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  1. #1

    Imp Hammer of Justice

    This is a talent that is taken by most pvp specs,

    and i would assume that you want it lower in the tree so it can actually be used by holy/ret builds or ret/prot builds
    or even holy/prot builds

    i would suggest it gets placed where redoubt is and redoubt and shield Spec get pushed down 1 tier

  2. #2

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    I'd definitely love it a bit further up the tree.

    Another thing that bugs me is that you have a spare point (that most of the time ends up in toughness) when you're trying to work your way down to it.

    Should probably post it in the suggestion forums, though.
    Served steaming hot, right out of the waffle grill. With just the right amount of STFU poured on top.

  3. #3

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    id like to hear what others think first before i get ahead of myself

    realistically, holy pallys are going to want to go Holy/Ret all the way to Sheath of light i would think
    for the Heal over time effect for pvp
    and ret pallys are going to want imp hammer, aswell as the rest of their top tier talents like righteous vengence and art of war for pvp
    i would think paladins who dont go with imp hammer would be left very vunerable with only 2 interupts each minute. unless your blood elf.

  4. #4

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    You're right. Its just one of those must-have things - but it really forces you into a cookie-cutter because its so far down the tree.
    Served steaming hot, right out of the waffle grill. With just the right amount of STFU poured on top.

  5. #5

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Actually it's not the only reason to go down, Divine guardian is important as well since it will pop a 30% to all the members of your arena team when bubble is up. So, in my opinion it will be cool if they swap tier 4 with 3 in the prot tree.
    YOU FACE NOT MALCHEZAR ALONE, BUT THE LEGIONS I COMMAND!

  6. #6

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    i donno about you... but there is not much time for standing near other people in arena
    especially with the recent inclusion of bulk melee cleave teams
    but that's what i find most of the time anyways
    and you do not seem to be standing close to people for very long if i get a chance, cept the warrior i am following.

    i also cannot see myself using Divine guardian because i find pallys need to be aggressive in pvp as holy or ret, or you just get countered by druid healer teams so easily

  7. #7

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    imo imp hoj is definetly a ret talent , and its stupid that you have to put in 18 points in prot to get it . cause prot pallys do much reactive dmg and stunning mobs is in instances also only possibly at trash mobs ..

  8. #8

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by NoodlesRomanof
    i donno about you... but there is not much time for standing near other people in arena
    especially with the recent inclusion of bulk melee cleave teams
    but that's what i find most of the time anyways
    and you do not seem to be standing close to people for very long if i get a chance, cept the warrior i am following.

    i also cannot see myself using Divine guardian because i find pallys need to be aggressive in pvp as holy or ret, or you just get countered by druid healer teams so easily
    Dude it has a 30 yards radio :P
    YOU FACE NOT MALCHEZAR ALONE, BUT THE LEGIONS I COMMAND!

  9. #9

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Esra
    imo imp hoj is definetly a ret talent , and its stupid that you have to put in 18 points in prot to get it . cause prot pallys do much reactive dmg and stunning mobs is in instances also only possibly at trash mobs ..
    Imp. Hammer of Justice is also one of the best talents a PVP Retribution Paladin has, thus the fact that it is that high up in the tree actually makes sense.

    Besides, it's not as if the other talents you pick on your way to Imp. HoJ are not worth it.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  10. #10

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Rawberry
    Besides, it's not as if the other talents you pick on your way to Imp. HoJ are not worth it.
    This is true. But reiterating my concern, I think it just gives Ret a very cookie-cutter feeling. You really have very little flexibility on what talents to pick. You'll find that the talents that people forsake in Ret to get enough points to get to Imp. HoJ are the same, which are obviously the weakest in the link - this will lead to having a mighty Paladin clone army, which already kinda exists.

    It kinda reminds me of when Imp. AE was a mage talent, along with Evo. Pretty much everyone had to work into Arcane for those things, regardless of what they wanted to do.

    If HoJ was further up, you could choose to dabble in a bit of Holy, or just work further down Prot for those nice talents, or sacrifice less in Ret. There would be some choice.
    Served steaming hot, right out of the waffle grill. With just the right amount of STFU poured on top.

  11. #11

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Imp HoJ you're saying is a necessity to Ret Pally's in PvP, yet for 2v2 I'm Planning on running ShS rogue/ret pally (as I currently do) and am going to spec 0/8/63, because the initial burst from both of us while the target is stunlocked for a good 12 secs is enough to kill it, whereas if you spec into imp HoJ there you lose out on burst dmg. yet for 3v3 I plan on getting imp Hoj. But really it's not a necessity unless you need it for the setup you run for 2v2, 3v3, or 5v5. (well actually in 5v5 I'd say you 100% need to get it)

  12. #12

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Paladonious:

    You are aware that you pretty much said nothing in that garbled paragraph, right?

