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  1. #21

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    I'm remarking on the fact that seal of cammond judged does double dmg to both stunned and incapicitated targets.

  2. #22

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    I'm still loling at the guy who suggested 15-second repentance. :

  3. #23

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tickspoon
    I'm still loling at the guy who suggested 15-second repentance. :
    What I said was having a talent that lowers the cooldown shouldn't be a problem. I didn’t say we needed 15 sec repentance. Actually, I feel the opposite.

    What I am trying to figure out is how making repentance have a lower cooldown is much different from adding a movement impairing effect spell and a silence. Which, I have read on the wrath forums several times.

    Im not saying holy pallies should be able to permanently cc. What I am saying is ret pallies want to be able to interrupt and get to mobs more easily, so why not adjust the spells you have instead of bulking the ret tree with even more stuff.....

    If a 10 sec. CC on a 15 sec cooldown is too much, how about a 5 sec cc on that cooldown. Personaly I would rather be able to use repentance more for a lower duration. This would allow DPS pallies to deal with some unbalanced spells other classes are currently able to do in live.

    So… how about this.

    Improved repentance (In place of current repentance)
    Extends the length of your repentance on PVE targets to 60 sec. Also, lowers the Cooldown by 15 sec, and the duration by 5 sec.

    This would allow for the occasional interrupt/cc from a holy paly while still giving more on demand utility to the ret pallies.
    WTB Spell/Grammer check?

  4. #24

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adamonious
    I would agree with you that Paladins do not need any type of cc if every other hybrid didn't have one. As my Idea stands it is nowhere near as powerfull as cyclone or priest fear on the healer side of things. And our hammer of justice and Repentance are nothing close to a rogues stun, gouge, sap, blind, kiddney shot, and kick.

    Given all the utility other classes have buffing this spell isn't OP at all.

    Also due to deminishing returns I don't think the 15 sec cooldown is going to have as big of an effect as you thing. Think about a sheep that has no cooldown at all and lasts longer. Rarely do I see someone sheeped an entire match...

    Also, I am not so confidant that they aren't going to be nerfing our dps. I wouldn't count on them letting us kill a healing in 10 sec.....
    Keep in mind, that sheep heals the target to 100% in a few seconds. You should also remember, that sheep often is disspelled

    Ret palas have enough CC, and its only fair that it has a pretty long CD. A good geared Retardin, can nearly kill a clothie in 2 seconds, if all your shit is critting or proccing. If you had a CC compared to a lock or mage, then you would be extremely OP

    And yes, Rogues rely on all the stun and slowing shit. Do you realy want a Retardin, which can burst a target for 8k+ dmg in a sec, with the same control as a rogue?

    Paladins also have a lot of escape options, like Freedom, DS and BoP, Retribution palas would simply not be killable, if they do what you suggest.

    The class is working fine and is viable, when blizz fix their DPS.

  5. #25

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Also keep in mind the ability to have a 15sec cd on HoJ through spec and the current Arena 4pc set bonus.

  6. #26

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eurotrip
    Keep in mind, that sheep heals the target to 100% in a few seconds. You should also remember, that sheep often is disspelled

    Ret palas have enough CC, and its only fair that it has a pretty long CD. A good geared Retardin, can nearly kill a clothie in 2 seconds, if all your shit is critting or proccing. If you had a CC compared to a lock or mage, then you would be extremely OP

    And yes, Rogues rely on all the stun and slowing shit. Do you realy want a Retardin, which can burst a target for 8k+ dmg in a sec, with the same control as a rogue?

    Paladins also have a lot of escape options, like Freedom, DS and BoP, Retribution palas would simply not be killable, if they do what you suggest.

    The class is working fine and is viable, when blizz fix their DPS.
    every class has there unique fighting style, rogues for example(as you said) stun/slow with there damage and mages cc/slow if frost with there damage as well. Paladins on the other hand are more about being anti-cc and damage.
    If i wanted to keep the examples going i could say warlocks are cc/debuffs and there damage. Although i will hand you that some of the mechanics are kinda broken. BUT do not ask for MORE cc or stun on a paladin when thats not what paladin are.
    If anything i would be more concerned about our anti-cc spells/abilities and what are options are to counter others cc effects.
    ( this is plain to see of our fighting ways by looking at stoicosm,art of war and ALL our hand spells. this is our way of controlling the situation of countering others cc/slow/stun)
    Xphius 80 Paladin
    Xanxic 80 Druid
    Xzain 80 DeathKnight
    Karvex 80 Hunter

  7. #27

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    As i look at what i wrote i can help to think, that is the only true thing the paladin has over any other class.
    The ability to counter almost all cc/stun/slow effects now.
    I still think it needs a little work like stopping cyclone or getting rid of it(hell cant even bubble out of it).
    or the lack of ablities to stop ourselves from being stunned quite a bit. (they have made drastic improvements)

    But all in all, we are the anti-cc class, so why ask for cc ><
    ask for better/more anti-cc instead.
    Xphius 80 Paladin
    Xanxic 80 Druid
    Xzain 80 DeathKnight
    Karvex 80 Hunter

  8. #28

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    I agree with exphius. Ret paladins should be seen a counter balance in pvp. They should buff everyone in the group while at the same time getting rid the debuffs that slow the group down. We make the group more efficient and I believe that Blizzard should give us more utilities to do so.

