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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by bryroo View Post
    The great thing about Classic Servers is now these people can put up or shut up.

    Don't like flying? Go play vanilla
    It won't happen. Mostly because it's not enough that they don't fly. Because if that was all it was, they'd just wouldn't use their flying mounts. They have to ensure that no one else flies too, so they can agree with Blizzard and be "right" about no-flying being good for the game.
    If you honestly believe that flying is bad for the game, then you haven't fully considered the issue, and are just mindlessly repeating something someone else said.

  2. #422
    WoW never gave you an excuse to go back out to the world once you hit max level and is the reason flying didnt change anything except if you was on a pvp server.

    Unless you was a miner or a Herber you never went back out just sat in your city hoping that group that is spamming trade will take you that was what it was like back in the day.

    I hate these nostalgia blinded threads thinking things was better in the old days. Well guess what when you have been playing for over 10 years of course you yearn for the feeling you once had when you first started we all do but thats never coming back and blizz did what it needed to do to make this game last and it worked cause we have just passed its 13th year! THIRTEEN YEARS! There is prolly newbies just starting that is younger than this game!

    So just deal with or quit cause what you want to feel again you aint gonna get!!

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    They have to ensure that no one else flies too, so they can agree with Blizzard and be "right" about no-flying being good for the game.
    Lol vanilla players don't really bother with main wow... it's the main wow players that want to destroy vanilla by trolling with changes.

  4. #424
    Quote Originally Posted by bugsix View Post
    Lol vanilla players don't really bother with main wow... it's the main wow players that want to destroy vanilla by trolling with changes.
    Don't misunderstand. The people who just want to re-experience Vanilla are doing so for different reasons. Saying people want to go to vanilla because of no-flying is like saying people quit just because of no-flying. It's not the whole story.

    My point was that people who claim flying hurts the game aren't going to go to vanilla because it doesn't fit their motives or psychology. Telling people to go to vanilla to avoid the effects of flying isn't going to work. They won't go.
    If you honestly believe that flying is bad for the game, then you haven't fully considered the issue, and are just mindlessly repeating something someone else said.

  5. #425
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhatAgain666 View Post
    WoW never gave you an excuse to go back out to the world once you hit max level and is the reason flying didnt change anything except if you was on a pvp server.

    Unless you was a miner or a Herber you never went back out just sat in your city hoping that group that is spamming trade will take you that was what it was like back in the day.

    I hate these nostalgia blinded threads thinking things was better in the old days. Well guess what when you have been playing for over 10 years of course you yearn for the feeling you once had when you first started we all do but thats never coming back and blizz did what it needed to do to make this game last and it worked cause we have just passed its 13th year! THIRTEEN YEARS! There is prolly newbies just starting that is younger than this game!

    So just deal with or quit cause what you want to feel again you aint gonna get!!
    It did in Cata with archaeology and its rewards. While not perfectly implemented back then (smaller dig sites, less digsites on huge continents, very low drop rate on some items) people were flying all over azeroth for grabbing weapons, toys, heirlooms and that Tol'vir mount and Alch recipe.

  6. #426
    The Lightbringer Perkunas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    It won't happen. Mostly because it's not enough that they don't fly. Because if that was all it was, they'd just wouldn't use their flying mounts. They have to ensure that no one else flies too, so they can agree with Blizzard and be "right" about no-flying being good for the game.
    I'm content with Classic that I don't care about retail's flying model anymore. Good luck on getting faster Pathfinder in the future and that's not sarcasm. I hope you guys get what you want now that I wont have to play retail anymore.
    Stains on the carpet and stains on the memory
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  7. #427
    Subs continued to rise during TBC, WoTLK and into the first part of Cataclysm. I'd say flight had little to no negative effect outside of world PvP. A very small percent of players engage in World PvP, so not much was lost.

    The worst thing to happen to WoW was to continue to keep flying gated behind multiple meta-achievements. It only had it's charm in WoD, in Legion it just became another "been there, done that" grind.