    Let  me paraphrase:

    Imp HoJ is not a necessity because I can get a rogue to do stuns for me! But in all other situations I'd take it, because its full of love.

    For any ability in the world, you can make a situation where it is useless.

    "Oh, yeah... we can breathe air, but I don't care about that because I'll be diving deep in a swimming pool tuesday and its full of water and no air!"
    Served steaming hot, right out of the waffle grill. With just the right amount of STFU poured on top.

  13. #13

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by ROFLWaffles
    But reiterating my concern, I think it just gives Ret a very cookie-cutter feeling.
    I see your point but, PVP is all about efficiency and there are just so many true PVP builds for every class.

    Whatever class you have, or whatever your talent tree might look like your choice in PVP specs will always seem to lack originality as the chances are slim that you will discover a talent build that noone has ever seen / used before.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  14. #14

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Paladonious
    Imp HoJ you're saying is a necessity to Ret Pally's in PvP, yet for 2v2 I'm Planning on running ShS rogue/ret pally (as I currently do) and am going to spec 0/8/63, because the initial burst from both of us while the target is stunlocked for a good 12 secs is enough to kill it, whereas if you spec into imp HoJ there you lose out on burst dmg. yet for 3v3 I plan on getting imp Hoj. But really it's not a necessity unless you need it for the setup you run for 2v2, 3v3, or 5v5. (well actually in 5v5 I'd say you 100% need to get it)
    Or you could just spec 20/41 with Imp. Hammer of Justice and become elite like the rest of us?

    You could Hammer of Justice right after your Rogues Cheap Shot, allowing him to Expose Armor and build up combo points for whenever your Hammer runs off.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  15. #15

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    I am 0/20/41 right now, but I won't be in WotLK. for 2's that is.
    And for my garbled paragraph before, I just woke up literally 10 minutes ago, so give me a break, lol.

  16. #16

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    You guys realise on beta imp hammer of justice reduces cooldown by 30 secs not 15. ANd it stack with pvp 4 set bonus. So yeah you will be taking it

  17. #17

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Athor
    You guys realise on beta imp hammer of justice reduces cooldown by 30 secs not 15. ANd it stack with pvp 4 set bonus. So yeah you will be taking it
    I like to think I've looked into most of the information on this site, but I've not seen anything to do with lvl80 pvp set bonuses. If thats the case then by the God's Paladins will be a force to reckon with in the arena. My my, a stun for 6 (7 with glyph) every 20 secs or so would just be the cherry on the very juicy ret cake.

    Armoury Link

    Nil desperandum! Always follow the Light

  18. #18

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by naypalmacus
    I like to think I've looked into most of the information on this site, but I've not seen anything to do with lvl80 pvp set bonuses. If thats the case then by the God's Paladins will be a force to reckon with in the arena. My my, a stun for 6 (7 with glyph) every 20 secs or so would just be the cherry on the very juicy ret cake.
    They're talking about the level 70 set bonuses, which many of the beta players still use.

  19. #19

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Athor
    You guys realise on beta imp hammer of justice reduces cooldown by 30 secs not 15. ANd it stack with pvp 4 set bonus. So yeah you will be taking it
    this

    and that (or something like that) will be the most upcommon ret built... ~~~~

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

    and yea... imp hoj is a must have talent and 20sec cd (except the bonus) would be cute :x

    but u guys complain about the wrong thing... 1 question left... i think hoj requires a change... is it only me or DO anyelse think it does?? ... I'm curious if some looks behind my doubt... think about hunger of blood... and the left efficiency on pvp.......

  20. #20

    Re: Imp Hammer of Justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Æika
    this

    and that (or something like that) will be the most upcommon ret built... ~~~~

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

    and yea... imp hoj is a must have talent and 20sec cd (except the bonus) would be cute :x

    but u guys complain about the wrong thing... 1 question left... i think hoj requires a change... is it only me or DO anyelse think it does?? ... I'm curious if some looks behind my doubt... think about hunger of blood... and the left efficiency on pvp.......
    as far as spec goes...

    HANDS DOWN this is my spec and prolly the build ill see everyone going in arena. losing 4 percent weapon damage and the ability to remove a stun effect for the 5/5 fanatism so i can garantee a crit on my STUNNed target with imp hoj.
    also i wont need the art of war since new stoicism and the new meta gem for an additional 15 percent stun reduction length.(45 percent total)
    5/5 fanatism heavily out weights art of war atm, especially if u want those crits to also heal in the arena if shit does hit the fan with your partner.
    http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/...13533105201051

    and i almost forgot about divine gaurdian, which is also not needed. have you all forgotten about hand of protection now!? and hand of sacrifice?!?! the mechanics of these have been changed and are QUITE effective. no need to improve a 5 minute cd ><
    Xphius 80 Paladin
    Xanxic 80 Druid
    Xzain 80 DeathKnight
    Karvex 80 Hunter

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