    Thoras - 30% time reduction, 50% minnion counter, 40% minnion counter
    Koltira - 30% time reduction, 50% minnion counter, 40% minnion counter (drop counters for 25+20% time reduction)
    Minerva - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter
    Nazgrim - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter (deactivate when command center is up)
    Amal'Thuzad - 30% time reduction, 50% Hazard counter, 40% Hazard counter (deactivate when command center is up)
    Meatball - 30% time reduction, 25% time reduction, 20% time reduction (Inactive till command center is up)
    Whitemaine - 30% time reduction, 25% time reduction, 20% time reduction (Inactive tilll command center is up)

    If you havent been building your guys correctly you probably wont have it set nicely till next command center (one should be going up in 2-4 hours)
    Thanks, I plan on only doing this on my druid main so the layout would be different. One question though, why would you choose to sit Meatball as your 7th follower over someone such as Amal'Thuzad (deactivate full time)? Meatball can already be equipped 30% reduction / 25% reduction / 30% success (then swap to 20 reduction during tower) because of his pure success bonus against bosses. He will help hit 200% on other missions when the tower is down, and it requires 1 less follower to be swapped.
    Last edited by Kluian05; 2017-11-10 at 11:03 PM.

  17. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Kluian05 View Post
    Thanks, I plan on only doing this on my druid main so the layout would be different. One question though, why would you choose to sit Meatball as your 7th follower over someone such as Amal'Thuzad (deactivate full time)? Meatball can already be equipped 30% reduction / 25% reduction / 30% success (then swap to 20 reduction during tower) because of his pure success bonus against bosses. He will help hit 200% on other missions when the tower is down, and it requires 1 less follower to be swapped.
    Boss counter never have time reduction/100% completion cap those always come on hazard/minnion/spell

    followers are set that way for regular missions when command center is down 1 champion to counter any severly hampering counter (time or completion cap) then you use a regular death knight or the new argus counters to compliment.

    youll always hit 200% without having to use more than 1 main follower, after command is down i deactivate whitemaine first and spam missions with meatball for a day to have another 5 ready for the next command center comming up then deactivate him as well.
    Last edited by Baddok21; 2017-11-10 at 11:59 PM.

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesquish View Post
    Is he a meme guy? I admittedly dont pay much attention to the names of people posting, but I've never heard of him lol
    He posts every few weeks saying how much better he is than everyone cause he's top three in his raid and really the spec is performing exceptionally well and we're all just bad. So yea he's probably a meme guy.

  19. #299

  20. #300
    He's been banned quite often. Dunno if he's a troll or not, but even if he was, he's not funny. Better ignore him, because all of his posts are always like this.

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