Hunters rejoice yet more good news!!

[Huggykaze]

ES doesn't get additional 15% crit from Sniper Training.

[Idt]

ES doesn't get additional 15% crit from Sniper Training.

i dont get imba crit news wrong

Increases the damage done by your Steady Shot, Aimed Shot and Explosive Shots by 6% if you are 30 yards or further from your target, and increases the critical strike chance of your Kill Shot ability by 15% on targets at or below 30% health.

link:http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=53304

[Spl4sh3r]

ok i am now officially completely psyched about survival.

if im not wrong if you get ES you will be replacing arcane shot with it..

so...
Survival

T.N.T - 15% to stun targets and 15% crit for your explosive shot.. also counting the fact that ES will hav bonuses from sniper training which is another 15%.. THATS 30%!?!?! HOLY SH!T!! + MT thats 40% and lets say you hav a base of 30% crit unbuffed thats 70% crit chance for ES at targets below 30 % HP!! and buffed you would probably get about 75-80%.. thats just too bloody awesome

Survival Instincts - you can now get it earlier in the tree so now no more speccing useless talents to progress. pure awesomeness

Lock and Load - This has to be by far one of the best new talents given to SV hunters along with T.N.T. 15% chance for stings to give you 3 free ES/AS? FRICKIN AWESOME? cosumes no ammo sounds pretty nice looks like their addressing some ammo issues. 100% chance from trap for 3 free ES/AS also.. that means if you start off on a boss with immo/bear trap you get 3 free ES/AS already.

Surefooted - Meh plus another 20% up to 50% less duration on movement impairing effects..I'd rather this be a resist but bleh.. better than nothing i guess

Hunter Vs. Wild - This seems pretty interesting but the way it is now I won't spec it. Careful Aim still gives you WAAAAAAY more AP than this and even though your pet gets some AP too.. i think the amount of AP you gain from Careful Aim might still be more... we shall just have to see based on itemization thats occuring in LK and whether they change this talent.. still pretty cool though.

Noxious Stings - It's way better tbh. they buffed it PvP wise. taking out the mana reduction still seems ok seeing how they did mention the mana coefficients and scaling for serpent sting was gonna be changed. HUGE PvP buff though but should apply to all stings yeh? im sure u guys agree on this part at least. Dispel viper sting? im sorry you hav it now :P

Explosive Shot - i think they nerfed the dmg on ES a bit but meh... they made a separate AoE dmg for it too which i dont really care much for.

Trap Mastery - This talent better be bloody good because its basically replacing our 11pt Talent - Skill. I foresee something like increase duration and resist mixed together but i hope not.

Beast Mastary
Separation Anxienty - this is a great buff for BM but meh i dont really care much for BM lol

Aspect Mastery - 1 pt to get 50% more AP from your AotH.. NICE (no im not being sarcastic)

Spirit Bond - Looks like more people will go Spirit Bond for raids i guess

Animal Handler - Looks like more people will go this for PvP :P

Path finding - Lol?

Marksmanship

Chimera Shot - As mentioned before.. this was to be expected

Rapid Recuperation - Seems interesting.. 150% mana returned = to dmg... that means if you crit for 2k you get 2.5k mana back seems pretty nice.. if you killed the target thus gaining rapid killing of course..



awesome changes... awesome changes.. indeed... overall there seems to be insane synergy going on with ES and the other talents imo.. hoping trap mastery will be not be something insanely stupid... also hoping they remove/change resourcefulness its still a really stupid talent imo

amen dude amen.. just wondering how long have you been survival? been like 3 yrs for me i think

Damn Rufix you were faster and this is correct not like you are writing Idt you wrote that Sniper Training gives 15% Critical Strike to Explosive Shot and no, just 6% more damage. Also learn to count 150% of 2000 = 2000*1.5 = 3000 :P
Also they didn't really nerf the damage on Explosive Shot since they had removed the instant damage it gave before so they buffed it when they added it again and the new talent gave it even more damage with 15% Critical Strike.