  8. #428
    You know, Vanilla was all about wasting time. "Go to other side of map on your feet, kill 10 mobs, return to me only to find out, that you also need to grab 10 rings from the exactly the same mobs and after that...I remembered another thing! You also need to get back and kill their boss!". All MMOs were like that back then, simple because they lacked content to do. And via implementing flying Blizzard just wanted to show, that "We don't want you to waste your time - we want you to actually play our game! You pay subscription for new content - not for Bobby's new yaсht! We will make enough content for you, so we won't need to artificially stretch it!". But since Cata they started to have some problems with development of new content. And since then they started to find some ways to optimize their development resources. One of major ways to do it - reuse and stretch world content as much, as possible. World quests - are apogee of such design, where you have to waste 90% of time travelling from point A to point B and only 10% of time via actually playing the game. And worst thing - they call it "content" and think, that we shouldn't "skip" it. So, at the end Wow simply turned from "best MMO in a world" to "just another F2P-quality MMO, where devs just milk sub from you via using aggressive marketing, they spend more money on, than on game itself".
    Last edited by WowIsDead64; Today at 08:08 AM.
    We play RPG - not adventure and/or platformer, like Tomb Rider or Assassin's Creed.
    Blizzard should either remove features, that don't fit into RPG genre, or enable flying to avoid them for players, who don't like them.
    Flying - is like ability to turn PVP-flag off. It allows devs to design content purely for "PVPers" without risk of harming "PVEers".
    My perfect Wow.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    . So, at the end Wow simply turned from "best MMO in a world" to "just another F2P-quality MMO, where devs just milk sub from you via using aggressive marketing, they spend more money on, than on game itself".
    You are right, this is what WoW turned into, because it's not vanilla anymore.

  10. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by bugsix View Post
    You are right, this is what WoW turned into, because it's not vanilla anymore.
    No, because it's not WotLK any more. Vanilla was just Korean grind-fest, as all previous MMOs, like Ultima and Everquest. What's wrong with current Wow - is that it's not RPG game any more. It's just multiplayer arcade action-adventure.
    We play RPG - not adventure and/or platformer, like Tomb Rider or Assassin's Creed.
    Blizzard should either remove features, that don't fit into RPG genre, or enable flying to avoid them for players, who don't like them.
    Flying - is like ability to turn PVP-flag off. It allows devs to design content purely for "PVPers" without risk of harming "PVEers".
    My perfect Wow.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by Perkunas View Post
    I'm content with Classic that I don't care about retail's flying model anymore. Good luck on getting faster Pathfinder in the future and that's not sarcasm. I hope you guys get what you want now that I wont have to play retail anymore.
    Faster pathfinder? LOL! That's not what I'm after. Pathfinder is a joke. It's a tool to stretch content, not a reward for playing the content. It has nothing to do with making better gameplay or better design. Blizzard has turned flying into nothing more than another piece of heirloom gear for leveling. It's not even associated in any way with current content, or the story of the zones it's eventually usable in.

    Everything about the way Hazzicostas and his team has treated flying, since WoD launched, stinks of a complete and total disregard for it, and the players who like it. The only reason I'm even still in the discussion is to convince more players to recognize that instead of just blindly accepting it because it was in blue text.
    Last edited by SirCowdog; Today at 08:53 AM.
    If you honestly believe that flying is bad for the game, then you haven't fully considered the issue, and are just mindlessly repeating something someone else said.

  12. #432
    The Lightbringer Perkunas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Faster pathfinder? LOL! That's not what I'm after. Pathfinder is a joke. It's a tool to stretch content, not a reward for playing the content. It has nothing to do with making better gameplay or better design. Blizzard has turned flying into nothing more than another piece of heirloom gear for leveling. It's not even associated in any way with current content, or the story of the zones it's eventually usable in.

    Everything about the way Hazzicostas and his team has treated flying, since WoD launched, stinks of a complete and total disregard for it, and the players who like it. The only reason I'm even still in the discussion is to convince more players to recognize that instead of just blindly accepting it because it was in blue text.
    Ok, I hope you can fly when you hit cap... Better?
    Stains on the carpet and stains on the memory
    Songs about happiness murmured in dreams
    When we both of us knew how the end always is...

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Faster pathfinder? LOL! That's not what I'm after. Pathfinder is a joke. It's a tool to stretch content, not a reward for playing the content. It has nothing to do with making better gameplay or better design. Blizzard has turned flying into nothing more than another piece of heirloom gear for leveling. It's not even associated in any way with current content, or the story of the zones it's eventually usable in.

