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  1. #1
    Dreadlord hellar's Avatar
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    Jul 2008
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    worth goin shadow for pve?

    from what i have seen the shadow tree is getting buffed pvp wise. is it worth goin shadow for pve? will i be lower then i am now on the damg meters? or should i roll holy for pve now?

  2. #2

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Shadow priests are always wanted for a 25 man, so im not sure what your question is...

  3. #3

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    SPriests arent really brought into the raid for dps purposes. Im not saying their dps is inadequate, but their utility is what makes spriests a high demand class. As far as beta goes, the spriests seems to be buffed in terms of damage output and no so much its utility. Moreso, hunters, disc priests, locks, and fellow classes are recieving raid-wide buffs that make them more desireable in a support perspective. It seems as if they would like more classes to be viewed upon as utility(other than their main roles) in wotlk rather than it is now in BC (ZOMG Spriest in EVERY group ... mind set)

  4. #4

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    I doubt shadow priests will be wanted in Wotlk if the current changes remain in for the live version. In PVP maybe, but I don't think raids will want more than one shadow priest(Might not want any) for the higher end raids where the shadow priests dps becomes poor. In the first raids like Naxx shadow priests will have good dps... Just like in BC in the KZ - TK range

  5. #5

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    I can't see us (I'm a shadow priest) being pushed out of raids completely. nothing is set in stone and I'm sure they won't be making us completely useless for pve use. our dps isn't that bad at the moment. sure we're not chasing locks for 2300dps, but we're not completely useless providing complete group healing on many fights freeing up valuable healers to keep the other groups topped. Those 4k mindblasts heal the whole group for 1000 after all. must like a coh.

    as for our mana return being nerfed. we just dont' know what sort of dps we'll be outputting. we might end up returning the same mana as we do now through our much higher dps.

    I wouldn't go jumping to the conclusion the pve shadow priest is no more until wotlk is released as we're all 80 tbh.

  6. #6

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    they will always be wanted, If i can push 2600 in brut is just because of my lovely friends the shadow priests
    (This signature was removed for violation of the Avatar & Signature Guidelines)

  7. #7

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by Matkar
    they will always be wanted, If i can push 2600 in brut is just because of my lovely friends the shadow priests
    Well said. Many shadow priests forget this in their quest for Moar DPS.

    Regardless, there are many DPS boosts in the Shadow tree. 10% To SWP, 10% To Mind Flay and Mind Blast assuming 2 DoTs, 175% Crit damage on SWD and MB, as well as 30% Damage from spirit that synergizes with the new Spirit Tap is all going to buff Spriest damage to be closer to the Pure DPS classes.

    It's still not going to be even, but that's why theres still the 2% VT.

  8. #8

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by foreverjian
    Shadow priests are always wanted for a 25 man, so im not sure what your question is...
    2-3 of them yeah.

    Author of: Goggle Cat Comics.

  9. #9

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    I dont currently like the way the shadow tree is looking at the moment from a pve point of view, everyone keeps saying oh we are getting loads more dps, but looking at all the other class changes who isnt get loads more dps? Holy priests also seem to be getting the shaft as well, they used to be the best all round healer now with every healing class get mega buffs and holy priests only getting guardian spirit i think priests are on the back burner for this expansion

  10. #10

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    i am a sp

    and i think we will be wanted in wotlk

    maybe not 3 in a 25man raid but mostly 2 and at least 1

    dps is going up so more mana from VT and VT needed a nerf since it already gives sick amounts of mana at the moment

    we gives +10% shadowdmg
    + 5% spelldmg too all
    + mana/hp to group

    i don't think we can whine actually i am pretty happy with the changes

  11. #11

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    I just dont think we have got a good deal as some other classes If locks stay destro for best dps they will all be fire as new changes rock for fire locks so 10% shadow dmg will only benefit us and affliction/demo locks if they are viable at end game spec.

  12. #12

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Most locks will have to be affliction at the start, and go destro at the higher endgame.
    This is due to the combat ratings cutting your stats in half.

    Author of: Goggle Cat Comics.

  13. #13

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    The raid environment is changing, so therefore you have to expect some changes in raid makeup. However, the raid is still going to want at least 1 shadow priest to provide shadow weaving (raid wide 10% buff to shadow damage) and misery (raid wide 5% spell damage buff).

    I dont expect my spriest to keep up with the pure dps classes nor do I believe I have to. I do forsee the gap closing a little to the pure dps classes which is why VT was nerfed to 2%. I believe in the current environment were blizzard to tweak spriests to keep up with the pure dps classes the 5% VT return would result in entire parties being mana neutral, I can currently output 1500 odd dps which is equal to 375mp/5... imagine if i could do 2K dps like the pure dps classes? 500 mp/5 to my party is a bit silly.