About the Hunter vs. Wild I'm not really sure how much this will give. Since we will have new gear in WotLK and not sure if we get more stamina or more intellect there. Seeing atm I got around 50% of my stamina as intellect (around 500 stam and 250 int) I would agree that Careful Aim is better, but why not have both?

[Idt]

i think what is really interesting is how they are trying to increase the synergy with stings in survival.. blizz REALLY wants you to use serpent stings which means the coefficients for serpent sting is gonna be overhauled into usefulness. so before anyone else QQs about the loss of reduced mana cost in Potent Venom ( now Noxious Stings) look at the other talent such as lock and load which features stings.. now with stings applied you are gonna see a REALLY REALLY huge buff in the amount of dmg you do

[Idt]

Damn Rufix you were faster and this is correct not like you are writing Idt you wrote that Sniper Training gives 15% Critical Strike to Explosive Shot and no, just 6% more damage. Also learn to count 150% of 2000 = 2000*1.5 = 3000 :P
Also they didn't really nerf the damage on Explosive Shot since they had removed the instant damage it gave before so they buffed it when they added it again and the new talent gave it even more damage with 15% Critical Strike.

About the Hunter vs. Wild I'm not really sure how much this will give. Since we will have new gear in WotLK and not sure if we get more stamina or more intellect there. Seeing atm I got around 50% of my stamina as intellect (around 500 stam and 250 int) I would agree that Careful Aim is better, but why not have both?

dude im tired!! sorry if i get my maths wrong lol

and no you and rufix are still wrong.. ES gets 15% crit to targets BELOW 30% hp i put it in bold and underlined so the world can see it.. also linked it here and just checked the WoW official talent calculator here... like i said..

i dont get imba crit news wrong

Increases the damage done by your Steady Shot, Aimed Shot and Explosive Shots by 6% if you are 30 yards or further from your target, and increases the critical strike chance of your Kill Shot ability by 15% on targets at or below 30% health.

link:http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=53304

official calculators : http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/.../talents2.html

[Spl4sh3r]

I still want the 30% reduced mana cost on Serpent Sting to come back That would reduce the cost with 203 mana at the top rank (at level 79) But the new damage coefficient I'm already happy with, since if I had my current gear on level 79 Serpent Sting would deal around 4173 damage

Haha just saw your new post Idt, I know you are tired but to point out how you are wrong

"Increases the damage done by your Steady Shot, Aimed Shot and Explosive Shots by 6% if you are 30 yards or further from your target, and increases the critical strike chance of your Kill shot ability by 15% on targets at or below 30% health."

EDIT: Now that I had it on my mind again I will also note that Hunting Party is back to old form with 100% chance on crit

[Huggykaze]

Spl4sh3r despite l33t nick, you were faster

OMG rly... on official calcs:

Increases dmg done by your Steady, Aimed and Explosive by 6% if your 30+yrds from target, AND increases the crit chance of your KILL SHOT by 15%... i think meaning is clear...

Explosive ticks 3 times tru?

Also as for stamina/int I think we can get 400int and ~650sta easly:P, what we need to count is if we get more than 200AP from HvW cus otherwise it's rather good to take imp. Mark 3/3 instead 1/3, unless you will put 3 points in Hunting party instead of max

[Spl4sh3r]

Explosive Shot won't tick for 3 times. It will do initial damage to the target you are targetting then tick 2 times as AoE

EDIT: Comment about int/sta I think we will reach 700 stam and around 500 int

[Huggykaze]

so it's nerf o.O but w8 it's stupid, they said it is supposed to be unchanneled "arcane missles", so change like that would completly destroy the concept...