    Everything about the way Hazzicostas and his team has treated flying, since WoD launched, stinks of a complete and total disregard for it, and the players who like it. The only reason I'm even still in the discussion is to convince more players to recognize that instead of just blindly accepting it because it was in blue text.
    Yeah, and things, like Suramar time/rep-gating - was an obvious indication, that content was artificially stretched. I've bought Legion, only because I want Artefact appearances, Class Hall gear sets, may be class mounts(I don't know yet - if it's not too grindy) and to have 110lvl characters to farm MOP raids. If I wouldn't need this things - I would never buy Legion. Beyond this Legion - is just a terrible Diablo III clone, i.e. game, where you grind just for a sake of grind without any long term goal.
    We play RPG - not adventure and/or platformer, like Tomb Rider or Assassin's Creed.
    Blizzard should either remove features, that don't fit into RPG genre, or enable flying to avoid them for players, who don't like them.
    Flying - is like ability to turn PVP-flag off. It allows devs to design content purely for "PVPers" without risk of harming "PVEers".
    My perfect Wow.

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by Perkunas View Post
    Ok, I hope you can fly when you hit cap... Better?
    See, this? This right here? This is why I keep posting: How many people just don't even realize what's wrong. It doesn't matter as much when or how flying is unlocked. It's how much flying is part of the game.

    Pathfinder just makes you wait for a long time, and jump through a lot of hoops to get it when it's almost completely useless. When it should be part of what makes the open world interesting in the first place. It should be built into the content. It should be something you use while you're consuming the content the first time through, and not just an afterthought. That better presentation of content that Blizzard always talks about? That should INCLUDE flying.

    This is what TBC started. What WotLK went further into with Icecrown and Stormpeaks. It wasn't just slogging through a ratmaze on the ground. Even with flying it wasn't completely safe. There were canons to shoot you, kaliri birds to harass you, ranged enemies, airships, and dragons. Sure, most of the actual fighting and content was on the ground, but at least it wasn't completely immersion breaking where your griffon or whatever magically forgets how to use its wings while every other enemy soars around like it's no big deal. Flying was part of the experience, even if it took a few levels to get it.

    That's what's missing from WoD and Legion.
    If you honestly believe that flying is bad for the game, then you haven't fully considered the issue, and are just mindlessly repeating something someone else said.

  15. #435
    I dont agree either. Flying is awesome and i love it. Mostly because of the speed and no "daze" effects happens

    But im also pretty happy with how legions flight whistle works if there were no flying at all. But, flying above the landscape is just awesome
    Main(s) since Classic:
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  16. #436
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    See, this? This right here? This is why I keep posting: How many people just don't even realize what's wrong. It doesn't matter as much when or how flying is unlocked. It's how much flying is part of the game.

    Pathfinder just makes you wait for a long time, and jump through a lot of hoops to get it when it's almost completely useless. When it should be part of what makes the open world interesting in the first place. It should be built into the content. It should be something you use while you're consuming the content the first time through, and not just an afterthought. That better presentation of content that Blizzard always talks about? That should INCLUDE flying.

    This is what TBC started. What WotLK went further into with Icecrown and Stormpeaks. It wasn't just slogging through a ratmaze on the ground. Even with flying it wasn't completely safe. There were canons to shoot you, kaliri birds to harass you, ranged enemies, airships, and dragons. Sure, most of the actual fighting and content was on the ground, but at least it wasn't completely immersion breaking where your griffon or whatever magically forgets how to use its wings while every other enemy soars around like it's no big deal. Flying was part of the experience, even if it took a few levels to get it.

    That's what's missing from WoD and Legion.
    There are just 2 things, you should know about flying:
    1) Blizzard don't want you to fly in actual content - that's why flying is released only when all content is already done and only in content, that is already done
    2) Blizzard don't want new/returning players to fly even in obsoleted content - that's why Pathfinder is here, not just simple "we enable flying in x.2".

    Conclusion? Blizzard don't openly admit it, cuz they don't want to lose even more subs, but they actually want to virtually remove flying from game. That's why they always throw some bunch misinformation at the beginning of every xpack, that makes us hope, that in this xpack Pathfinder will be handled better, only to do the same crap again - i.e. delay flying as much, as possible. I would never buy BFA without exact knowledge, when and how flying will be unlocked in this xpack and how much content with flying I will have.
    We play RPG - not adventure and/or platformer, like Tomb Rider or Assassin's Creed.
    Blizzard should either remove features, that don't fit into RPG genre, or enable flying to avoid them for players, who don't like them.
    Flying - is like ability to turn PVP-flag off. It allows devs to design content purely for "PVPers" without risk of harming "PVEers".
    My perfect Wow.

  17. #437
    Nerf flying and you can have it at level cap. If you aren't willing to accept how op flying is then I have no sympathy for you.

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