    I also believe with the extra 30% threat reduction from SF we will be able to provide VE heals more often. Blizzard have already stipulated that they are not happy how AoE heals like CoH & Chain Heal are dominating the current raid environment and with that in mind i'd expect that VE healing is going to take a larger role.

    It's all still a bit too early to speculate on but i'd imagine 1 or 2 spriests are going to be desired in WoTLK, they just wont be depended on like that were in TBC.

  14. #14

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by xinnie
    we gives +10% shadowdmg
    + 5% spelldmg too all
    + mana/hp to group
    Vampiric Embrace is highly situational, since it causes high amounts of threat and it's not that useful if you have competent healers (save for some encounters of course!). It's a DPS loss anyway.

    Mana regen from Vampiric Touch is awesome, but it's going to be nerfed in WotLK...

    +5% to all magical damage is veeery nice. BUT a single warlock now gives +10% to most magical damage (all except for nature and holy... like there were many ele shamans in raids...) and does up to 1000 DPS more than a shadowpriest.

    And finally... +10% to shadow dmg. That is nice, but if all goes according to Blizzard's plan, we won't see more than 2 locks per raid. And chances are both of them will be fire specced, since the new destro tree is fire.

    ------

    So, every min-max raid leader will probably want one shadowpriest for Misery alone. But you probably won't see more of them per raid in WotLK, since they simply won't be THE utility class they were in TBC.

  15. #15

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    If the nerf to mana pots becomes real (1 mana pot per fight) I believe they will be more needed than ever.

  16. #16

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by Freyros
    Vampiric Embrace is highly situational
    This is a personal decision, and I strongly disagree, I use it always, to be able to use SW:death, and to help healers.

    It's not rare that I end up doing 5% healing on certain fights, it's awsome to help our healers, and of c. the mana, right now we're one of the most important classes for progression raids.

  17. #17

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    sp will always be usefull, i think almost every spec can be raid worthy if played well. depends on progress and raid setup, boss demands, etc.
    Offtopic: Anyone knows any good forum where i can get some nice info on spell rotation on sp? im lvling a priest alt thx in advance.

  18. #18

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    www.shadowpriest.com

    Shadow Priests do NOT use a spell rotation...we use a spell priority system, due to cooldowns and dots needing refresh. VT>SW:P>MB/SW when vt has 1.5 seconds left, recast....when sw expires refresh, mb/sw:d when cooldown up, and vt or sw:P doesn't need refreshed, and mf when all dots are good and mb/sw:d on cooldown. Starshards or Devouring Plague at your leisure. DP should likely be macro'ed with Inner Focus for mana saving purposes.

    The nerf to vt is disturbing, and I don't believe it will be "made up" with increased damage according to current theorycrafting. I am gearing my mage for a main switch in case they don't make some changes soon.

  19. #19

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by holmie
    This is a personal decision, and I strongly disagree, I use it always, to be able to use SW:death, and to help healers.
    That's a personal decision too. I always keep SW on cooldown, unless it's a fight with heavy raid dmg, a fight where I am using VE anyway.

  20. #20

    Re: worth goin shadow for pve?

    Quote Originally Posted by Judeldarne
    The nerf to vt is disturbing, and I don't believe it will be "made up" with increased damage according to current theorycrafting. I am gearing my mage for a main switch in case they don't make some changes soon.
    I think the 'nerf' to VT is alarming people without them really thinking through the situation entirely. 2% VT return will give more room for spriests to increase their raw dps without creating a situation where they make their entire party mana neutral, something i'm sure Blizzard are very sensitve to.

    In addition it will help create a raid environment where spriests can offer a utility that individual raids can choose to utilise instead of them being forced to use like it was in TBC. Blizzard have communicated in a number of ways that they wish to provide an environment where players and guilds get to choose their strategy instead of having aspects that become absolute necessities. Just read some of the information comming out about the 51 point BM talent for hunters, they want to provide tools that players can choose to use instead of it becoming compulsary. To this end, nerfing the mana return VT provides will ensure it will be useful but not so powerful that raids have no choice but to utilise it.

    In addition spriests are getting talents that further increase their mana pool, imp spirit tap and dispersion are just a couple off the top of my head and I bet we'll see spriest gear focus a lot more on spirit instead of mp/5. Throw in shadow fiends and the ability for the raid to throw you innervates and I doubt that spriests are going to be a class that worries too much about mana. As it stands mana is a resource spriests don't have to worry about, considering the game is based somewhat on resource management it's not a bad idea to get spriests thinking a bit more about how they use their mana.

    Lastly spriests aren't the only classes that are going to be receiving improved mana regeneration from talents and gear itemisation. You might find that 2% VT return is going to offer plenty in the new environment. I would also think that when enough testing is conducted that if 2% is found to be too little the number could be adjusted.


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