Three things from Legion the next Expansion must Change

[CaptainV]

There are three major complaints about Legion I have to have, all 3 of them are pretty relevent and each one of them is pretty much the core of why the game has become so bloody unfun in this iteration of the game for me, and for a number of friends, I have quite an extensive list of discord mates, skype mates, steam mates, battlenet mates and mates in guilds that all feel the same general way about Legions current problem, so rather than going, OH GOD THESE ARE SO BAD, ill explain exactly what can be done to improove them.

Rep Grinding, The Tedium Of The Past:

World Quests offer you a limited but progressive way of gaining some progress each day towards a reputation, but then, abruptly, your out of WQ's to do and your stuck till the next day to continue any progress towards rep gain. This problem is clearly not healthy as it creates a stigma towards grinding the rep as you cant manually continue doing so.

The solution to this is quite simple, its long overdue and needs to be impliamented in wow in its current form, MAKE, REP GRIND, ACCOUNT, WIDE.

There is no harm in this in the current WQ form, it allows people to actually GRIND rep on alts and thus adds an alt friendly factor to the game. Rep grinding is ultimatley meaningless most of the time anyway, as most gear you can get from rep grinds is below any level of quality most other grinds (pvp/dungeon/raid) offer and besides mounts and toys, theres not much else to them these days, making them feel all but meaningless.

With the impliamentation of paragon rewards this only further adds a reason to make rep grinding account wide, as it means people can continue to farm them with alts on a regular basis, rather than feeling restrained by it, and having no progress, speaking of no progress:

The RNG problem, Legendaries, Titanforged, Gearing:

The RNG PROBLEM, is a PROBLEM, a problem that has been growing since around late Cata and has become extremely prominant beyond the current games content. In a time and age where many people like to play MMO's to feel a sense of progress, not getting loot worth your weight is just a stigma to that progress that is not helpful at all.

Getting gear is nice, but having gear less valued by someone getting a slightly better version, is not.

RNG used to be a compliament to the meal, the surprise of getting something nice was genuinley worthwhile when it *meant* something for getting it. There was only one item level, only one progression, and that is in itself, progress.

But getting plenty of the same stuff that has no meaning or reward, or even doing an entire raid and getting NO gear at all is also, stigmatic towards progression. The reason blizzard added raid currency in Wrath was to tackle this problem, meaning it was ALWAYS possible to get something, over time.

Blizzards current system isnt working, we need valor back, we need, reward, back, or, we need a way to upgrade loots itemlevels using bonus coins or other progress to actually make yourself feel like your upgrading over time. And not some RNG bullshit way or progress, a GUARENTEED one, that you EARN from your effort.

This RNG system creates a roulette of who gets into raids and who doesnt entirley on the merits of their luck, not, on their skill.

Its not healthy for wow.


Speaking of Unhealthy, The Time Gated Problem, Pathfinders, Progress, Plotpoints:

Combined into the previous two problems is the third issue of Legion, the rediculas amount of time gating that it takes to get any real progress in anything. The fact raids are advertised for a launch on a patch that then comes in a .5 patch is insulting, the fact that we are taken for granted is even *more* insulting.

Waiting a week to do the story so you can finish it? Not healthy, not even decently, especially when you realize all that time waiting amounts to less than 2-3 hours of story you could have finished reletivley quickly.

For a story heavy patch things like 7.2 and 7.3 were filled with alot of waffle, sure, I liked 7.3's plot but the time it takes to get to half the decent parts is filled with unnecessary clutter and most of it you dont even care for.

7.2 was undeniably worse, and maybe 7.3 is a good start to learning from it, but not a decent finish from understanding what made it bad. Obligatory follower grinds and other crap is just not helping leading to yet "more" gating, of progress.

You feel like 8/10ths of your time in legion is spent being unable to do something because things literlaly are already done, thus leaving you nothing else to do, or your only alternative is to farm content that people either wont take you on due to ilevel elitism, or, you struggle to make progress if your doing something like BG's or casual farming for veiled argunite.

In short...