[Idt]

I still want the 30% reduced mana cost on Serpent Sting to come back That would reduce the cost with 203 mana at the top rank (at level 79) But the new damage coefficient I'm already happy with, since if I had my current gear on level 79 Serpent Sting would deal around 4173 damage

Haha just saw your new post Idt, I know you are tired but to point out how you are wrong

"Increases the damage done by your Steady Shot, Aimed Shot and Explosive Shots by 6% if you are 30 yards or further from your target, and increases the critical strike chance of your Kill shot ability by 15% on targets at or below 30% health."

EDIT: Now that I had it on my mind again I will also note that Hunting Party is back to old form with 100% chance on crit

ah fug it kill shot + 15% crit no ES.. lol..2 hours of sleep and 30++ hours awake will make you think yur right like me... >.<

[Spl4sh3r]

so it's nerf o.O but w8 it's stupid, they said it is supposed to be unchanneled "arcane missles", so change like that would completly destroy the concept...

It's nerfed even tho they added a talent to increase crit% with 15??

[Huggykaze]

it's not so great deal anyway... 50%crit for now on 6sec CD and 500dmg is 8120dmg in a minute vs 35%crit and 500dmg x3 and 20000 dmg in a minute...

Just example values...

[Idt]

you didnt factor in crit chance which is unfactorable.. what i mean is that you didnt factor in the additional dmg gained from having 15% more crit over that of 35%

[Spl4sh3r]

Rufix count all data when you do like that it's 500dmg + 100dmg x2 every 6 second is around 7000dmg and "un-nerfed" it's 500dmg x3 every 6 second is 15000dmg.
Hmm how are you counting anyway?

EDIT: I also read that each tick can crit?

[Huggykaze]

i did. Normally new ES will do 5k dmg within a minute just from initial ticks. now 50% from that is 2.5k than add dmg from aoe component... even if aoe part can crit it's still ~11k less.

As for old it's 15k within 60sec and 35% (~1/3) to crit so ~20k... crit is raw % increase of dmg, I think that's obvious.

EDIT: uh kinda bad counting with DoT part. Tru it's ~7000dmg without critting, 50% crit chance is 50%increase in dmg done. so it gives us 10.5k vs 20k anyway not too much:P

[Spl4sh3r]

Oh, thought you didn't count the crit so then it's like this (if crit is 200% meaning without mortal shots)

This part is without crits on each tick

7000dmg is without any crits on 10 shots so at 35% (+15% of talents which means 50%) then 5 shots will crit so around 9500dmg

15000dmg is same as above 10 shots with 35% shots (the un-nerfed didn't have 15% extra crit) so 3 shots will crit means 16500dmg

EDIT: gonna count each tick crit :P

With tick crits it will be like

7000dmg from 10 shots and 20 ticks with 50% crit is around 7500dmg from shots and 3000 from ticks === 10500dmg

15000dmg from 10 shots and 20 ticks with 35% crit is around 6500dmg from shots and 13000dmg from ticks === 19500dmg (means i was wrong above which is changed now tho)

[Huggykaze]

50% from 7k is 3.5k:P

[Spl4sh3r]

Lol I will think clear like Idt

EDIT: Just noticed I wrote right, but you didn't follow my math path....the over part was without crit ticks meaning the whole 7000dmg didn't crit 50% only the initial damage which was 5000dmg (+ 2000 tick dmg) and 50% of 5000 is 2500 which is 7500 (+ 2000 tick dmg)

Lol almost wrote I would use Multishot instead, then I remembered can use both??

[Huggykaze]

ah let's hope we still get 3x same dmg as initial tick does+explosive aoe... bad we have to w8 for next build for some1 with beta acces to confirm this...

[Idt]

Lol I will think clear like Idt

EDIT: Just noticed I wrote right, but you didn't follow my math path....the over part was without crit ticks meaning the whole 7000dmg didn't crit 50% only the initial damage which was 5000dmg (+ 2000 tick dmg) and 50% of 5000 is 2500 which is 7500 (+ 2000 tick dmg)

Lol almost wrote I would use Multishot instead, then I remembered can use both??

im so tired all that math basically destroyed me lol