  9. #29

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Challenger
    I agree with exphius. Ret paladins should be seen a counter balance in pvp. They should buff everyone in the group while at the same time getting rid the debuffs that slow the group down. We make the group more efficient and I believe that Blizzard should give us more utilities to do so.
    XD atleast theres a few people out there that see the paladin role the same way i do.
    Xphius 80 Paladin
    Xanxic 80 Druid
    Xzain 80 DeathKnight
    Karvex 80 Hunter

  10. #30

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rawberry
    Not accounting for Diminishing Returns a Warlock and Mage can do the same, cooms.
    YEAH! I want to be able to do shit in Ice Block though. Yo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokann
    They thought for some reason I would be as viable for tanking as a soggy piece of toast, while a paladin or warrior would be an incredible fortress with cannons specially designed to hold threat.

  11. #31

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    then give us Holy Snap and you have a deal

  12. #32

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Sometimes i wonder if anyone even reads the forums except the name of the thread.
    Look though at what people have already said.

    Rawberry-
    "I agree that the Paladin has not enough (reliable) CC, but then again not all classes are ment to be CC classes. The Paladin is indeed CC invalid, and this should remain to be the fact."

    and my addition to that

    "every class has there unique fighting style, rogues for example(as you said) stun/slow with there damage and mages cc/slow if frost with there damage as well. Paladins on the other hand are more about being anti-cc and damage.
    If i wanted to keep the examples going i could say warlocks are cc/debuffs and there damage. Although i will hand you that some of the mechanics are kinda broken. BUT do not ask for MORE cc or stun on a paladin when thats not what paladin are.
    If anything i would be more concerned about our anti-cc spells/abilities and what are options are to counter others cc effects.
    ( this is plain to see of our fighting ways by looking at stoicosm,art of war and ALL our hand spells. this is our way of controlling the situation of countering others cc/slow/stun)"
    "That is the only true thing the paladin has over any other class.
    The ability to counter almost all cc/stun/slow effects now.
    I still think it needs a little work like stopping cyclone or getting rid of it(hell cant even bubble out of it).
    or the lack of ablities to stop ourselves from being stunned quite a bit. (they have made drastic improvements)

    But all in all, we are the anti-cc class, so why ask for cc ><
    ask for better/more anti-cc instead."

    Xphius 80 Paladin
    Xanxic 80 Druid
    Xzain 80 DeathKnight
    Karvex 80 Hunter

  13. #33

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    I gotta say as the original poster I am really surprised by the response to this. Its not that I have a lack of understanding on the subject, I have been playing a pally a while myself, but its most likely because I never did get a beta key.

    I can see where the lower stun cooldown would def change the dynamic of ret pally damage and control. Also, I can see where many people currently feel their needs are being met in pvp, even against the harder to kill healers, as things stand in beta. I trust the testers and if you still think we can handle healers as good as a warrior or rogue after our damage is nerfed then cool.

    I gotta say though that the cooldown argument was really secondary. Wanting to make Repentance a baseline skill was def my primary goal. They did this with cyclone and it really helped out the druids in the arenas later on. I have both healed and Dpsed in Arena, and to often I feel like every other healer is controlling the crap outa me while I stand there buff my dpser and heal. Im sorry, I don't feel like Blessing of Freedom=cyclone on a balance perspective.

    Anywho, If you guys are satisfied with repentance the way it is I will be too....
    WTB Spell/Grammer check?

  14. #34

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adamonious
    I gotta say as the original poster I am really surprised by the response to this. Its not that I have a lack of understanding on the subject, I have been playing a pally a while myself, but its most likely because I never did get a beta key.

    I can see where the lower stun cooldown would def change the dynamic of ret pally damage and control. Also, I can see where many people currently feel their needs are being met in pvp, even against the harder to kill healers, as things stand in beta. I trust the testers and if you still think we can handle healers as good as a warrior or rogue after our damage is nerfed then cool.

    I gotta say though that the cooldown argument was really secondary. Wanting to make Repentance a baseline skill was def my primary goal. They did this with cyclone and it really helped out the druids in the arenas later on. I have both healed and Dpsed in Arena, and to often I feel like every other healer is controlling the crap outa me while I stand there buff my dpser and heal. Im sorry, I don't feel like Blessing of Freedom=cyclone on a balance perspective.

    Anywho, If you guys are satisfied with repentance the way it is I will be too....
    I shall be the first person to admit, that Holy Palas preform very bad in arenas atm. I understand and agree about what your saying, but making rependence trainable isnt the answer. Im not totaly sure about he new holy talents, but if i remember correct, you can pick a talent, which reduce silence and smiliar effects on the paladin. I realy hope blizz will fix holy paladins in PvP, but i doubt they get major changes.

    About killing healers:
    All classes have some classes they preform bad against, and its hard for some classes to kill healers 1v1. Mages dont stand a chance against fx. Disc Priests or basically any healer except paladins.
    I doubt Moonkins can kill a Disc Priest too, and I guess warlocks can have a hard time too. Your not alone as Ret pala




  15. #35

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Repentance is more than fine. What you're suggesting is way, way, way overpowered.

    Paladins have glaring flaws for PvP, but Repentance is a tool that is very powerful as is - doesn't need to be more powerful than that.
    Served steaming hot, right out of the waffle grill. With just the right amount of STFU poured on top.

  16. #36

    Re: Someone please suggest a repentance fix.

    Repetance is more than fine as it is, 10 sec in PVP is more than good. On live now I only use repetance to force someone to trinket, usualy on the healer, when my target is low on health i trow a repent on the healer, so he must trinket to heal his parter.

    and 10 sec will be time enought to kill someone also.

    what they could do to improve repetance, is maybe reduce its CD if the target resists.


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