The progression in Legion is beyond appauling, even if the rest is moving forwards.

The game needs, better progress, in its next expansion.

Account wide rep grinds, the ability to upgrade gear into warforged/titanforged (with only one set of ilevels for each), the ability to farm badges of valor to buy pve gear, and pvp gear from pvp marks that help move your levels up progressivly over time.

Veiled Argunite farming was a start due to it being alot faster than most, but its still failing to understand the RNG problem.

You cant make a good RNG system, you never could.

Its time for blizzard to accept that, and stop fighting it.

[WhiteEagle888]

Exactly this.

[Eleccybubb]

Rep grinding is fine imo. Gives people something to work towards. However the rewards could be a tad better. Army of the Light and Argussian Reach thankfully went back to Exalted mounts.

RNG I totally agree with. Go back to Thunder/Warforging because it felt like a minor bonus. Titanforging while a bonus still feels reliant. I mean I had a Convergence drop and it would have been useful had it Titanforged.

As for Legendaries I just don't understand what was wrong with the MoP/WoD model in which you worked on a powerful item throughout the expansion. WoD ring was the best imo because the problem with the MoP questline was the 500 gem eventually became useless whereas the ring remained powerful throughout the expansion.

Timegating is fine if done right. I'd rather them go back to the raid coming out with the patch rather than waiting. This may mean a drought but throw some filler content in. I believe the team is capable of this.

Story. Argus is excellent. Broken Shore wasn't even story. Simple as that. Nothing important about getting Khadgar his Nethershard fix or killing 100 demons.

Pathfinder is fine imo. The idea is you explore the world to be able to fly in it. However I would love WoW to adopt the FF14 system of unlocking flying. Doing the story quests awards part of the flying and the rest you unlock by exploring the zone.

[Sanguiris]

More abilities (unprune)
Purchasable pvp gear
Bring back raid tokens

[Eleccybubb]

More abilities (unprune)
Purchasable pvp gear
Bring back raid tokens

1. Yes as long as we don't end up with a bloat.

2. It still exists. Echoes of battle. However I do prefer the old Honor system admittedly.

3. I don't understand this. A piece of tier dropping now is just the token without the token. You don't have to mess about with a vendor is the only difference.

[Mynarjr]

More abilities (unprune)
Purchasable pvp gear
Bring back raid tokens

I am Completely for all of this. There were a few reason why certain classes were brought in. Specifically, Druids with their ability to symbiosis. As a druid during this time, it was legit the most fun ability of their class (Especially if you used it on a priest and got leap of faith). People complained that it was unbalanced,and blizzard said it was hard to balance, and that was why it was removed. Balance it out by allowing it to come back but be PVP-Disabled.
The RNG design that blizzard has designed especiallly towards pvp gear,has been very off-putting towards trying to get gear via pvp.

To caveat about the raid tokens. I especially love receiving this in raid, however; one of the things I would love to come back, is for the final boss to drop the "any-piece" token. It was a blessing when it was dropped in Blackrock furnace, so that members of your raid who needed that 1 last item (or a specific item which wouldnt drop), was able to finally purchase it.

[Hitei]

More abilities (unprune)
Purchasable pvp gear
Bring back raid tokens

This are much better suggestions.

[owbu]

Number one would give alts less stuff to do. Not really a big fan. It would also make the "MANDATORY!!1" crowd go insane, because people with multiple alts would get an advantage.
Number two I agree with, but is probably going to stay. Our brains are just wired to loot boxes and other RNG "gambling" bullshit. Asking blizzard to remove it is like asking mc donalds to offer less fatty foods.
Number three. No. Raid tiers take about 6 month. Patches with world content coming out before that is not blizzard screwing us, its just plain better for the game. Otherwise you would get the world stuff and the dungeon 3 month later, not the raid 3 month earlier. (Which would also be terrible, rushing raid tiers is the worst).
I also personally like story being gated somewhat, since it doesnt make me play 6h the first day and then be bored the next 3 wendnesdays, but that really is personal preferance. The best system, imo, still is the MoP .1 style, where you earned more story bits by doing world content.

[Lochton]

I don't mind the current rep grind, it is easy and smooth, not meant to be rushed. The tabard idea was a forced idea too in the end.

And I don't mind some of the gating, stops people from acting like locust.

[Deleted]

Totally agree.

Though I'm not a fan of account wide rep, its better than current situation. As you mentioned, today rep is meaningless anyway.

[Aggrophobic]

I agree with this.
The RNG is a bigger issue than the others for me at least.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

None of those things are actually problems. They just need some tweaks. The real change we need is people to stop writing 2k word posts about shit they think must change on a fan site.

[epLe]

RNG - Random Number Generator, is just an electronical dice.
RPGs needs dice mechanics to work.

Comparing Legions TF/WF to the times where there was no such procs, it is better for every raidgroup now.
Those kind of people who don't bother to show when they don't expect loot is increasing.
People now have incentives for running the same raid for a longer time, making raidsquads more stable.

When it comes to legendaries, of some wierd reason people who never got one before MoP, seems to think getting them now is worse ?

make reputations acc wide ? -lol, prestige and achievement systems are in much more dire need of account widening.

[unbound]

I don't see the problem with rep grinding...especially if Blizz takes the time to address much of the rep via a story line.

I completely agree with the RNG problem. It is very sad to watch a good player stuck for weeks, and even months, waiting for any leggo to drop, much less good leggos...especially with the general community attitude that you need iLvls well beyond what is actually required for the content. Having no 970s or even one 970 causes issues...and there is nothing you can but wait and wait and wait hoping for that rare drop.

I also completely agree with time-gating. I would much rather see a challenge that needs to be overcome to get to things currently time-gated. It is a blatantly lazy mechanism.

[grexly75]

With the time gating issue that some seem to have, have you ever thought of why Blizzard implemented this? I mean really really think about it and not just circle jerk your reactions to it..

My thoughts on it is to slowing people down to a healthy speed when it comes to consuming content.. The other is although they had different methods in the past with gating such as rep gating from past xpacs..

But Blizzard must of seen noticed a problem with rep gating that made them change to a timed system (maybe players unhealthy need to gain exalted as fast as possible) something that we will never know..

The other thing is with timed gating it does make you come back, you don't burn through the content and then end up complaining about nothing to do (even though timed gating can do that as well)..

So really in the end there is no real easy solution that will satisfy everyone..

[Jorah]

Rep Grinding, The Tedium Of The Past:

World Quests offer you a limited but progressive way of gaining some progress each day towards a reputation, but then, abruptly, your out of WQ's to do and your stuck till the next day to continue any progress towards rep gain. This problem is clearly not healthy as it creates a stigma towards grinding the rep as you cant manually continue doing so.

The solution to this is quite simple, its long overdue and needs to be impliamented in wow in its current form, MAKE, REP GRIND, ACCOUNT, WIDE.

Disagree. Reputation should be something you work for big amount of time. Allowing to level it from Neutral to Exalted in couple of days is BAD design.

The RNG problem, Legendaries, Titanforged, Gearing:

The RNG PROBLEM, is a PROBLEM, a problem that has been growing since around late Cata and has become extremely prominant beyond the current games content. In a time and age where many people like to play MMO's to feel a sense of progress, not getting loot worth your weight is just a stigma to that progress that is not helpful at all.

Getting gear is nice, but having gear less valued by someone getting a slightly better version, is not.

Completely agree. Fuck RNG and titanforged. Its completely destroyed feel of progressing for gear.

[skannerz22]

LEGION WAS A PERFECT EXPANSION
you're just tired from playing for years
go play some rainbow six siege

[Escepticus]

I agree, OP

[Dracullus]

Don't want grind, don't want RNG.. so I guess perfect model for you would be Warlords of Draenor (with more raids and dungeons of course)? Got it.

Who am I kidding. With that model you would just complete content on easier difficulties and whine about "nothing to do" again.

[Fabinas]

The 3 things that should be changed are : Ion, Celestalon, MAU metrics.